FDA poised to OK food from cloned animals

[AlexMack]

Originally Posted by blueangel

How many animals has she cloned? Try again! And why has she not responded to my points?

Basically because it's the equivalent of a white belt calling you out on black belt techniques while disregarding your years of experience. I mean would you honestly take the time with a gleaming (like fresh out of the package) white belt to dissect every single point that he makes?
And I'm not saying like stupid white belt questions, I mean the really obnoxious new student who just says that you're wrong no matter what you say, even when you're obviously not. The ones you wish had never shown up for class.

[blueangel]

Originally Posted by centaur532

Basically because it's the equivalent of a white belt calling you out on black belt techniques while disregarding your years of experience. I mean would you honestly take the time with a gleaming (like fresh out of the package) white belt to dissect every single point that he makes?
And I'm not saying like stupid white belt questions, I mean the really obnoxious new student who just says that you're wrong no matter what you say, even when you're obviously not. The ones you wish had never shown up for class.

Where have my facts been in error? The difference is that these aren't "my" facts-- these are sourced facts. If you and she cannot refute them, then perhaps you're calling the wrong person a white belt.

[Drolefille]

Won't /= Can't

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by blueangel

Or perhaps she and you find that my "experts" and "sourcing" has left she and you unable to refute them? Instead, she and you dance around the point. Now, would you like to address any of the points I made? Or do you concede the debate as well?

No, I would not like to address any of the points you made, and no, I don't concede anything to you.

I've just had enough "discussions" with you and witnessed enough others to have accepted the presumption that you have no credibility. Attempting to discuss anything with you is a waste of time and energy.

Spin it however you want (because you always do), but it's really that simple.

[blueangel]

Just as I thought... you can't refute the facts I presented.

[AlexMack]

Originally Posted by blueangel

Where have my facts been in error? The difference is that these aren't "my" facts-- these are sourced facts. If you and she cannot refute them, then perhaps you're calling the wrong person a white belt.

ARGH...I didn't call you a white belt. This is why no one can hold discourse with you. You spin everything.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by blueangel

Just as I thought... you can't refute the facts I presented.

John Cena has something to say to you:

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by blueangel

Just as I thought... you can't refute the facts I presented.

Will not is not equivalent to cannot.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Spin it however you want (because you always do), but it's really that simple.

Originally Posted by blueangel

Just as I thought... you can't refute the facts I presented.

Just as I thought -- predicted even. You refuse to read and comprehend what others say to you, choosing instead to interpret your own inability to carry on a reasonable discourse as proof that no one can refute what you have to say.

[AKA_Monet]

My sources:

Maniatis et al. (1978) Molecular Cloning Manual volumes 1-3

Sambrook and Russell (2002) Molecular Cloning a Laboratory Manual 1-3

Ausbel et al. (2000) Current Protocols in Molecular Cloning volumes 1-5

Google it... I'm tired.

And YES... As a matter of fact I have cloned mice: Gao Y, Yan L-J, Sathyanarayanan S, Yuhanna I.S., Christians E, Moore G.L., Gottlieb R., Robbins J., Wawrousek E., Sohal, R.S., Shaul P.W., Bolli R., Benjamin I.J. Novel Roles for Cytosolic Chaperones in Mitochondrial NOS Expression and ROS Production. Poster presentation at 1st Annual Symposium American Heart Association Council on Basic Cardiovascular Sciences, July, 2004

Macrophage cell line: Moore and Davis (2002) Journal of Lipid Research

Currently, not many labs clones constructs to make either knockout or knockin mice. Most scientists farm these kinds of things out to companies...

Since you desire to belittle me and my professional experience, I can post my entire CV. But hey, think what you want, I really don't care, you don't pay my mortgage nor any of my bills... You know your are wrong in your assertions. Your logic is faulty and with personal vendetta with little scientific hypotheses or data supporting your efforts.

Your "experts" are bogus. They have lost their RO1 grants from the National Institutes of Health and they have not published in legitimate journals. Neither has their data be reproduced.

I have seen the data from the animal cloning from the FDA, USDA and NIH. A core of us (Scientists, Veterinarians, Physicians and Public Health professionals) reviewed and analyzed all the data. We have done ANOVA statistical analyses and correlated the data to Public Health record with the CDC database.

We have found zero correlation to causing dangerous pathogens in cloned meat products to the human population. Like the P value < 0.0001

So hey, you can balderdash me all you want. But I doubt you even know how to spell clone nor what it means in my book.

[AKA_Monet]

Blueangel:

I will answer your bullisht assed question: The safety and efficacy of cloned meats.

When you discuss cloning animal, you are talking about either adding or removing genes. Or you are talking about removing nuclei that contain X odd megabases of bovine genome with # chromosomes. In all mammals, complete numbers of chromosomes is manditory to successful cause zygote formation (Molecular Embryology 101). Actually, they inject nuclei into either some oocytes they can grow or embryonic stem cells they have isolated from blastula staged embryos. The reasons are numerous. Mainly because it works.

Then they implant the embryos into the pseudo-pregnant females. Resultant calves or pups will occur and then be genotyped by PCR.

From there, once the animal is adult stage, they will breed it with it's wildtype counterparts and generate an F2 generation.

You can crank out premiums meats extremely quickly with biotech used. Namely, the pork that tastes sweeter, Kobe beef cuts, less tough beef cuts. Basic breeding takes long, one has to wait for the animals to be the right age and if they like each other. The breeding times are excessive and the pregnancies are long (~11 months for various bovine breeds). And let's not discuss horse breedings.

Chickens are injected directly to generate transgenics. Their process of embryogenesis is fundamentally different from mammalian species because they are from the Avian Kingdom.

The public health concerns of cloned meat, most meats are processed, cured, treated, and mainly cooked. Eating raw meat from fresh kill is unsafe and no government agency purports that. Even milk sold must be pasteurized and homogenize, although raw milk, which contains blood, urine and plenty of microorganisms (Lactobacillus sp. & E. coli (maybe)), I heard tastes delicious but raw milk's safety cannot be guarenteed for consumption--spelled drink at your own risk. A finding by Louis Pasteur in the 19th century.

Then there is this guy Fleming... Kinna discovered Penicillian. And Jacob and Manod--received the Nobel Prize on what exactly is the genetic material, which was DNA. Watson & Crick solved the structure of DNA.

I decided to tell you this because you would respond immaturely to me as others. You clearly are having a neuropsychiatric episode on GC and you may need a vitamin B complexes to supplement your diet. Cecil's Medical Textbook clearly states that these kinds of problems can be solved by consuming vitamin B complexes and rather quickly.

When I get a chance, I will post another "Grand Rounds".

My GC Physicians will be more than happy to assist me in posting MD Consult.

[jubilance1922]

And that's why you leave a woman alone when she tells you she's an expert in the field!

AKA_Monet, you make me want to finish my PhD in polymer chemistry.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by jubilance1922

And that's why you leave a woman alone when she tells you she's an expert in the field!

Oh, don't worry...the BBS will still come up with some BS reason that AKA-Monet's response didn't fully answer her question, and didn't cite enough sources. And even if it did, the BBS is pretty good at "LaLaLa, I can't hear you...".

[BaylorBean]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Blueangel:

I will answer your bullisht assed question: The safety and efficacy of cloned meats.

When you discuss cloning animal, you are talking about either adding or removing genes. Or you are talking about removing nuclei that contain X odd megabases of bovine genome with # chromosomes. In all mammals, complete numbers of chromosomes is manditory to successful cause zygote formation (Molecular Embryology 101). Actually, they inject nuclei into either some oocytes they can grow or embryonic stem cells they have isolated from blastula staged embryos. The reasons are numerous. Mainly because it works.

Then they implant the embryos into the pseudo-pregnant females. Resultant calves or pups will occur and then be genotyped by PCR.

From there, once the animal is adult stage, they will breed it with it's wildtype counterparts and generate an F2 generation.

You can crank out premiums meats extremely quickly with biotech used. Namely, the pork that tastes sweeter, Kobe beef cuts, less tough beef cuts. Basic breeding takes long, one has to wait for the animals to be the right age and if they like each other. The breeding times are excessive and the pregnancies are long (~11 months for various bovine breeds). And let's not discuss horse breedings.

Chickens are injected directly to generate transgenics. Their process of embryogenesis is fundamentally different from mammalian species because they are from the Avian Kingdom.

The public health concerns of cloned meat, most meats are processed, cured, treated, and mainly cooked. Eating raw meat from fresh kill is unsafe and no government agency purports that. Even milk sold must be pasteurized and homogenize, although raw milk, which contains blood, urine and plenty of microorganisms (Lactobacillus sp. & E. coli (maybe)), I heard tastes delicious but raw milk's safety cannot be guarenteed for consumption--spelled drink at your own risk. A finding by Louis Pasteur in the 19th century.

Then there is this guy Fleming... Kinna discovered Penicillian. And Jacob and Manod--received the Nobel Prize on what exactly is the genetic material, which was DNA. Watson & Crick solved the structure of DNA.

I decided to tell you this because you would respond immaturely to me as others. You clearly are having a neuropsychiatric episode on GC and you may need a vitamin B complexes to supplement your diet. Cecil's Medical Textbook clearly states that these kinds of problems can be solved by consuming vitamin B complexes and rather quickly.

When I get a chance, I will post another "Grand Rounds".

My GC Physicians will be more than happy to assist me in posting MD Consult.

I heart my fellow molecular scientist!

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by BaylorBean

I heart my fellow molecular scientist!

HOW ARE YOU DOING!!!! HOW's School treating you?

Have you finished your qualifying exams and advanced to candidacy?

Let me know if you get your first authored papers, soon!!!

Personally, I going thru IACUC drama...