JENA 6

[shinerbock]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

nobody deserves an @sswhupping...well actually some do...but that is another thread.....heh

BUT...the point is...as they say...the punishment must fit the crime and I think what a lot of people are angry about is that one wrong caused another wrong and so forth and everyone is not getting punished for all the wrong doings going on and the ones that are are being punished far too harshly.

I mean...look at it...there is like a whole bunch of things that happened and kept on happening because obviously, there is a problem and Jena is showing us something that a lot of us in the world (and from what I said earlier this is true) know about the US....that justice peeks under that blindfold from time to time and deals out punishments unfairly.

I'm firmly in the "some people just deserve an ass kicking" camp as well. However, from what I've read most of these kids (white and black) were probably not morally qualified to administer such baseball bat justice.

Let me put it to you this way. Stuff that is happening in Jena today is what keeps people like me from caring. For an analogy...I'm not a huge Bush fan. I'm a Republican, but he pisses me off a lot. However, I'll often battle those who hate him, and refuse to get fired up about their concerns, just because I think they're ridiculous in their attacks. Its similar here. If this wasn't blown up into a sensationalized event with unsavory people suddenly being portrayed as taking the moral high ground...the legal side of me would probably care that something questionable had occurred. But instead I feel that lending my support at this point (although I'm obviously willing to question the justice doled out here), would only strengthen certain elements that I think are absurd.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

I am biased?
Prove it.

OK - this is pretty easy:

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

IM NOT DIRECTLY AFFECTED?

Please.

Hey I have work 2 times as hard to make sure that what I say or what I do will not cause me to lose a job, lose my income and most of all lose my FREEDOM.


This event going on is Jena is nothing NOTHING but a direct reminder that things HAVE NOT changed.....hell, reading your cavalier comments are proof of that already!

I am a target and a statistic every day I walk out of my door.

I am a target and a statistic each time I go out in public because someone is waiting for another of us to ACT OUT to get us on the news as a homicide statistic, a drug user or in jail.

Everytime I go into a class room I lower one stat and barely push up another...because I am one of few who are educated.

Every year I get closer to 40 I do the same....I don't have a rack of kids being taken care of by child support and I am not incarcerated nor am I causing a woman to be on welfare.

Everyday I punch in at 730 and get home at 4pm the same because am not pushing up the unemployment rate.

I got two little nephews who are 3 and 4 I worry about because of the world they are coming into and thankfully THEY TOO are not statistics because GUESS WHAT....thier FATHERS are married to thier MAMAS and LIVING in the home.

But I am not directly affected...yeah ok...believe that dumb stuff if you want.

I cannot tell you how many times I have been pulled aside because "I fit the description" or been told that I need to "watch where I am going..." or been stopped and had an ID checked because I 'didn't belong here"

I mean, it's clear you're biased - in fact, all of us are.

Don't fight the label - just recognize it and work to make sure you try to see the other side. Just like you ask all the white people later in your post.

The issue is unequal application of justice, right? This has gone way beyond that, though, in my opinion - it has partially turned into a spectacle for a few interested parties to take to the soapbox. Whether they use this power for change or for their own self-service is to be seen, and none of us have any authority to say - only time can tell, unfortunately. However, I see no reason to discount the assertion that this may be getting attention for the wrong reasons, in some ways.

Also, shinerbock's point about "taking sides" and inconsistencies in viewpoint with the Durham DA malfeasance is striking - I really sympathize with the Jena kids, because they have strong opponents trying to screw them, but that point made me consider, for the first time, that for some people, it's no longer about what's right, but about what they want (or what makes them famous).

I hope both sets of kids serve the exact same punishment, in scope and degree, and people take an honest look at systems that are corrupt and bankrupt on race issues - not just the Jena schools and the LA legal system, but the way in which we all handle race, from myself to CNN.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

OK - this is pretty easy:



I mean, it's clear you're biased - in fact, all of us are.

Don't fight the label - just recognize it and work to make sure you try to see the other side. Just like you ask all the white people later in your post.

The issue is unequal application of justice, right? This has gone way beyond that, though, in my opinion - it has partially turned into a spectacle for a few interested parties to take to the soapbox. Whether they use this power for change or for their own self-service is to be seen, and none of us have any authority to say - only time can tell, unfortunately. However, I see no reason to discount the assertion that this may be getting attention for the wrong reasons, in some ways.

Also, shinerbock's point about "taking sides" and inconsistencies in viewpoint with the Durham DA malfeasance is striking - I really sympathize with the Jena kids, because they have strong opponents trying to screw them, but that point made me consider, for the first time, that for some people, it's no longer about what's right, but about what they want (or what makes them famous).

I hope both sets of kids serve the exact same punishment, in scope and degree, and people take an honest look at systems that are corrupt and bankrupt on race issues - not just the Jena schools and the LA legal system, but the way in which we all handle race, from myself to CNN.

k sig...thank you...LOL


I knew that I was...just wanted to see if someone could do it.... *wink*

and not to mention your comments are on point

[DSTRen13]

A really interesting article about the issue (not sure if this has been posted before?): http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/7170510

I really haven't done extensive enough research to know whether I support all the claims of the article or not, but I do have to agree with the main point. I can't believe that the people in that town ever let things get this far. What is wrong with people??

[Rudey]

I propose a battle royale.

-Rudey
--But please, I beg you, keep the guns at home.

[Animate]

Originally Posted by DSTRen13

A really interesting article about the issue (not sure if this has been posted before?): http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/7170510

I really haven't done extensive enough research to know whether I support all the claims of the article or not, but I do have to agree with the main point. I can't believe that the people in that town ever let things get this far. What is wrong with people??

I read that article a few weeks ago when it was first posted. It really made me look a few of the things concerning the case differently.

[Sugar08]

Originally Posted by DSTRen13

A really interesting article about the issue (not sure if this has been posted before?): http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/7170510

I really haven't done extensive enough research to know whether I support all the claims of the article or not, but I do have to agree with the main point. I can't believe that the people in that town ever let things get this far. What is wrong with people??

I saw this article too... and even at the end, it addresses the root of this issue: the punishment did not fit the crime. And the only visible answer for why this is so is that the people doing the prosecuting are racist.

I really think this is the bottom line.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by Animate

I read that article a few weeks ago when it was first posted. It really made me look a few of the things concerning the case differently.

I can answer one question...where were the parents?

I listened to the Michael Baisden show a few weeks ago...the father was on there being interviewed...he states that when this went to court...that he nor the boys mom were allowed into the courtroom...they didn't have access to the and it was the grandmother(I believe, if I remember correctly....) that told THEM about the jail sentence

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

I'm firmly in the "some people just deserve an ass kicking" camp as well. However, from what I've read most of these kids (white and black) were probably not morally qualified to administer such baseball bat justice.

Let me put it to you this way. Stuff that is happening in Jena today is what keeps people like me from caring. For an analogy...I'm not a huge Bush fan. I'm a Republican, but he pisses me off a lot. However, I'll often battle those who hate him, and refuse to get fired up about their concerns, just because I think they're ridiculous in their attacks. Its similar here. If this wasn't blown up into a sensationalized event with unsavory people suddenly being portrayed as taking the moral high ground...the legal side of me would probably care that something questionable had occurred. But instead I feel that lending my support at this point (although I'm obviously willing to question the justice doled out here), would only strengthen certain elements that I think are absurd.

I can agree with basically all of that.

I don't think I've commented in this thread very much about the LA justice system except to say that I don't know enough to be able to say such harsh things about unequal treatment, etc.

The media reports I've read have been incredibly slanted to one side of the facts. It's hard in light of the fact that I know the information I'm receiving is slanted to be able to judge whether the prosecutors in this case are doing the right thing. I can easily fit the facts of the case to attempted murder in the 2nd degree. Whether or not that's justified? I dunno.

As to the public defender not calling a single witness, it's a fairly common defense tactic, especially when the prosecution has just called a litany of eye witnesses to simply rely on a vigorous cross examination (if that's even possible) and a plea for mercy in closing. Given the facts, I don't think there is any way to put on a really, really strong defense.. so since I wasn't there, I don't really think it's right to say the defense attorney did a bad job.

[DaemonSeid]

I got a few pics to show...once I get them in photobucket they will come out better

[Sugar08]

Originally Posted by Kevin

The media reports I've read have been incredibly slanted to one side of the facts. It's hard in light of the fact that I know the information I'm receiving is slanted to be able to judge whether the prosecutors in this case are doing the right thing. I can easily fit the facts of the case to attempted murder in the 2nd degree. Whether or not that's justified? I dunno.

It's not.

Originally Posted by Kevin

As to the public defender not calling a single witness, it's a fairly common defense tactic, especially when the prosecution has just called a litany of eye witnesses to simply rely on a vigorous cross examination (if that's even possible) and a plea for mercy in closing. Given the facts, I don't think there is any way to put on a really, really strong defense.. so since I wasn't there, I don't really think it's right to say the defense attorney did a bad job.

Easy to say that, since you weren't there and you have no experience with public defenders. For those of us with family members who have been through the public "justice" system... well, we know that public defenders often do a shoddy job of defense. Granted, it's not always out of malicious intent, sometimes they are simply overworked and underfunded.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by Sugar08

It's not.



Easy to say that, since you weren't there and you have no experience with public defenders. For those of us with family members who have been through the public "justice" system... well, we know that public defenders often do a shoddy job of defense. Granted, it's not always out of malicious intent, sometimes they are simply overworked and underfunded.

Public defenders + Justice = JUST US


and you saying "I don't know" really means you really should have kept your mouth shut and fingers off the keys until you were up to speed with what is happening before you showed your @ss today.

see how easy admitting "I don't know" works?

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Sugar08

It's not.

Okay.. and it was reduced to 2nd degree aggravated battery. So I guess the prosecutor agrees with you.

Easy to say that, since you weren't there and you have no experience with public defenders. For those of us with family members who have been through the public "justice" system... well, we know that public defenders often do a shoddy job of defense. Granted, it's not always out of malicious intent, sometimes they are simply overworked and underfunded.

You tell me what a winning defense strategy would be when there are dozens of eye witnesses to the crime?

[Sugar08]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Okay.. and it was reduced to 2nd degree aggravated battery. So I guess the prosecutor agrees with you.

Sure... after thousands of people had to come together to decry this foolishness. If this had slipped under the radar of the public (like 100 other cases do every day) then I'm sure that boy and the others would have been completely SOL.

Originally Posted by Kevin

You tell me what a winning defense strategy would be when there are dozens of eye witnesses to the crime?

I have no idea. I didn't go to law school.

[nikki1920]

I just think its sad that its taken THIS level of scrutiny to have this case looked at in such a manner.

The less said about Sharpton and Jackson, the better. They DO NOT speak for me, as a black person.

It just seems to me that something was very wrong in how this case was prosecuted, that's all.

I try not to call racism when I see a wrong, but sometimes that's what it is.