Greek Discrimination....

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by KyleMcGuire1983

For the record 20 years later San Francisco is hundreds of millions of dollars in debt! How do you do that in such short time?

Liberal local governments have problems keeping their spending in check.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

Liberal local governments have problems keeping their spending in check.

So do conservative federal governments, so the bulk of the last 7 years would seem to indicate.

[LXAAlum]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

Hmmmm, interesting. We have cities campaigning to get our regional conference and national convention business, and convention bureaus wine and dine our national board. In fact, not only do they give us good discount rates on hotel rooms, convention center meeting rooms, etc., but in a couple of cases cities have donated thousands of dollars to our org. for choosing them. For example, Philly gave us a check for $25,000 to compensate for any added expenses due to it being controlled by unions.

The reason? We are known to drop mucho dollars at our national and regional meetings. In 1988, we spent so much money in San Francisco that they were able to retire their city debt.

The NPHC frats get even deeper discounts from hotels, because of the money they spend in the hotel bars. LOL

I was at a convention in Chicago a couple of years ago for another fraternal org I belong to when a NPHC org had their national convention - it was either at the Hilton, or the members were staying there.

I was impressed by the way they conducted themselves. Very nice - decently dressed, polite...everything ANY greek member should be.

The real difference was yet ANOTHER convention being held that had something to do with gay rights or gay pride...umm...yeah. They had NO respect for anyone around them, were very obnoxious, intoxicated...etc....

The things you see (but wish you hadn't) at a multi-convention hotel....

[swizzSTG]

the best thing we can do is accept that there is a stereotype and fight to improve our image in every aspect of our lifes. also remember that every little thing we do wrong is going to make the news first page and the good things we do will be on page ten of section d. its an uphill battle but i know im not the only one that thinks its worth fighting

[nittanyalum]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

So do conservative federal governments, so the bulk of the last 7 years would seem to indicate.

I heart my TAR teammate.

[Little32]

I think that you did just the right thing. You do not stay and spend your money in a place where you do not feel as though you are being treated respectfully. Bump staying and proving to them that you can be polite and respectful (I hear this rhetoric a lot on this board); why should it be incumbent upon you to try to disabuse these people of their notions. Most people, regardless of the evidence that they see to the contrary, will cling to their prejudices.

Additionally, before leaving, you should have made it clear that you would be sharing your experiences at that hotel with all of the greek organizations on campus, and that you would do your best to ensure that that hotel was no longer troubled by greek business.

Put simply, you do not support--in anyway--businesses and organizations that discriminate against you. If you do, they get away with the discrimination and they get your money too.

Originally Posted by Day13

Yeah, it is just like that saying, "Looking in they will never understand, looking out you will never be able to explain," or however it goes. I'll tell you a story about discrimination for being Greek.

When we went into a hotel for our Officer's Retreat we had already put a $50 deposit on the bedrooms and on the conference room that we would be using for the majority of the day under our fraternity name.

The lady at the desk then asked for us to prepay for the rest of our stay and for it to be in cash. We looked at each other and said, "Well $300 is kind of a large money to carry in cash." We stepped back from the desk and assessed the situation while an older couple walked up and got their keys with just a credit card.

We then decided to say well we already put down $50 lets go ahead and just stay. So the lady then told us she needed to photocopy our driver licenses to give us hotel keys.

At this point we became upset and asked for an explanation of their policies and some written proof that this is how they conduct business. The manager came out and said they don't have a written policy but this is how they conduct business when they have people who they "feel iffy" about in their hotel.

Needless to say, we went to a different hotel that day. On a side note I told my mother about the story later and she said, "Well Mr. 'White male' welcome to discrimination. This is what goes on with people everyday."

[scoobis]

Originally Posted by 33girl

If this is the attitude you have about this man's business, it's pretty pricklike of you to expect him to donate money to your cause. Plus, I'm guessing he would have expected to have his name displayed as a benefactor in some way, either on a program or on a t-shirt or something, and then your fraternity's name would have been associated with his "horrible" business.

Pricklike? I went into his business because an alumnus gave me a list of businesses who've donated in the past. I didn't expect him to donate, I don't expect anyone to, i just hope people have the decency and means to be able to help.

But when you compare the the benefits to drawbacks in greeklife the good stuff really outweighs this minor crap like some guy not liking the letters on my chest. I just feel bad that they didn't get the experience we did

[33girl]

Originally Posted by scoobis

Pricklike? I went into his business because an alumnus gave me a list of businesses who've donated in the past. I didn't expect him to donate, I don't expect anyone to, i just hope people have the decency and means to be able to help.

You are really missing the point.

If you (either you personally or you as a group) find someone's business distasteful, you don't ask them to donate money. I hate Walmart, I don't care how much they've given in the past, I won't go in that store and ask them for money.

As you obviously find this man's business something repugnant, you shouldn't have gone in there to ask for money. Let another brother do it. If you as a group are against tobacco use, it's really hypocritical to ask a tobacco seller to help you in any way.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by 33girl

You are really missing the point.

I don't know that he is the one missing the point. I didn't take his initial "you're selling cancer" remark as an indication that he found the business "repugnant," but rather just as a comment on the perceived irony of someone who sells tobacco worrying about having his business associated with alcohol. The man had given in the past, and the OP said he remained polite in asking this time, even when he was treated rudely. How is that pricklike?

BTW, I hate Walmart too, but I wouldn't hesitate to ask them for money if I thought they might give and it would benefit the community.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I don't know that he is the one missing the point. I didn't take his initial "you're selling cancer" remark as an indication that he found the business "repugnant," but rather just as a comment on the perceived irony of someone who sells tobacco worrying about having his business associated with alcohol. The man had given in the past, and the OP said he remained polite in asking this time, even when he was treated rudely. How is that pricklike?

BTW, I hate Walmart too, but I wouldn't hesitate to ask them for money if I thought they might give and it would benefit the community.

To characterize an entire business as "selling cancer" and then ask them for money is IMO extremely hypocritical, not an ironic comment. I would have the same reaction if he called Vera Bradley "those stupid ugly effing bags" and then went into a VB store to ask for donations. You don't criticize people and then turn around and ask them for money.

And like I said - more than likely, donors would have their names recognized somewhere. If I dislike the way someone does business, or what their business is, I don't want their money associated with my org in any way, shape or form.

As for Walmart, I would hardly be the first person to say "keep your money."

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

BTW, I hate Walmart too, but I wouldn't hesitate to ask them for money if I thought they might give and it would benefit the community.

Yeah let these businesses give back to the community somehow.

But that has more to do with what "hating" a business entails. If a business is unhumane, harmful, has discriminatory practices, and so forth, I can understand organizations not wanting to solicit or receive their "dirty money." It's almost like selling out because some businesses will donate if they know they will get free advertising or recognition for contributing.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

But that has more to do with what "hating" a business entails. If a business is unhumane, harmful, has discriminatory practices, and so forth, I can understand organizations not wanting to solicit or receive their "dirty money." It's almost like selling out because some businesses will donate if they know they will get free advertising or recognition for contributing.

Yes. Thank you.

[TSteven]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

In 1988, we spent so much money in San Francisco that they were able to retire their city debt.

Thank you. Any plans to come back?

Originally Posted by KyleMcGuire1983

For the record 20 years later San Francisco is hundreds of millions of dollars in debt! How do you do that in such short time?

Originally Posted by PhiGam

Liberal local governments have problems keeping their spending in check.

Originally Posted by MysticCat

So do conservative federal governments, so the bulk of the last 7 years would seem to indicate.

For the record, the City and County of San Francisco's debt is due mainly to general obligation bond issuances related to infrastructure. Most of which has been mandated by federal and state law starting after the 1989 Loma Prieta and the 1994 Northridge earthquakes. To be clear, San Francisco's general bonded debt includes bonds for construction and/or rehabilitation of affordable housing, libraries, museums, parks and playgrounds, schools, fire and police stations and other facilities. And for what it is worth, Standard and Poor's considers San Francisco's debt burden as manageable and the economy stable. Many so called "conservative" local governments would love those ratings.

[skylark]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I don't know that he is the one missing the point. I didn't take his initial "you're selling cancer" remark as an indication that he found the business "repugnant," but rather just as a comment on the perceived irony of someone who sells tobacco worrying about having his business associated with alcohol. The man had given in the past, and the OP said he remained polite in asking this time, even when he was treated rudely. How is that pricklike?

BTW, I hate Walmart too, but I wouldn't hesitate to ask them for money if I thought they might give and it would benefit the community.

I took his comment the same way. It's like the pot calling the kettle black sort of thing. I certainly don't have a problem with tobacco or cigar shops, but if a business owner of one of those shops tried to act all altruistic about not wanting to promote substance abuse by minors... I'd absolutely feel the need to call out a hypocrite.

ETA: On the OP's topic (trying to steer the thread back) ... I've often felt like the "sorority" label has raised eyebrows from others. For several years in college I enjoyed philosophy and gender studies classes by a certain feminist professor and at one point asked her to write a letter of recommendation for a sorority scholarship. Mind you, I'd gotten all As (not even an A-) in all 4 classes from her and in the two upper division classes I had the highest GPA in the class. We had a good working relationship, so I honestly hadn't hesitated at all about asking for the rec. When I asked, though, she was like "I'm not really sure I can be involved in this because I really don't like what sororities stand for." I couldn't help but think that if only she would open her eyes to the fact that being involved in my sorority was about one of the most feminist activities available on campus for women to do.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by skylark

I took his comment the same way. It's like the pot calling the kettle black sort of thing. I certainly don't have a problem with tobacco or cigar shops, but if a business owner of one of those shops tried to act all altruistic about not wanting to promote substance abuse by minors... I'd absolutely feel the need to call out a hypocrite.

Tobacco is a legal substance in the United States of America. Where is the hypocrisy?