Gays in fraternites (pt. 2)

[jlenoconel]

I know this has been discussed before, but I wanted to hear how people felt about gays in fraternities in 2008? I read a lot of the homophobic remarks by some user on other pages and was quite shocked. I kinda expected people to be homophobic, but think its funny that a lot of the guys think that they are superior to gays in some way. I myself am gay, but don't particularly like the stereotype or anything that is portrayed in the media about gays. Anyway, what I wanted to say is that people shouldn't be ashamed of their sexuality, or be made to feel uncomfortable or alienated because of it. Obviously if the dude doesn't fit in with the fraternity because he has different ideals is a different thing, but that is a separate thing from being homosexual.

The only reason a guy should be afraid if another man were to make a pass at him, which is normal if you're gay, is if that guy is unable to clarify that he is straight for some reason, and is afraid he may give into sexual urges. I do understand people being uncomfortable about certain things about gay life, but this whole elitist attitude thing is stupid. Wake up people!

James

[macallan25]

Nobody needs to wake up.

Some people highly object to homosexuality and don't want anything to do with it. Some are accepting. Some aren't. Some find it highly immoral. Some don't.

[bowsandtoes]

We don't have gays in our fraternity. It's not because we hate gays. They're just different than us. When rushing we seek out young men who have similar interests, goals, and morals as we do; homosexuality doesn't fall in that scope.

I know plenty of gay people, they're nice to me and I am nice to them in return. That said, I'm not friends with any of them, mostly for the same reasons I wouldn't rush any of them.

[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by bowsandtoes

We don't have gays in our fraternity. It's not because we hate gays. They're just different than us. When rushing we seek out young men who have similar interests, goals, and morals as we do; homosexuality doesn't fall in that scope.

That's what a lot of men in elite southern fraternities think. Emphasis on think. You may be surprised what you find out after graduation.

Speaking from experience here.

[couggirl]

I graduated a while ago and don't really have too much knowledge about gays in fraternaties, but I just wanted to make a comment.

I volunteer with the teen program at my local Library. there is this one guy who comes from a very conservative christian family, I know them and in general like the parents and sibling of this guy but dislike their hatred for homosexuals. This guy who is 16 will treat the 2 guys that he knows are gay like crap. But there are 2 guys who are gay (the teens seem to tell me all their personal issues) that this guys treats like everyone else, ie normal, friendly, ect. I have repeatedly talked to him about his behavior because the teen program should be a place where people feel comfortable and I have explained that he is free to think whatever he likes, but to just ignore the 2 gay guys. I mean, not go out of his way to be mean or rude to them and that he in no way has to be friend with them but treating them like human beings. the big joke in my opinion is that the 2 guys that are gay that have not come out of the closet to him he is good friends with and is really nice too. I have tried to explain his behavior without giving away the 2 "closeted" guys identity. I am sorry, but I just don't understand this behavior from anyone.

If you think that being gay is immoral of wrong or something thats fine, but really it does not mean that you should treat some one like crap because of it, especially since you might not even know what is really going on in someones personal life.

[jlenoconel]

Well, its kind of ridiculous! You won't find me kissing anyone's feet to get into a fraternity. I object to heterosexuality, its immoral and not in the scope of what I find acceptable in my little cliques! Oh please, someone's sexuality is their business. Just because someone is gay doesn't mean they don't have the same interests as you do. Stuck up, egotistical idiots!

[jlenoconel]

People need to wake up. I will NEVER join a fraternity! The word sounds gay in its self anyway, a bunch of dudes doing a whole lot of male bonding... hmmmmm!

[icelandelf]

Originally Posted by jlenoconel

People need to wake up. I will NEVER join a fraternity! The word sounds gay in its self anyway, a bunch of dudes doing a whole lot of male bonding... hmmmmm!

Then James, why, may I ask, are you posting here? We have people on this site that are heterosexual, homosexual, etc. Some are outspoken and some are not. But their common focus is that they are members or potential members of a variety of Greek organizations. If you have no intention of being considered for a fraternity, then why are you here?

[rufio]

one of my brothers is openly gay. its not a big deal. the only real problem is that nobody likes his movie selections on porn n' chicken night.

look, if a fraternity doesn't accept you because of who you are, then why would you want to make them your brothers.

also, why come on a greek message board asking to hear people's opinions, then go around insulting not only the people, but the entire greek system, when you hear answers you don't like.

[SAEalumnus]

Originally Posted by jlenoconel

Well, its kind of ridiculous! You won't find me kissing anyone's feet to get into a fraternity. I object to heterosexuality, its immoral and not in the scope of what I find acceptable in my little cliques! Oh please, someone's sexuality is their business. Just because someone is gay doesn't mean they don't have the same interests as you do. Stuck up, egotistical idiots!

Interests that include joining fraternities...? And let's try to keep the name calling to a minimum, thanks.

Originally Posted by jlenoconel

People need to wake up. I will NEVER join a fraternity! The word sounds gay in its self anyway, a bunch of dudes doing a whole lot of male bonding... hmmmmm!

...evidently not. Your comments lack any real argumentative logic and sound instead more like sour grapes. If the word 'fraternity' sounds gay, then why would a gay man describe it with that kind of negative connotation? You'd think you'd want to join in that case. The word 'fraternity' shares the same etymology as 'brother' and 'kinsman' and is suggestive of a family, which is in a sense one of the functions our organizations serve.

Originally Posted by icelandelf

Then James, why, may I ask, are you posting here? We have people on this site that are heterosexual, homosexual, etc. Some are outspoken and some are not. But their common focus is that they are members or potential members of a variety of Greek organizations. If you have no intention of being considered for a fraternity, then why are you here?

Originally Posted by rufio

one of my brothers is openly gay. its not a big deal. the only real problem is that nobody likes his movie selections on porn n' chicken night.

look, if a fraternity doesn't accept you because of who you are, then why would you want to make them your brothers.

also, why come on a greek message bored asking to hear people's opinions, then go around insulting not only the people, but the entire greek system, when you hear answers you don't like.

You may find you get a better response from people by understanding their perspective and making an effort to have a rational discussion. This is a skill that fraternity and sorority members learn early.

[BigRedBeta]

One of my pledge brothers came out after graduation. It's changed absolutely nothing - except perhaps that's he probably more fun to be around now simply because he's happier in general. One of my little brother's roommates (from freshman year) came out to his pledge class during Initiation week, and if anything, they're pledge class became more closely-knit because of it while they hid it from the upper classmen. Now he's openly gay, and very few people have a problem with it.

It should be noted that neither of these guys acts stereotypically gay (even though it really wasn't a surprise when my pledge brother came out - he was one of those guys that could have gone either way and no one would have batted an eye). They're not effeminate, they don't have a lisp, and while they may dress slightly better than everyone else, they're still in line with the mainstream fashion as you'd find it in Nebraska.

Would my chapter rush a stereotypical gay guy? With one openly gay brother in the active chapter - probably more likely than it was before, but I have to agree that how a person "fits in" matters as someone said before, and I don't see many stereotypical gay guys fitting in well enough to get a bid. But if they did, I don't think it would be an issue.

Finally to say that homosexuals can't have the same interests and goals as heterosexuals is RIDICULOUSLY ignorant.

[jlenoconel]

I apologize for offending anyone. The reasons that I posted this is because of the amount of people who say things like "fraternities are no place for gays."
Its up to people how they generally feel about a certain subject I agree, and I believe people should keep their sexuality private. I am pretty certain their have been romantic exchanges or whatever between same-sex members of a fraternity, but they probably keep it secret. I would probably be one of these people. Not that I want to join a fraternity at all or for this reason i.e. because I think fraternity guys are hot. I respect people's decisions.

James

[catiebug]

Again - if you have no interest in joining a fraternity and no interest in fraternity life, then why are you here?

Originally Posted by jlenoconel

I apologize for offending anyone. The reasons that I posted this is because of the amount of people who say things like "fraternities are no place for gays."
Its up to people how they generally feel about a certain subject I agree, and I believe people should keep their sexuality private. I am pretty certain their have been romantic exchanges or whatever between same-sex members of a fraternity, but they probably keep it secret. I would probably be one of these people. Not that I want to join a fraternity at all or for this reason i.e. because I think fraternity guys are hot. I respect people's decisions.

James

[jon1856]

Originally Posted by BigRedBeta

One of my pledge brothers came out after graduation. It's changed absolutely nothing - except perhaps that's he probably more fun to be around now simply because he's happier in general. One of my little brother's roommates (from freshman year) came out to his pledge class during Initiation week, and if anything, they're pledge class became more closely-knit because of it while they hid it from the upper classmen. Now he's openly gay, and very few people have a problem with it.

It should be noted that neither of these guys acts stereotypically gay (even though it really wasn't a surprise when my pledge brother came out - he was one of those guys that could have gone either way and no one would have batted an eye). They're not effeminate, they don't have a lisp, and while they may dress slightly better than everyone else, they're still in line with the mainstream fashion as you'd find it in Nebraska.

Would my chapter rush a stereotypical gay guy? With one openly gay brother in the active chapter - probably more likely than it was before, but I have to agree that how a person "fits in" matters as someone said before, and I don't see many stereotypical gay guys fitting in well enough to get a bid. But if they did, I don't think it would be an issue.

Finally to say that homosexuals can't have the same interests and goals as heterosexuals is RIDICULOUSLY ignorant.

Not only did two of my Brothers come out after graduation (and both prior to and after-wards were part of the Chapter), a third had a sex change operation.

And IIRC the studies and reports correctly, something like between 3-10% of all people are gay. Something to think about next time you are in a room, bar, club et al with 99 other people.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by bowsandtoes

We don't have gays in our fraternity.

haha

None of our organizations' screening processes reach that far.