The Murder of Trayvon Martin

[DrPhil]

And if people insist on overstating this obvious point, we need to keep it honest. This is not a discussion of everyone dressing in the manner in which they want to be received. This is about minority groups dressing in the manner in which they want to be received even if that requires going above and beyond the call of duty (it typically does).

That is not a new concept. But turning this issue into a discussion of Black male attire is a delightful distraction that serves to go beyond precipitation and into victim blame. "If only he had not worn that" is based on a probably false assumption that Martin would not have been pursued had he not worn a hoodie. This story would have probably ended the same had he had an umbrella in the rain or without anything covering his head.

[christiangirl]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

That is not a new concept. But turning this issue into a discussion of Black male attire is a delightful distraction that serves to go beyond precipitation and into victim blame.

No, it doesn't. It means that there are multiple aspects to this issue and the discussion is allowed to have multiple layers. Speaking of attire, stereotypes, and perceptions is not a distraction from the issue (at least in this thread) but rather a seperate conversation alongside the main issue (as most threadjacks are) and, as has been stated way more times than necessary, discussing the hows and whys of stereotyping in no way means that anyone here is blaming the victim.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by christiangirl

No, it doesn't. It means that there are multiple aspects to this issue and the discussion is allowed to have multiple layers. Speaking of attire, stereotypes, and perceptions is not a distraction from the issue (at least in this thread) but rather a seperate conversation alongside the main issue (as most threadjacks are) and, as has been stated way more times than necessary, discussing the hows and whys of stereotyping in no way means that anyone here is blaming the victim.

As I have said before, overstating this obvious point has gotten away from the main point. The separate conversation has become the main conversation. In overstating the correlates to the issue, people have become perplexed as to whom they want to blame (even if Zimmerman is not brought up on charges).

Just as if this was a GC discussion of an alleged rape victim and perpetrator. A brief mention of what the victim was wearing would suffice--and even that would get an eyebrow raise from those who believe rape victims are never victim precipitators. If there were two GC pages on what the alleged rape victim was wearing or doing, it would be interpreted as forcing the alleged victim to share the blame with the perpetrator. If only that rape victim had not worn that sexy outfit and had that "come hither...my sex is awesome" look on her or his face. For generations courts have torn (alleged) rape victims apart by talking about their past (i.e., discussing what Trayvon Martin has been doing at school) and what the alleged rape victims were doing or wearing at the time that encouraged the alleged attack (i.e., discussing what Trayvon Martin was wearing when walking around a neighborhood in the rain). If that is not acceptable as far as people are concerned, neither is where this discussion of Trayvon Martin has gone.

I surely hope that the outfit I wear to the gym and to the grocery store afterwards does not confuse people and invite something. I typically look younger than my age and not as educated and occupationally attained as I am---I may look like a thug or even a sex kitten with an afro or a twist-set. To avoid that, I will print out a handout of my resume` and introduce myself as "Dr." to everyone in my nearest vicinity--just in case!!! This will be fun!!!

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

As I have said before, ovestating this obvious point has gotten away from the main point. The separate conversation has become the main conversation. In overstating the correlates to the issue, people have become perplexed as to whom they want to blame (even if Zimmerman is not brought up on charges).

Just as if this was a GC discussion of an alleged rape victim and perpetrator. A brief mention of what the victim was wearing would suffice--and even that would get an eyebrow raise from those who believe rape victims are never victim precipitators. If there were two GC pages on what the alleged rape victim was wearing or doing, it would be interpreted as forcing the alleged victim to share the blame with the perpetrator. If only that rape victim had not worn that sexy outfit and had that "come hither...my sex is awesome" look on her or his face. For generations courts have torn (alleged) rape victims apart by talking about their past (i.e., discussing what Trayvon Martin has been doing at school) and what the alleged rape victims were doing or wearing at the time that encouraged the alleged attack (i.e., discussing what Trayvon Martin was wearing when walking around a neighborhood in the rain). If that is not acceptable as far as people are concerned, neither is where this discussion of Trayvon Martin has gone.

I surely hope that the outfit I wear to the gym and to the grocery store afterwards does not confuse people and invite something. I typically look younger than my age and not as educated and occupationally attained as I am---I may look like a thug or even a sex kitten with an afro or a twist-set. To avoid that, I will print out a handout of my resume` and introduce myself as "Dr." to everyone in my nearest vicinity--just in case!!! This will be fun!!!

Amen. I also firmly believe that the hoodie had nothing to do with it. George Zimmerman would have found ANY black male, regardless of age or clothing, walking through his neighborhood suspicious. He didn't know him so OBVIOUSLY Martin was up to no good. The hoodie IS a distraction and an excuse. Hell, if I had on a hoodie and it was raining outside, you bet I'd pull that hood over my head. There is something wrong with a person's ability to reason if THAT is suspicious. PERIOD.

Now, I will agree that people discriminate based on many things, but are you really going to live your life trying to avoid that? As someone pointed out Malcolm X and Martin Luther King, Jr were both shot and killed, but they were wearing suits. You can't win at this game.

[DrPhil]

Zimmerman's previous calls as Neighborhood Watch have been relatively shortly and quickly scrutinized; Trayvon Martin's previous run ins with the school and his hoodie have been scrutinized ad nauseam; and now Zimmerman's past with the po-po is being examined:

Originally Posted by MSNBC.com Article

Zimmerman accused of domestic violence, fighting with a police officer

Orange County Sheriff's Office
George Zimmerman is pictured in this booking photo taken in July 2005.


By msnbc.com staff
Court documents obtained by msnbc.com on Tuesday evening show that George Zimmerman, who fatally shot 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, went to court in 2005 and 2006 for accusations of domestic violence, tussling with a police officer and speeding.

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...police-officer

Oh snap! Billy Badass among us! Maybe Trayvon's hoodie-was-all-goodie!!

I have to laugh because WHOWOULDATHUNK the photo of Zimmerman in the orange polo was a booking photo from 2005. I thought it looked like a booking photo but I told myself "self, surely that would not be what it looks like because Zimmerman's prior run-ins with the law were never an issue...right?" This booking photo has been allllll over the media in the past few weeks (with exception for a nonbooking photo that is occasionally shown). Did anyone wonder why the hell it looks like a booking photo?

[PeppyGPhiB]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

I have to laugh because WHOWOULDATHUNK the photo of Zimmerman in the orange polo was a booking photo from 2005. I thought it looked like a booking photo but I told myself "self, surely that would not be what it looks like because Zimmerman's prior run-ins with the law were never an issue...right?" This booking photo has been allllll over the media in the past few weeks (with exception for a nonbooking photo that is occasionally shown). Did anyone wonder why the hell it looks like a booking photo?

It could have just as easily been a driver's license photo, which is what I thought it was. I do question how he was able to get a concealed weapons permit with a prior arrest for domestic violence and an altercation with police.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by PeppyGPhiB

It could have just as easily been a driver's license photo, which is what I thought it was. I do question how he was able to get a concealed weapons permit with a prior arrest for domestic violence and an altercation with police.

That's a good point about the concealed weapons permit. I do not know how it works in Florida.

It does look like it could be a driver's license photo but would they be able to obtain his driver's license photo beyond asking Zimmerman for his driver's license? Serious question, I really don't know.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by CrashTestPelosi

Most likely. Why are most black neighborhoods, crime infested ghettos?

Can you list any black neighborhood that is neat, clean, safe and has good schools?

If you can name a good black neighborhood then most likely it is a neighborhood with no public housing. The handful of good blacks are capitalists.

Why do affluent blacks all move to white neighborhoods? Affluent blacks want to live in white neighborhoods for the same reason that whites want to live in white neighborhoods.

You need to go away. Seriously. Like right now.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by CrashTestPelosi

The real problem is blacks commit too many crimes. Whites move to gated communities to get away from blacks.

Zimmerman's mistake was not wearing a hoodie. If he was wearing a hoodie then nobody would even care about the shooting.

Thousands of innocent blacks are killed each year by hoodie wearing thugs and no rallies for them. Why is that?

Originally Posted by CrashTestPelosi

Most likely. Why are most black neighborhoods, crime infested ghettos?

Can you list any black neighborhood that is neat, clean, safe and has good schools?

If you can name a good black neighborhood then most likely it is a neighborhood with no public housing. The handful of good blacks are capitalists.

Why do affluent blacks all move to white neighborhoods? Affluent blacks want to live in white neighborhoods for the same reason that whites want to live in white neighborhoods.

Hi Max. Long time no troll.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by CrashTestPelosi

Can you answer my question?

LOL. C'mon, you know you don't really want an answer. And you know you'll be banned before you can wrap your head around any answers anyway.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by CrashTestPelosi

Can you list a black neighborhood that is neat, clean, safe and has good schools?

Off the top of my head, there's the Wildwood neighborhood in OKC. It's a relic of a segregated past, but it's a pretty affluent primarily black neighborhood in NE Oklahoma City.

Tulsa used to have such an area as well. It was burned down by angry whites in a race riot though...