How does your school handle bidless PNMs on bid day?

[jwright25]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Guaranteed placement is a bad idea, IMO. If a girl is only invited to one pref party, what's to say that she didn't snub another chapter earlier on? Let's say there are five chapters, and she behaves like a beast at four of them because she only wants to be an XYZ. Hardly fair to let her pick like that and guaranteed her the bid to XYZ.

That is very true, and I've seen it happen. But as long as XYZ wants her enough to keep her coming back to their parties, it's basically the same result, right? Or perhaps some would argue that it is better this way - rather than continuing to attend parties at chapters that she knows she would never take, she gets them to release her early and then invite someone else who might actually be interested. If XYZ didn't want her, they'd cut her before Preference.

But that does bring up an interesting way to dodge the system. A chapter could dirty rush a girl and tell her to be mean to everyone else to where she gets cut. Then she'd get only one invite to Pref, the chapter puts her at the bottom of the list, and gets her as a QA. Lots of room for problems to happen though - like chapters who are supposed to invite everyone back each night, etc. But something to think about anyway!

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by jwright25

But that does bring up an interesting way to dodge the system. A chapter could dirty rush a girl and tell her to be mean to everyone else to where she gets cut. Then she'd get only one invite to Pref, the chapter puts her at the bottom of the list, and gets her as a QA. Lots of room for problems to happen though - like chapters who are supposed to invite everyone back each night, etc. But something to think about anyway!

I still say that any girl willing to play 4th string like that has problems. If a group doesn't want you enough to put you on their first bid list (or at least high enough that you get a bid fairly) why do you want them?

[aephi alum]

Originally Posted by jwright25

But that does bring up an interesting way to dodge the system. A chapter could dirty rush a girl and tell her to be mean to everyone else to where she gets cut. Then she'd get only one invite to Pref, the chapter puts her at the bottom of the list, and gets her as a QA. Lots of room for problems to happen though - like chapters who are supposed to invite everyone back each night, etc. But something to think about anyway!

That could very easily blow up in the PNM's face, though.

Let's say Susie PNM is Kathy XYZ's rush crush, and Kathy really wants Susie to become an XYZ. Kathy takes Susie aside and tells her that they use guaranteed placement, so Susie should be rude and mean at the other sororities' parties, so she only gets one pref invite, to XYZ, and she will be placed at XYZ, guaranteed.

Susie takes Kathy's advice and is rude at all the other sororities' parties. The other sororities, of course, cut her, and Susie becomes known as "the rude PNM". Other sorority members talk to their XYZ friends and tell them how awful Susie is.

When XYZ's membership selection comes around, there are a bunch of sisters who know how rude Susie was to their friends in other sororities... and Kathy is just one sister. So, Susie is cut from XYZ.

Now, Susie has been completely released from recruitment, and will probably never get a bid anywhere, because everyone will remember her as "the rude PNM" for the rest of her college career.

It's always best to keep an open mind and make up your own mind when accepting invitations and filling out your pref card.

[lauralaylin]

At a school I volunteered at, if a pnm was completely cut by all the sororities, she went back to the ones she liked the most. If she was completely cut again, the same was true. So she basically was able to choose where she ended up. One year we were going to get stuck with someone that was NOT a good fit with the chapter, but because she was so rude to another group, the GA actually didn't honor the guaranteed placement in her case, so we lucked out. So being rude doesn't always work.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by lauralaylin

At a school I volunteered at, if a pnm was completely cut by all the sororities, she went back to the ones she liked the most. If she was completely cut again, the same was true. So she basically was able to choose where she ended up. One year we were going to get stuck with someone that was NOT a good fit with the chapter, but because she was so rude to another group, the GA actually didn't honor the guaranteed placement in her case, so we lucked out. So being rude doesn't always work.

So much for membership selection if the PNMs get to keep going back, even after they're cut.

[ForeverRoses]

That is insane! So a girl could "be not quite rude" to certain groups to get purposely cut, then go back to the "popular" groups that dropped her? AND she would get a bid? talk about a crazy system.
Mutual selection is supposed to be, MUTUAL-not we are shoving this PNM down your throat because she really wants you.

[PenguinTrax]

Originally Posted by lauralaylin

At a school I volunteered at, if a pnm was completely cut by all the sororities, she went back to the ones she liked the most. If she was completely cut again, the same was true. So she basically was able to choose where she ended up. One year we were going to get stuck with someone that was NOT a good fit with the chapter, but because she was so rude to another group, the GA actually didn't honor the guaranteed placement in her case, so we lucked out. So being rude doesn't always work.

This is so wrong....cut is cut.

[ISUKappa]

Originally Posted by PenguinTrax

This is so wrong....cut is cut.

No kidding. This isn't kindergarten T-ball where everyone gets a participation ribbon and a pat on the head, this is Collegiate Sorority Recruitment. Sheesh.

IBME that chapter members do not know where a PNM is placed on the bid list. So I don't know if intentionally putting Sally PNM at the bottom of the list to guarantee a QA would work.

I *have* heard of chapters dirty rushing by telling PNMs to drop out of recruitment and go through informal and they would be given a bid to XYZ that way.

[carnation]

In the nineties, I talked with a Pi Phi at a private college that had a quota much higher than the number of PNMs rushing would suggest. Three sororities there had folded, while 6 were still around. The Pi Phi told me that the huge quotas were due to the college president's mandate because he wanted all the PNMs to be happy...I don't know if this included ruling that any girl could get a bid where she wanted but it seemed to stop just short of it.

[PenguinTrax]

Originally Posted by carnation

In the nineties, I talked with a Pi Phi at a private college that had a quota much higher than the number of PNMs rushing would suggest. Three sororities there had folded, while 6 were still around. The Pi Phi told me that the huge quotas were due to the college president's mandate because he wanted all the PNMs to be happy...I don't know if this included ruling that any girl could get a bid where she wanted but it seemed to stop just short of it.

Even at FSU where they guarantee placement if you complete Recruitment, cut is cut. Quota is set before Pref...things usually work out swimmingly.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by ISUKappa

I *have* heard of chapters dirty rushing by telling PNMs to drop out of recruitment and go through informal and they would be given a bid to XYZ that way.

This was a HUGE problem on my campus. Certain chapters would tell girls to drop out and go through informal. The Rho Chi's had to have an emergency meeting about it last year because HALF of their groups were saying "I'm dropping out and going XY through informal."

Of course they couldn't twist their arms and make them stay. So these girls would drop out, thinking that come next week, they'd be XY's. Wrong. XY would fill quota plus and hit total. All those girls who were told that they should come to informal were devastated because XY was totally full and there wasn't going to be any informal (except for a few spots in the spring).

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by ISUKappa

IBME that chapter members do not know where a PNM is placed on the bid list. So I don't know if intentionally putting Sally PNM at the bottom of the list to guarantee a QA would work.

It would not, because you don't know where she is on anyone else's bid list.

[carnation]

bump!

[susan314]

Originally Posted by lauralaylin

At a school I volunteered at, if a pnm was completely cut by all the sororities, she went back to the ones she liked the most. If she was completely cut again, the same was true. So she basically was able to choose where she ended up. One year we were going to get stuck with someone that was NOT a good fit with the chapter, but because she was so rude to another group, the GA actually didn't honor the guaranteed placement in her case, so we lucked out. So being rude doesn't always work.

That's horrible! I'm surprised that the advisors/national reps from the sororities on campus didn't fight that a little more.

Its one thing to guarantee someone a bid if she gets invited to preference - if a chapter invites you to a pref party, you're likely someone they'd be willing to accept as a member and appear on their bid list somewhere. But its a totally different thing to take away that chapter's right to cut you before preference.

Doesn't seem like that great of a situation for the PNM either - sure, they end up in the chapter they want, but how welcome are you going to feel in a chapter where people resent you b/c they tried to drop you before pref and Panhel forced them to invite you back? I'd be curious to see the retention stats for PNMs who were matched this way - bet a lot of them end up dropping out.

[lauralaylin]

Originally Posted by susan314

That's horrible! I'm surprised that the advisors/national reps from the sororities on campus didn't fight that a little more.

Well, it's not a big Greek campus, but I'm pretty sure that the everyone knows about this on a national level. I don't know the specifics as I didn't really get involved too much with this chapter (I was already advising another one), but I think this is just the way things are here. They also allowed a huge amount of rush violations this past year because there's no GA either and the administration don't care. It's just all screwed up.