Yet another recruitment disappointment...

[33girl]

Originally Posted by bookworm84

I'm not trying to sound mean about this whole process,but nobody really told me why I got cut after my first day.I'm just saying that the sorority chapters need to look at their guidelines and see if anything needs to be changed.I have Asperger's Syndrome,a high functioning form of autism and I was hoping to get into a sorority to improve my social skills.I just thought these sororities would be a little more open minded about having someone like me in their chapter.

Sororities are NOT looking for someone who wants to get something from them - i.e. a tool to help them improve their social skills - they are looking for someone who will GIVE to the group. Your Asperger's syndrome is irrelevant as far as that's concerned - anyone else who said "I want to join a sorority because I suck at interacting with men" or something of the like would receive a similar response from me. If you want to improve your social skills, try a Dale Carnegie course or something else where you can get more concrete instruction on what you're doing wrong.

Saying that the sororities need to change to suit you does not win you any points, and if you're carrying that attitude into rush you will not receive a bid.

Also, as BC mentioned, if your GPA fell below what the sororities require locally and/or nationally, they may have been REQUIRED to cut you and it has zero to do with any interactions you had. Even if you met the GPA requirement that Panhellenic had for women to rush, it may have fallen below what the chapters required. (Yes this is a stupid concept, but that's another thread.)

[kddani]

If you go to a campus with more than say 3 or 4 chapters, and you were cut from every single house on the first day - it was 95% likely that it was solely because of your grades.

[Zillini]

Originally Posted by bookworm84

Is your GPA low? yes,but I plan on bringing it up

Everybody plans on bringing up their GPA. Not everybody does.

Originally Posted by kddani

If you go to a campus with more than say 3 or 4 chapters, and you were cut from every single house on the first day - it was 95% likely that it was solely because of your grades.

This.

[bookworm84]

[QUOTE=Zillini;1859881]Everybody plans on bringing up their GPA. Not everybody does.


I will bring my GPA and I making sure I work extra hard to get that GPA up so I can go through formal recruitment for the winter quarter.I don't need assumptions from people who know nothing about me and my low GPA.If people on this forum want to throw "mud" at me,then that will get you nowhere and you will end up making yourself look bad.Let's see how you feel then.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by bookworm84

I will bring my GPA and I making sure I work extra hard to get that GPA up so I can go through formal recruitment for the winter quarter.I don't need assumptions from people who know nothing about me and my low GPA.If people on this forum want to throw "mud" at me,then that will get you nowhere and you will end up making yourself look bad.Let's see how you feel then.

I really don't think anyone's "throwing mud" at you.

Bottom line, if your GPA does not meet the lowest standard of the individual chapters you will be cut. The chapters don't even have a choice in this matter. I could love Susie PNM and wish my parents had adopted her as a child so we would have been sisters forever but if she doesn't make that minimum GPA, there's not a darned thing I can do to change that and bid her. We don't know if that's what happened, but at this point it would be our best guess.

[Zillini]

Originally Posted by bookworm84

I will bring my GPA and I making sure I work extra hard to get that GPA up so I can go through formal recruitment for the winter quarter.I don't need assumptions from people who know nothing about me and my low GPA.If people on this forum want to throw "mud" at me,then that will get you nowhere and you will end up making yourself look bad.Let's see how you feel then.

No one was "throwing mud", certainly not me. I should have been more specific. Every student, including those without the additional challenges you face, wants to bring up their GPA and not all are successful in doing so. Therefore sororities must base their decisions on what a PNM's GPA currently is, not what the PNM plans/hopes it will be because that may never happen. Everyone here was simply trying to offer the most common explanation of why any PNM gets cut heavily early in the process.

As for your having Aspergers, all I can offer is this. You said earlier that you did not have any Recs which could have offered some insight to the members, nor did you have friends within the Chapters that could have explained. I have to wonder if the Chapter members knew that you have Aspergers and if they did, did they understand what all that entails? It's certainly not something that could be easily explained in the very brief amount of time of a Recruitment party. I confess I know very little about Aspergers and I have been surrounded by children with a variety of special needs and challenges for 12 years due to my daughter. I pressume the collegians you encountered knew even less than me.

I will stop here and will leave the advice to others who are more educated in this matter.

[Big Mama]

hiiiii how are you?????????????????

Originally Posted by Zillini

No one was "throwing mud", certainly not me. I should have been more specific. Every student, including those without the additional challenges you face, wants to bring up their GPA and not all are successful in doing so. Therefore sororities must base their decisions on what a PNM's GPA currently is, not what the PNM plans/hopes it will be because that may never happen. Everyone here was simply trying to offer the most common explanation of why any PNM gets cut heavily early in the process.

As for your having Aspergers, all I can offer is this. You said earlier that you did not have any Recs which could have offered some insight to the members, nor did you have friends within the Chapters that could have explained. I have to wonder if the Chapter members knew that you have Aspergers and if they did, did they understand what all that entails? It's certainly not something that could be easily explained in the very brief amount of time of a Recruitment party. I confess I know very little about Aspergers and I have been surrounded by children with a variety of special needs and challenges for 12 years due to my daughter. I pressume the collegians you encountered knew even less than me.

I will stop here and will leave the advice to others who are more educated in this matter.

[bookworm84]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Sororities are NOT looking for someone who wants to get something from them - i.e. a tool to help them improve their social skills - they are looking for someone who will GIVE to the group. Your Asperger's syndrome is irrelevant as far as that's concerned - anyone else who said "I want to join a sorority because I suck at interacting with men" or something of the like would receive a similar response from me. If you want to improve your social skills, try a Dale Carnegie course or something else where you can get more concrete instruction on what you're doing wrong.

Saying that the sororities need to change to suit you does not win you any points, and if you're carrying that attitude into rush you will not receive a bid.

Also, as BC mentioned, if your GPA fell below what the sororities require locally and/or nationally, they may have been REQUIRED to cut you and it has zero to do with any interactions you had. Even if you met the GPA requirement that Panhellenic had for women to rush, it may have fallen below what the chapters required. (Yes this is a stupid concept, but that's another thread.)

I'm not looking for sympathy on this forum.I am new to my college campus and I really haven't had a chance to see what other organizations are on the campus besides sororities.This is the kind of reaction that I was afraid that would happen.If you walked in my shoes,you would not be saying those mean,hurtful things to me.My disability is difficult enough trying to navigate my everyday life but if there are girls in sororities that act like this,then I don't want to be part of a system that will not accept people like myself because we are "different". I am slower in learning and my GPA is low because the college I transferred from,I didn't finish a class and that lowered my grade quite a bit.Before anyone goes judging people who are different like myself,trying being in my shoes for a day and you'll see how difficult it is to be social and find friends.I have had this problem my entire life and I am getting sick and tired of people telling to take a different avenue to improve my social skills.If you have a problem with me being "different",then that attitude needs to change.I will not be bullied by people who think that they have the right to tell me what else I can do to improve my social skills.That is what my parents are for and they are a lot less judgmental than you are.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by bookworm84

I'm not looking for sympathy on this forum.I am new to my college campus and I really haven't had a chance to see what other organizations are on the campus besides sororities.This is the kind of reaction that I was afraid that would happen.If you walked in my shoes,you would not be saying those mean,hurtful things to me.My disability is difficult enough trying to navigate my everyday life but if there are girls in sororities that act like this,then I don't want to be part of a system that will not accept people like myself because we are "different". I am slower in learning and my GPA is low because the college I transferred from,I didn't finish a class and that lowered my grade quite a bit.Before anyone goes judging people who are different like myself,trying being in my shoes for a day and you'll see how difficult it is to be social and find friends.I have had this problem my entire life and I am getting sick and tired of people telling to take a different avenue to improve my social skills.If you have a problem with me being "different",then that attitude needs to change.I will not be bullied by people who think that they have the right to tell me what else I can do to improve my social skills.That is what my parents are for and they are a lot less judgmental than you are.

No one here is saying that they have a "problem" with you.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by bookworm84

I'm not looking for sympathy on this forum.I am new to my college campus and I really haven't had a chance to see what other organizations are on the campus besides sororities.This is the kind of reaction that I was afraid that would happen.If you walked in my shoes,you would not be saying those mean,hurtful things to me.My disability is difficult enough trying to navigate my everyday life but if there are girls in sororities that act like this,then I don't want to be part of a system that will not accept people like myself because we are "different". I am slower in learning and my GPA is low because the college I transferred from,I didn't finish a class and that lowered my grade quite a bit.Before anyone goes judging people who are different like myself,trying being in my shoes for a day and you'll see how difficult it is to be social and find friends.I have had this problem my entire life and I am getting sick and tired of people telling to take a different avenue to improve my social skills.If you have a problem with me being "different",then that attitude needs to change.I will not be bullied by people who think that they have the right to tell me what else I can do to improve my social skills.That is what my parents are for and they are a lot less judgmental than you are.

I have no problem with you being different. I have a huge problem with you saying that the sorority rush system needs to change because of it, and with you saying you want to use a sorority as a tool to improve your social skills (although I'm hoping you don't mean it quite like that, that is how it came out).

As another poster stated, for better or worse, much of formal sorority rush is based on first impressions formed very quickly. That's just the way it is. If you don't do well in that sort of environment, you are going to have problems in sorority rush - and there are lots of people who don't have Asperger's who also aren't great at first impressions that go through the same thing.

Like many posters said, the GPA thing is something sororities just aren't allowed to budge on. Even if the most perfect person in the world goes through rush, if the minimum required is 2.9 and she only has a 2.4, she won't receive a bid. Those rules can't be changed for you just because you have a disability.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by 33girl

If you want to improve your social skills, try a Dale Carnegie course or something else where you can get more concrete instruction on what you're doing wrong.

Originally Posted by Blue Skies

At parties, practice walking up to friendly-looking students (male and female.) Smile, look that person in the eye and say, "Hi, I'm so-and-so, what's your name?" Then ask them conventional questions about their hometowns, major, interests, etc. to get the ball rolling. If you are at a party at someone's house, ask, "How do you know our host/hostess?"

I know I'm lane swerving here, but, oh well . . .

As the father of a kid with Asperger's, I can tell you that these kinds of suggestion are great for someone who is shy or simply socially uncomfortable or inept. For someone with Asperger's, not so much at all.

It's not just a matter of "concrete instruction what you're doing wrong," or "getting the ball rolling"; it's about learning a completely new way to communicate. The best description I have heard is that it's like being dropped into a foreign country where you don't speak the language, even though everyone assumes you do and talks around you as if you do. You have to learn what facial expressions and body language mean, what social cues mean, how to interpret non-literal language (sarcasm, irony, figures of speech) or voice inflections. And saying "look that person in the eye" is so much easier said than done. For some people with Asperger's that is incredibly uncomfortable and difficult; it's one of the most common traits of Asperger's.

bookworm84, I'm sorry your recuitment experience didn't turn out they way you hoped. For what it's worth, I didn't read your posts as expecting the system to change for you, as showing any kind of chip on your shoulder or entitlement-queen approach, or as using Asperger's as a crutch. I read your posts as trying to understand what happened and as experiencing recruitment as just the latest instance of trying to find a place you fit in and grow, only to be rejected because you're not what others consider "normal." I understand that even if that's not the actual reason things didn't work out, it probably has happened enough times before that it can be hard to see things any other way. (I can't tell you how many times I've had to try to help my son understand that others were not making fun of him but rather that he was misinterpreting what they were saying.)

As others have said, no one here can tell you why you were cut after the first day for two reasons: (1) No one here was there and (2) membership selection is private. But as others have also said, it very could well be grades. Even if you're planning to bring them up, sororities have a minimum, and they cannot pledge someone whose grades fall below that minimum. It's the rule.

Good luck. I hope you find places at college -- maybe including a sorority, if that works out later on -- where you feel comfortable and at home.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I know I'm lane swerving here, but, oh well . . .

As the father of a kid with Asperger's, I can tell you that these kinds of suggestion are great for someone who is shy or simply socially uncomfortable or inept. For someone with Asperger's, not so much at all.

It's not just a matter of "concrete instruction what you're doing wrong," or "getting the ball rolling"; it's about learning a completely new way to communicate. The best description I have heard is that it's like being dropped into a foreign country where you don't speak the language, even though everyone assumes you do and talks around you as if you do. You have to learn what facial expressions and body language mean, what social cues mean, how to interpret non-literal language (sarcasm, irony, figures of speech) or voice inflections. And saying "look that person in the eye" is so much easier said than done. For some people with Asperger's that is incredibly uncomfortable and difficult; it's one of the most common traits of Asperger's.

bookworm84, I'm sorry your recuitment experience didn't turn out they way you hoped. For what it's worth, I didn't read your posts as expecting the system to change for you, as showing any kind of chip on your shoulder or entitlement-queen approach, or as using Asperger's as a crutch. I read your posts as trying to understand what happened and as experiencing recruitment as just the latest instance of trying to find a place you fit in and grow, only to be rejected because you're not what others consider "normal." I understand that even if that's not the actual reason things didn't work out, it probably has happened enough times before that it can be hard to see things any other way. (I can't tell you how many times I've had to try to help my son understand that others were not making fun of him but rather that he was misinterpreting what they were saying.)

As others have said, no one here can tell you why you were cut after the first day for two reasons: (1) No one here was there and (2) membership selection is private. But as others have also said, it very could well be grades. Even if you're planning to bring them up, sororities have a minimum, and they cannot pledge someone whose grades fall below that minimum. It's the rule.

Good luck. I hope you find places at college -- maybe including a sorority, if that works out later on -- where you feel comfortable and at home.

MysticCat...Thanks for the lane swerve. I think you have some invaluable experience from the Asperger's point of view. Of course we don't know what happened, but we can infer that the issue was multifaceted.

Bookworm, formal recruitment can be difficult for people with a good understanding of social cues. It's that much more difficult when your grades are not up to par. I encourage you to work on your grades. If you really want to make greek life part of yours, meet some sisters. Get to know them one on one. There may be other ways to join a sorority on your campus that don't require you to make such quick impressions that would put you at a disadvantage. Unfortunately, sorority recruitment can be heartless when you aren't known except as the sorta strange girl. Because you have Asperger's, you may be at a disadvantage going in if you don't have a prior relationship to show them who you are underneath the first impression. Good luck getting your grades up and trying again if that's what you want to do.

[33girl]

MC, I was hoping you would lane swerve. I only suggested Dale Carnegie because I believe they have options for one on one instruction and thought maybe it could be tailored. My whole point was, no matter who you are or what disability you do or don't possess, joining a sorority to, in effect, use it as a means to your personal end is not cool. Like I said though, I hope she didn't mean that quite as coldly as it came out.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by 33girl

MC, I was hoping you would lane swerve. I only suggested Dale Carnegie because I believe they have options for one on one instruction and thought maybe it could be tailored. My whole point was, no matter who you are or what disability you do or don't possess, joining a sorority to, in effect, use it as a means to your personal end is not cool. Like I said though, I hope she didn't mean that quite as coldly as it came out.

Thanks 33girl (and AOIIAngel) for not minding my butting into an NPC recruitment thread.

As I think about it, perhaps a Dale Carnegie-type thing might be useful for some people, if the instructor has real knowledge of Asperger's. That's key, I think, because it really isn't just a matter of social skills per se, it's a matter of experiencing the world in an entirely different way.

I see your point about the "coolness" aspect, as it were, but I think I can see where she was coming from, too. (And personally I doubt she meant it as bluntly as it came across to you.) To some extent or another, we all I think join groups like GLOs with two things in mind -- what we have to offer the group and what we hope to get out of the group. For some people, what they hope to get out of the group is simply fun or good times, but I'm betting lots of us have a more basic desire to belong somewhere. We tout GLO membership as a way to learn things like leadership skills, and there actually was a time in the not so distant past when GLOs were touted as places to learn social skills (manners and the like). I don't think it's surprising that some people would see GLOs as a place to learn to be more comfortable in social settings. Part of the total package, I think.

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Bookworm . . . If you really want to make greek life part of yours, meet some sisters. Get to know them one on one. There may be other ways to join a sorority on your campus that don't require you to make such quick impressions that would put you at a disadvantage.

If I were to offer advice to someone in her position, I think this is the advice I would offer. Again, speaking from personal experience, I know that the times my son is most successful is when has become good friends with one or two kids who then can provide some entré to (and security in) the larger group. To go back to my earlier comparison about being dropped down somewhere where you don't speak the language, it's like having a guide/interpreter to help you along until you're ready to take it on yourself.

Again, good luck bookworm!