1 Killed in Shootings at Virginia Tech

[ASUADPi]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

And while I hope the parents of this latest killer are safe, I do think it fair to ask - How did they not know their son was in such an awful mental state? I realize the university was in a horrible situation - I know they cannot necessarily contact the parents (when I taught college I could not even give parents their children's grades because of privacy issues) - but I can't help but wonder - as, in all fairness I'm sure they are now - how could they have missed this?

While I'm sure I'm in the minority and I'm expecting people to blow a gasket with this comment, I don't believe it is fair of anyone to put any blame on the parents, of any school shooter.

Parents do the best they can. I'm not a parent but I do remember being in high school and in college and I didn't tell my parents an awful lot of what was going on in my life. That is growing up and exerting your own independence. Plus, who is to say that he didn't go home and "put on an act" for his parents?

To blame parents of what their children did is completely assinine. Not that I'm trying to justify what this person did, because I'm not, but I truly believe that he wasn't mentally stable and just broke. Everyone has a breaking point but 99% of the population WON'T pick up a gun and start killing people.

From what I've heard classmates and roomates and professors knew something was up with him, but nothing was done. That really just needs to change in our society. We can't keep brushing things off that we notice and say "that's not my problem".

Like I said, I'm sure tons of people will disagree with me, and that's totally fine, but I'm not attacking anyone so please don't attack me and my opinion.

[Honeykiss1974]

Originally Posted by 33girl

If they were working 24/7 they might not have had the chance.

True - plus if he only went home for holidays or the occassional weekend, its easy "fake it" and act like everything is peachy keen when in fact, you're tormented inside.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

And while I hope the parents of this latest killer are safe, I do think it fair to ask - How did they not know their son was in such an awful mental state? I realize the university was in a horrible situation - I know they cannot necessarily contact the parents (when I taught college I could not even give parents their children's grades because of privacy issues) - but I can't help but wonder - as, in all fairness I'm sure they are now - how could they have missed this?

Sometimes parents see only what they want to see about their kid, especially when their child has left home and they only see them a few weeks out of the year.

[SWTXBelle]

But wasn't he committed to a mental health facility, where they said he was a threat to himself? That is kind of hard to ignore even if you are working a great deal.
I don't blame the parents - anymore than I do the school - but I do hope that one thing to come out of all of this is a discussion on how to prevent this kind of thing. Parents have to look for warning signs - schools have to discuss what to do with a student with these kind of issues. I remember earlier in the year a discussion of schools who made depressed students withdraw, so this is not a new issue.
When I was teaching college I had a student who would sit in the front row making a slitting motion to his throat whilst grinning manically at me. I've dealt with this problem on a VERY personal basis. He was also following me after class. I had my brother the police officer come and escort me a few times, and the behavior stopped. But the school was powerless to do anything.
I don't know the answer, but I know it is a discussion that needs to happen.

[LPIDelta]

I think its sad that people are more concerned with getting sued and protecting privacy than with the safety of a student or all students. It would see that many administrators are following the letter of the law too much, rather than the spirit. I am not blaming the schools, especially not blaming Virginia Tech--but if you are concerned about student safety and your own personal safety to the point of having code words and escorts, I think its better to err on the side of caution and call someone, anyone, who will help. I would rather have somone be mad at me if I was wrong, than see someone get hurt. If that means calling the parents, then so be it. But we don't because lawyers are telling us the students have rights, even if they are a danger to themselves or others?

I hope that the laws will change now.

[_Opi_]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

But wasn't he committed to a mental health facility, where they said he was a threat to himself? That is kind of hard to ignore even if you are working a great deal.
I don't blame the parents - anymore than I do the school - but I do hope that one thing to come out of all of this is a discussion on how to prevent this kind of thing. Parents have to look for warning signs - schools have to discuss what to do with a student with these kind of issues. I remember earlier in the year a discussion of schools who made depressed students withdraw, so this is not a new issue.
When I was teaching college I had a student who would sit in the front row making a slitting motion to his throat whilst grinning manically at me. I've dealt with this problem on a VERY personal basis. He was also following me after class. I had my brother the police officer come and escort me a few times, and the behavior stopped. But the school was powerless to do anything.
I don't know the answer, but I know it is a discussion that needs to happen.

In retrospect, you have to wonder what in this society is making people want to just massacre people like that. It might have to do with the easy access to guns, but I believe there's more to the story.

[dzrose93]

Originally Posted by lilzetakitten

I heard that too. The worst part is the motorcycle blockade that keeps WBC from getting too close at military funerals will not be able to go to most of the funerals, seeing as that most of the deceased are not military.

There's a note on the Patriot Guard website basically saying that, although they have military ties and usually come to only military funerals as an organized group, they will come as an unofficial group to any of the Virginia Tech funerals if invited. I hope that someone invites them. I don't know a single person at VA Tech, but I feel like sending them an invitation just to protect the mourners from those scummy protestors.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Heather17

I think its sad that people are more concerned with getting sued and protecting privacy than with the safety of a student or all students. It would see that many administrators are following the letter of the law too much, rather than the spirit. I am not blaming the schools, especially not blaming Virginia Tech--but if you are concerned about student safety and your own personal safety to the point of having code words and escorts, I think its better to err on the side of caution and call someone, anyone, who will help. I would rather have somone be mad at me if I was wrong, than see someone get hurt. If that means calling the parents, then so be it. But we don't because lawyers are telling us the students have rights, even if they are a danger to themselves or others?

I hope that the laws will change now.

Yeah, but if you're a teacher or admin and make the wrong call - i.e. labeling someone who's not dangerous as dangerous - your career is over, basically.

[ZTABullwinkle]

I have been reading this thread since Monday. I am sure that I may get flamed for this but here is what I think....

-I wish the media would stop trying to lay blame on the school and administrators. It has been made very clear to me that the police thought that they had the person of interest in the first murders in West AJ. Who knew that someone as "disturbed" as the killer was going to strike again? I think in all honesty they did what was best in the situation. We need to stop doing the "Woulda, coulda, shoulda" and concentrate on the victims.

-I wish the media would leave these kids to mourn. I loved the interview yesterday with the Columbine survivor who is also a student at Tech. (It was on the Today show.) She mentioned that if a small group tried to huddle together the media pounces (my word, not hers) on them.

-I wish the media would listen to what the other questions being asked in the press conferences. It is solving nothing, let alone getting no more "tidbits" for their news. I was irked to hear the media asking the Chief of police what the "annoying" IMs the killer sent contained repeatedly when he told you that he didn't have them and would not speculate as to what they said. Along the same line, I wish the various news programs would stop trying to get the interviewrs to say something that isn't there. I feel almost as if they are "bullying" people to say what they want heard.

-I wish the idiots calling in threats to colleges around the country would get over themselves. We as a country are hurting enough, but to feel unsafe because some idiot says "Va Tech first, ODU is next." is not accomplishing anything.

-I applaud the stations that have decided that there is nothing gained by repeatedly showing the killer's videos and pictures. I understand that it was "Breaking News" and people want to get answers to "why?" but what about the people around the country who are still grieving? I feel as if the media is looking for the sensationalism, not the news.

/soapbox

[uksparkle]

Originally Posted by ZTABullwinkle

-I applaud the stations that have decided that there is nothing gained by repeatedly showing the killer's videos and pictures. I understand that it was "Breaking News" and people want to get answers to "why?" but what about the people around the country who are still grieving? I feel as if the media is looking for the sensationalism, not the news.

/soapbox

I'm not sure, but I figure the reason other stations aren't showing the footage is because it was sent to NBC and NBC isn't sharing...

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Yeah, but if you're a teacher or admin and make the wrong call - i.e. labeling someone who's not dangerous as dangerous - your career is over, basically.

What do you value more, your freedom or your safety? It seems you can't have both these days.

[AlexMack]

Originally Posted by ZTABullwinkle

I have been reading this thread since Monday. I am sure that I may get flamed for this but here is what I think....

-I wish the media would stop trying to lay blame on the school and administrators. It has been made very clear to me that the police thought that they had the person of interest in the first murders in West AJ. Who knew that someone as "disturbed" as the killer was going to strike again? I think in all honesty they did what was best in the situation. We need to stop doing the "Woulda, coulda, shoulda" and concentrate on the victims.

-I wish the media would leave these kids to mourn. I loved the interview yesterday with the Columbine survivor who is also a student at Tech. (It was on the Today show.) She mentioned that if a small group tried to huddle together the media pounces (my word, not hers) on them.

-I wish the media would listen to what the other questions being asked in the press conferences. It is solving nothing, let alone getting no more "tidbits" for their news. I was irked to hear the media asking the Chief of police what the "annoying" IMs the killer sent contained repeatedly when he told you that he didn't have them and would not speculate as to what they said. Along the same line, I wish the various news programs would stop trying to get the interviewrs to say something that isn't there. I feel almost as if they are "bullying" people to say what they want heard.

-I wish the idiots calling in threats to colleges around the country would get over themselves. We as a country are hurting enough, but to feel unsafe because some idiot says "Va Tech first, ODU is next." is not accomplishing anything.

-I applaud the stations that have decided that there is nothing gained by repeatedly showing the killer's videos and pictures. I understand that it was "Breaking News" and people want to get answers to "why?" but what about the people around the country who are still grieving? I feel as if the media is looking for the sensationalism, not the news.

/soapbox

Why do you think you'll get flamed? You're absolutely right. And the Columbine survivor at VTech? Holy! Either that's mental fortitude that's never been seen or she'll be in therapy for quite sometime. My goodness.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by Honeykiss1974

True - plus if he only went home for holidays or the occassional weekend, its easy "fake it" and act like everything is peachy keen when in fact, you're tormented inside.

I watched an interview with his roommates last night and they said that the whole reason they reported that he had been suicidal was because they knew he would be alone for the whole Christmas break and that he would have ample opportunity to attempt suicide, so they wanted to make sure someone knew. So, it sounds like he didn't even go home for breaks or anything.

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

But wasn't he committed to a mental health facility, where they said he was a threat to himself? That is kind of hard to ignore even if you are working a great deal.
I don't blame the parents - anymore than I do the school - but I do hope that one thing to come out of all of this is a discussion on how to prevent this kind of thing. Parents have to look for warning signs - schools have to discuss what to do with a student with these kind of issues. I remember earlier in the year a discussion of schools who made depressed students withdraw, so this is not a new issue.
When I was teaching college I had a student who would sit in the front row making a slitting motion to his throat whilst grinning manically at me. I've dealt with this problem on a VERY personal basis. He was also following me after class. I had my brother the police officer come and escort me a few times, and the behavior stopped. But the school was powerless to do anything.
I don't know the answer, but I know it is a discussion that needs to happen.

Even if he had been committed to an inpatient unit for 5 years, his parents wouldn't necessarily know. Admission to such a unit is highly confidential and the hospital isn't allowed to notify anybody unless the patient gives permission to do so. When family members would call the front desk at the hospitals where I've worked, the secretary couldn't acknowledge whether someone was a patient there or not. If they called to speak to the patient, they would be told "We cannot confirm that the person is here but if they are, we can give them a message". Sometimes the message was for someone who wasn't a patient there. Very very strict rules on this.

I can do without most of the sensationalism. I have been focused on the survivors and how they survived. This is the first time my kids have been old enough that I can't protect them from this media coverage so it has presented a new challenge. With 9/11 and Columbine, etc., I could keep them away from the TV. Now, they have internet access and stuff, so there is no way. I've turned it into an analysis of things you can do if you find yourself in a scary situation. So far we have:
1) The girl who pretended she was dead when the killer returned. Brilliant, and saved her life.
2) The class that went into a teacher's office and locked that door, since the classroom doors don't lock.
3) The class that moved furniture in front of the door so the killer couldn't get in the room.
4) Getting out through a window if the door is unavailable (could break some bones, but more likely to survive).

They have lockdown drills at school now, a new law this year (Michigan law? or Federal? I don't know). My son's drill happens to be today. Odd timing, but good practice. I think if people are aware of some things that could be done before they are in that situation, they will have more tools to draw from if ever in a similar situation.

[LPIDelta]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Yeah, but if you're a teacher or admin and make the wrong call - i.e. labeling someone who's not dangerous as dangerous - your career is over, basically.

Sure...but, as important as a job is, I'd rather know that students were safe. I can find another job. I would hope others would feel the same way--if not, sad.

Last year, I witnessed some students with what I thought to be guns right outside a door to the building I work in. Needless to say, I was shocked and didn't know if what I thought I saw was real. When I got back to my office, I told the other people what I thought I saw and we called the campus PD. They locked down the president's office and came to ask me questions. Turns out they were fake and the students were practicing a scene for a play they were working on where a person is taken hostage--why you would practice this outdoors is beyond me. I got a lot of razzing from my colleagues and even a little from the police--but after what happened this week, I'd definitely do it again because we just never know now.

[Buttonz]

Originally Posted by texas*princess

I
They aren't gonna say, "Oh, well, we're CNN, and NBC already has this story because the package was sent to them, so let's post pictures or something else instead."

My point is, they are there to inform us (among other things) which is what their doing. Granted, the news coverage is a bit much - but I think it's because it's such a huge story that has touched so many people.
.

Nothing wrong at all with all of theme covering it, but do the pictures of the killer holding guns, etc have to be shown????

Originally Posted by centaur532

And the Columbine survivor at VTech? Holy! Either that's mental fortitude that's never been seen or she'll be in therapy for quite sometime. My goodness.

I didn't hear about this one....I get the feeling that a lot of therapy will be needed for her. To go through this once is unimaginable...to have to deal with it a second time?