Ethnic diversity: North vs. South

[Sistermadly]

Originally Posted by SoCalGirl

I agree with the thought that the longer your family has been in the states the more likely that you're not ethnic any more.

I'm thinking this is really only an option for people who are of European stock. At some point in American history, folks of European descent were just lumped together under the more generic "white" banner, and therefore they may be less likely to identify with their original ethnic heritage.

But for those of us of a duskier hue, it becomes a little more difficult to disassociate oneself from your ethnic heritage. Like I said earlier, my folks have been in the US since at least 1800, and I still consider myself Black.

People of color can assimilate into a culture, but unless they intermarry with whites and "bleach out" (for lack of a better term), they can't ever really stop being ethnic.

[SoCalGirl]

I agree with your point that skin color ultimately wins out. 'Cause just cause you're black it doesn't mean you don't have European roots and just cause you're white it doesn't mean that none of your ancestors came from Africa.

Plus with being black in America I honestly think that there's an even quicker tendency to assume an undefined African slave history. My best friend's father's side of the family is from Antigua so there's no American slave history there. Two guys I work with are black but their fathers are from Panama. Again, no American slave history. I think it would suck to grow up in the US learning "all your ancestors" came from slavery when you know full well they didn't!

[shinerbock]

In my experience, the NPHC groups just aren't as present at some of the SEC schools. You know they exist, but they just really don't have that much involvement in the "greek community"

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by Sistermadly

Well, there were Scotch-Irish slaveowners who owned my ancestors and gave me my last name, but it's not like I celebrate Robbie Burns and St. Patrick's Day.

(My father's side of the family can trace its roots back to early 1800s Georgia. Even though we're not white, I'd say that makes us pretty darned Southern.)

My family name is possibly Jewish-Irish-Cherokee(?) whose slaveowners were of the Bruce Plantation in Alabama and migrated to Quincy, Florida. And that's my father side. My mother's side is Georgia and her genetic father is full-blooded Irish, but that is not what is stated on her birth certificate.

Hayle my birth certificate states "NEGRO" for definition of race.

Originally Posted by SoCalGirl

I agree with your point that skin color ultimately wins out. 'Cause just cause you're black it doesn't mean you don't have European roots and just cause you're white it doesn't mean that none of your ancestors came from Africa.

Plus with being black in America I honestly think that there's an even quicker tendency to assume an undefined African slave history. My best friend's father's side of the family is from Antigua so there's no American slave history there. Two guys I work with are black but their fathers are from Panama. Again, no American slave history. I think it would suck to grow up in the US learning "all your ancestors" came from slavery when you know full well they didn't!

To EVERYONE:

Some of that is correct. If a "darker hue" with African features says all their family comes from Central and South America with some Carribean roots possible arrived from Africa as slaves nearly 500 years ago. The issue is most of these countries WON their freedom from Slavery in the 1750's--i.e. Haiti... And their whole culture is that of freedom.

Slavery in the United States ended theoretically in 1865, but there was a issue of Jim Crow laws with segregation that theorectically ended in 1968 after Martin Luther King was assassinated.

So when we start talking about getting along while there are those who lived during this ugly chapter and history of the United States that was evident after Hurricane Katrina, suggests we have a very long way to go...

Should we be done with this after 40-odd years? Really? Or are we all being impatient with this instant gratification?

Rather than slamming me because you disagree and decide to deride and debase me, can you argue your points as to why you disagree?

Given that we have young people on GC and we have been asked to present ourselves accordingly, internet hatred with race wars are rather useless and does not increase our knowledge on this discussion.

[Sistermadly]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Hayle my birth certificate states "NEGRO" for definition of race.

It's nice to know I'm not the only one.

I remember when my husband (then fiance) saw my birth certificate for the first time. Poor little naive Canadian boy, he was so shocked.

[honeychile]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

My family name is possibly Jewish-Irish-Cherokee(?) whose slaveowners were of the Bruce Plantation in Alabama and migrated to Quincy, Florida. And that's my father side. My mother's side is Georgia and her genetic father is full-blooded Irish, but that is not what is stated on her birth certificate.

Hayle my birth certificate states "NEGRO" for definition of race.

To EVERYONE:

Some of that is correct. If a "darker hue" with African features says all their family comes from Central and South America with some Carribean roots possible arrived from Africa as slaves nearly 500 years ago. The issue is most of these countries WON their freedom from Slavery in the 1750's--i.e. Haiti... And their whole culture is that of freedom.

Slavery in the United States ended theoretically in 1865, but there was a issue of Jim Crow laws with segregation that theorectically ended in 1968 after Martin Luther King was assassinated.

So when we start talking about getting along while there are those who lived during this ugly chapter and history of the United States that was evident after Hurricane Katrina, suggests we have a very long way to go...

Should we be done with this after 40-odd years? Really? Or are we all being impatient with this instant gratification?

Rather than slamming me because you disagree and decide to deride and debase me, can you argue your points as to why you disagree?

Given that we have young people on GC and we have been asked to present ourselves accordingly, internet hatred with race wars are rather useless and does not increase our knowledge on this discussion.

Originally Posted by Sistermadly

My best friend's family arrived here as free people of color back in the late 1700s-early 1800s. None of his relatives were ever slaves. I think this is more common than people realize, and yeah, I think it's seriously misleading to assume that just because a person's of African descent that their ancestors ever shared the enslavement experience.

You both make excellent points. We do have a lot of young people here, and it makes more sense to educate them instead of ignoring the obvious. I get a lot of information on AA genealogy; if either of y'all or anyone you know is interested, I'd be happy to pass it along. If nothing else, Alex Haley proved that genealogy was for everyone, not just snobs.

[Jill1228]

Originally Posted by Sistermadly

It's nice to know I'm not the only one.

I remember when my husband (then fiance) saw my birth certificate for the first time. Poor little naive Canadian boy, he was so shocked.

Girl, same here! Mine looked at it and was like "what the hell is this?"

[Sistermadly]

Originally Posted by SoCalGirl

I think it would suck to grow up in the US learning "all your ancestors" came from slavery when you know full well they didn't! [/COLOR]

My best friend's family arrived here as free people of color back in the late 1700s-early 1800s. None of his relatives were ever slaves. I think this is more common than people realize, and yeah, I think it's seriously misleading to assume that just because a person's of African descent that their ancestors ever shared the enslavement experience.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by Sistermadly

My best friend's family arrived here as free people of color back in the late 1700s-early 1800s. None of his relatives were ever slaves. I think this is more common than people realize, and yeah, I think it's seriously misleading to assume that just because a person's of African descent that their ancestors ever shared the enslavement experience.

Another irony is that there may be 2-3 "lighter complexion" non-African ancestors that somehow co-mingled and produced offspring that wound up "darker hued". Then over time, that darker complexion became dominant in the rest of the progenitors... Then ever 1-2 generations, the lighter complexion pops up.

It is called Epigenetics and the generalized skin coloring genetics and systems may be under that level of control.

An interesting fictional account book is "Black Like Me" that all the current Black writers of the day severely criticized it...

[fantASTic]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Another irony is that there may be 2-3 "lighter complexion" non-African ancestors that somehow co-mingled and produced offspring that wound up "darker hued". Then over time, that darker complexion became dominant in the rest of the progenitors... Then ever 1-2 generations, the lighter complexion pops up.

It is called Epigenetics and the generalized skin coloring genetics and systems may be under that level of control.

An interesting fictional account book is "Black Like Me" that all the current Black writers of the day severely criticized it...

Black Like Me, by John Howard Griffin, is non-fiction.

[SoCalGirl]

Originally Posted by bluefish81

I think this is interesting re: last names not being indicative of your hertitage. My last name is very German. My great-great grandfather came to the US in the early 1860s. (No, I didn't miss a generation there, my great-grandfather married later in life and then had 8 kids.) The name hasn't changed since then.
My heritage is actually over 50% German - my dad is 100% German - my mom is probably about 25%. About half of my mom's side of the family has been in the states since around the late 1600s/early 1700s. And the heritage on my mom's side is German/Scottish/English/Welsh.

Perhaps it's just that my dad's side of the family hasn't been in the U.S. long enough. My mom does occassionally like to tease him about it since her family has been here so long.

OMG we could totally have the same great great grandfather! LOL, would be funny wouldn't it? Mine was married three times and I think had 5 (?) kids with the third one.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by fantASTic

Black Like Me, by John Howard Griffin, is non-fiction.

Sorry, I meant "Black No More"... It is a sci fi/futuristic type book.

[fantASTic]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Sorry, I meant "Black No More"... It is a sci fi/futuristic type book.

Haha, that makes a LOT more sense..I was like, "Why would many black authors hate Black Like Me? It exposed all the racial inequalities in the southern states!"

I gotcha now.