what do i have to give back?

[IncontRHOllable]

Originally Posted by 1908Revelations

I guess it is hard for me to understand since we do not get ANYTHING until after we are members.

Exactly. The first time I heard of giving gifts to NP BEFORE becoming a member is on GC.

It seems to me that regardless of her character or the reasons that she DP, if you are not a member of the org then simply give the lettered items back.

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by Katylovesit

I have decided I do not want to be intiated and have told my GM about this and she said she will talk to me later this week. I heard that you have to give some of your stuff back which is reasonable but I do want something to remember my sorority experience and i have paid alot in new member fees... what can i expect to give back? i know its different in every campus but i just wanted some opinions

what i have recieve is greek letters from big, dropped necklace (i'm pretty sure i have to give this back), tote bag, photo album, notepads, jacket, flip flops, stitch shirt, family stitch, another shirt i got on big/lil reveal day, bid day shirt, clues from big (some letters with symbol), a cup, picture frame, and other little things....

thank you in advance! oh and in case you were wondering i decided i did not want to be intiated due to some family disagreement about the use of my college money

This is a shame that your parents are against the way you spent you funds.

As usual, most parents so do not understand what all else is entailed and what can be learned from being a member of a GLO.

I am sure your heart is still with the ladies of the GLO you associated with.

I am sure that you want to keep something from your experience with them.

Is there anyway you can get them to change their minds as in a visit to campus and the GLO and meet them and see what they do besides party all of the time!

The best of luck for your future if it cannot be worked out with them.!

[ZeePhiBee4Me]

my parents pitched a fit when they checked our joint account and saw that all the money was gone...so i understand what they are saying.

but seriously, if you've already gone thru the process, paid the $, etc, i know i would let you finish up. you'd just owe me some $ at the end lol

the memories are worth more than a few tshirts and a mug. trust me.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by GeekyPenguin

Unless you signed a paper saying that you would which is not as uncommon as you think.

My chapter usually will do a buy-back so the person can at least get some money back for what they purchased.

You'll learn this outside of law school -- just because the contract is enforceable doesn't mean it's worth enforcing. Where are you going to find someone willing to file a replevin action for some sorority t-shirts?

[GeekyPenguin]

Originally Posted by Kevin

You'll learn this outside of law school -- just because the contract is enforceable doesn't mean it's worth enforcing. Where are you going to find someone willing to file a replevin action for some sorority t-shirts?

Alumni. I've seen it done outside of law school. When you're an 18 y/o a letter from an attorney with a complaint that they will file if you do not give the stuff back is pretty effective.

[1908Revelations]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

Sometimes you do develop deep friendships with people who can't continue their memberships. I would think that the essential judgment of their character would still be accurate, but I totally see what you are saying.

As far as your second point, I can see that as a good system, but if anything, NPC groups seem to be moving in the opposite direction; they want very few distinctions between what new members can do and what initiated members do.

Before initiation we (I can't speak for the whole NPHC, but it is a safe assumption) are not New Members we are candidates (or whatever term the org chooses). The only distinctions I see between new and seasoned members is the length of time one is in the org. For example I have only been a member of AKA since 12/3/06 where as SummerChild (I just wanted to use someone for an example) may have joined 10 (or more)years ago. She and I have the same rights with in AKA and responsibilities as Sorors (unless she holds a position that requires more responsiblity in her chapter).

Originally Posted by IncontRHOllable

Exactly. The first time I heard of giving gifts to NP BEFORE becoming a member is on GC.

Me too!

[KSUViolet06]

This is why I'm glad that signing our termination/depledge paperwork means that they will return ALL lettered items (including the things they bought). So pretty much if you want to terminate, you need to return things. They also have the option of giving the items to their big/littles/other sisters. But either way, they know that whatever they have with our letters on it needs to be returned.

I guess we've just been lucky because anyone who has ever terminated or depledged had no desire to wear our letters or have them on anything.

[BlueEyedButrfly]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

This is why I'm glad that signing our termination/depledge paperwork means that they will return ALL lettered items (including the things they bought). So pretty much if you want to terminate, you need to return things. They also have the option of giving the items to their big/littles/other sisters. But either way, they know that whatever they have with our letters on it needs to be returned.

I guess we've just been lucky because anyone who has ever terminated or depledged had no desire to wear our letters or have them on anything.

I'm the President of a local org and we also have this paperwork that all members sign re: giving merchandise with our letters back upon leaving the org. We don't allow the girls to wear letters until after they're initiated so girls de-pledging and not giving letters back isn't an issue. Although, we did have a girl de-pledge (like 4 or 5 weeks into an 8 week pledge period) and ask for her pledge fee back! (we have since created paperwork for that also!)

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by BlueEyedButrfly

I'm the President of a local org and we also have this paperwork that all members sign re: giving merchandise with our letters back upon leaving the org. We don't allow the girls to wear letters until after they're initiated so girls de-pledging and not giving letters back isn't an issue. Although, we did have a girl de-pledge (like 4 or 5 weeks into an 8 week pledge period) and ask for her pledge fee back! (we have since created paperwork for that also!)

I should also mention that our HQ also has paperwork that girls sign when they pledge saying that:

*The letters/sorority name/crest/badge are property of Tri Sigma.
*If you depledge/terminate, all items bearing those things must be retruned.
*If you wish to leave the sorority, you forfeit ALL dues/fees that you've paid.
*Termination is irreversible (if you terminate your membership OR you ARE terminated by HQ, you cannot join again).

Believe it or not, some girls have terminated, CHANGED THEIR MINDS, and asked to rejoin! We were pretty stunned. WTF?! You SIGNED THE PAPERS!

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by 1908Revelations

Before initiation we (I can't speak for the whole NPHC, but it is a safe assumption) are not New Members we are candidates (or whatever term the org chooses). The only distinctions I see between new and seasoned members is the length of time one is in the org. For example I have only been a member of AKA since 12/3/06 where as SummerChild (I just wanted to use someone for an example) may have joined 10 (or more)years ago. She and I have the same rights with in AKA and responsibilities as Sorors (unless she holds a position that requires more responsiblity in her chapter).



Me too!

Honestly, if I ran the NPC Greek world, I think I would do things more like the NPHC in a lot of ways. (You all don’t seem to do “re-structuring” of chapters to increase numbers; it’s understood as desirable (and expected) to stay active in the group your whole life on every level, and you don’t have chapters who have policies about rejecting some affiliates, as far as I know, just to name a few of the things that I admire.)

It seems to me that NPC groups are really accelerating the differences with NPHC are the area of new members, but it hasn’t always been that way.

When I was in college, we were “pledges,” not new members; we had to make certain grades to be eligible for initiation (now the whole process can take less than a semester) and we didn't get to go to chapter until we were initiated. There seemed to be more clear markers of who was a full member and who was trying to become a full member although everyone could wear letters and colors as a new member.

I was NEVER hazed and as far as I know about the same number of people stayed in the group at my chapter from pledging to graduation as do today, so it’s hard for me to appreciate what was “wrong” with the old system. But the people who make these decisions have taken things a different direction.

But maybe you could think about this situation in terms of what you would do with a woman who dropped membership or was kicked out after having crossed. Does your group have procedures and policies about how to handle that?

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

Honestly, if I ran the NPC Greek world, I think I would do things more like the NPHC in a lot of ways. (You all don’t seem to do “re-structuring” of chapters to increase numbers; it’s understood as desirable (and expected) to stay active in the group your whole life on every level, and you don’t have chapters who have policies about rejecting some affiliates, as far as I know, just to name a few of the things that I admire.)

A lot of NPHC chapters don't have housing either. That makes a big difference in the way things are run.

I know what you are saying and I agree to a point, but if put into practice, it would surely kill off more than a few NPC groups. Keep in mind there are only 4 NPHC sororities.

[Buttonz]

Originally Posted by tld221

not that active members would disclose this to NMs, but dont "gifts" to NMs tend to come out of NM fees?

Not by us. The only thing that came out of NM fees were programs ran specifically for the NMs, NM pins, manuals, etc.

Originally Posted by 1908Revelations

I guess it is hard for me to understand since we do not get ANYTHING until after we are members.

Neither did we. We got a ton of gifts after initiation from our big, president and NME but that was the first time we ever got anything big. We would get something small (usually a big/lil shot glass, candle or something along those lines) on Big Sis/Lil Sis night, and that never had letters on it. We weren't allowed to buy anything with letters on it until after initiation either, and that was the way that I liked it.

[tld221]

Originally Posted by 33girl

A lot of NPHC chapters don't have housing either. That makes a big difference in the way things are run.

i can kinda see your point... but which aspect of "the way things are run" are you speaking on? re: housing i think of "oh, NPC orgs will want to recruit as many to fill the house." now im sure that's not the primary reason why NPC recruits and rushes on a much larger scale than NPHC (and i hope not, cause while thte bills gotta get paid, that is LAME), so maybe you can elaborate? (without turning into an NPC vs. NPHC thread cause we've got enough of those)

Originally Posted by 33girl

I know what you are saying and I agree to a point, but if put into practice, it would surely kill off more than a few NPC groups. Keep in mind there are only 4 NPHC sororities.

do you mean size-wise or popularity-wise?

also, tell me if this is too big of an assumption, but does telling a PNM that they are a member from bid day forward bring more appeal to a rushee vs. saying "you have no rights to our letters until initiation?" and i know THIS discussion has been had before, but (NPHC aside) i think a clearer boundary would lessen these scenarios.

[cuteASAbug]

Originally Posted by tld221

also, tell me if this is too big of an assumption, but does telling a PNM that they are a member from bid day forward bring more appeal to a rushee vs. saying "you have no rights to our letters until initiation?" and i know THIS discussion has been had before, but (NPHC aside) i think a clearer boundary would lessen these scenarios.

NPC sororities view recruitment as a 24/7/365 approach so part of the appeal of telling PNM's that they are members after bid day is that their friends will see them participating in sorority activities and wearing letters and will see the amount of fun that the new members are having and will want to join as a result of that.

[DSTRen13]

Originally Posted by 33girl

A lot of NPHC chapters don't have housing either. That makes a big difference in the way things are run.

My undergrad chapter had housing for a considerable period of our history on campus. We ran things regarding membership/recruitment the same when we didn't have the house as when we did. What exactly would be different, and why?