This is what Greek Life ISN'T!!!!!!

[mylife]

Originally posted by decadence
For a start she didn't post it with any indentifying details of the sender AT ALL. And so damn WHAT if she was looking for a little moral support after getting a nasty e-poison pen letter like that??!! Geez starting up a chapter/interest group/whatever is HARD people and if people can't come here with the good and the bad or just to get something off their chest then I for one think it's a real SHAME.

I wish people wouldn't post things like 'Perhaps her analysis of the situation is accurate." that is n-o-t-n-i-c-e! If you feel like typing something downright mean do us all a favour and click delete before you send or PM it to me and I'll delete the thing!!

-- Richard

So if we don't agree with the author of the thread, we can't say anything?

[pinkyphimu]

ok, so what if she is looking for some sympathy or some morale support....isn't that what we do for each other around here??? people post things all the time to get opinions or help!

[lauren1234]

This post is hilarious! Now, what sense does it make for people to knock those of us who are against this post and say how it's mean, belittling, or whatever that we don't see the point in posting something like this.

It's funny how no one thought they were being rude, mean, belittling, etc, when they posted 3 pages about "Abby" and said ALL sorts of terrible things about someone they don't even know!

[Senusret I]

@ Lauren.....exactly.

@ mylife....guess not.

[decadence]

So if we don't agree with the author of the thread, we can't say anything?

Yes of course you can comment if you don't agree. That's not what I said at all. It's a sign of emotional maturity and good communication skills to do it without being mean, nasty or hurtful though. The distinction isn't unclear. It's also not that damn hard to disagree with someone without being unecessarily unpleasant about it.

It's funny how no one thought they were being rude, mean, belittling, etc, when they posted 3 pages about "Abby" and said ALL sorts of terrible things about someone they don't even know! Yeah terribly unjustified wasn't it <- sarcasm.

Let's see an except from that original email shall we? Yeah, LETS :
you don't have an once of what it takes to be in a sorority and much less to make one. You lack motivation, self drive, and in a nut shell personality. You could not stick it out for 2 weeks to have someone expect something from you. So in what world do you think that anyone would want to help you, for long if any, if they can see the weakness in you. And by the way to be a sister you have to have sisters. So get a life.
And then take a look at the comments which lead you to infer, as you did, that GC people were being "rude, mean, belittling". The thread comments say she sounds ignorant (of basic courtesy we assume...) or that the sender of the email SOUNDS bitter (and you're questioning THAT????!!) or that what she did was totally uncouth (again surely not under debate??). To put it bluntly... God only knows how you can try to imply you're comparing like with like when comparing the venomous personal attack of the email to commentary condemning it here.

-- Richard
<paraphrase> All that is required for evil to flourish is for good 'men' to do nothing. Winston Churchill (I think).

[mylife]

Originally posted by decadence
So if we don't agree with the author of the thread, we can't say anything?

Yes of course you can comment if you don't agree. That's not what I said at all. It's a sign of emotional maturity and good communication skills to do it without being mean, nasty or hurtful though. The distinction isn't unclear. It's also not that damn hard to disagree with someone without being unecessarily unpleasant about it.

It's funny how no one thought they were being rude, mean, belittling, etc, when they posted 3 pages about "Abby" and said ALL sorts of terrible things about someone they don't even know! Yeah terribly unjustified wasn't it <- sarcasm.

Let's see an except from that original email shall we? Yeah, LETS :
you don't have an once of what it takes to be in a sorority and much less to make one. You lack motivation, self drive, and in a nut shell personality. You could not stick it out for 2 weeks to have someone expect something from you. So in what world do you think that anyone would want to help you, for long if any, if they can see the weakness in you. And by the way to be a sister you have to have sisters. So get a life.
And then take a look at the comments which lead you to infer, as you did, that GC people were being "rude, mean, belittling". The thread comments say she sounds ignorant (of basic courtesy we assume...) or that the sender of the email SOUNDS bitter (and you're questioning THAT????!!) or that what she did was totally uncouth (again surely not under debate??). To put it bluntly... God only knows how you can try to imply you're comparing like with like when comparing the venomous personal attack of the email to commentary condemning it here.

-- Richard
<paraphrase> All that is required for evil to flourish is for good 'men' to do nothing. Winston Churchill (I think).

So basically some people are being no better than Abby was by putting up nasty comments about her. Abby's letter was a little.... out of line, but why are you beating up people for questioning why the letter was posted. It was just a question.

[Senusret I]

You know what, mean or not, "Abby" knows her. We don't. There are two sides to every story, and posting your dirty laundry on a greek message board isn't exactly productive. That is business to be handled off-line, in the real world, like ladies. And if "Abby" couldn't be a lady about it, then rhosigmazeta had the responsibility to be lady enough for the both of them. That, to me, is what being Greek is all about, taking the high ground no matter what.

I for one do have a concern when a new organization has to come to the internet for support and morale. Most of our organizations certainly didn't have that luxury. There are public libraries with Baird's Manual...in fact, my school had two. If you want to learn about expansion, history, all that...it's there.

Heck, I bet the best selling Greek book out there is probably In Search of Sisterhood: Delta Sigma Theta and the Challenge of the Black Sorority Movement. I'm not saying to run out and copy DST...I am saying that if you want to learn about some women who had what it took to start something new, read that. I'm a man, and I enjoyed the book, too.

And just so you all will know that I'm not coming out of left-field with this, yes, I have PMed the original poster with my concerns.

It doesn't bother me that prospective rushees come to GC seeking information or guidance. But it does bother me that the founders of an organization don't seem to have the independence to go about this on their own until at least the organization has been properly founded.

[decadence]

So basically some people are being no better than Abby was by putting up nasty comments about her. Abby's letter was a little.... out of line, but why are you beating up people for questioning why the letter was posted. It was just a question.
Shortest way to respond is if I say read my sig. (in the post you referred to).

---------
[carnation] Does the name "Rainbowbrightcs" ring a bell?
[Dionysus] Do a search, la la la.

Ok, I did and I'm totally lost Rainbowbrightcs's posts were nothing out of the ordinary? Several posts in the Chitchat forum - perfectly normal being as it's one of the most popular forums here. Greek life posts like Thread: I'm a Brother! Go you! that is really cool." or Thread: Websites "well i have some ideas for you..." or rush posts like "These are why I am going to Rush. I want the love and life long friends. I want to cry on some ones shoulder and have them cry on mine. I want them to change me for the better. I want to make a difference in the community (if not the world) I want to give and receive. I want to be 65 and have my college room mate come to dinner. I want to walk in to a room with stranger and have them come up to me becuase they know I am in XYZ. I don't want to be afraid of going up to a stranger becuase she is an alumni of XYZ!"
Honestly, what am I meant to be looking for?? She's helpful and supportive to other GC members, rushing for some of what most GC'ers would consider the "right" reasons. I'm just lost by that suggestion Carnation & Dionysus.

[decadence]

Sorry dardenr, I have to take issue with most of what you've posted.

You know what, mean or not, "Abby" knows her. We don't. There are two sides to every story, and posting your dirty laundry on a greek message board isn't exactly productive.
I have never met her. But an email like that is never okay. Yes, there are always two sides, but it is extremely unlikely any of that email was 'called for'. Perhaps it isn't productive, perhaps she was looking for support or empathy from people in the same position, or who have been in the same position as her (involved in setting up a GLO or have been).

That is business to be handled off-line, in the real world, like ladies. And if "Abby" couldn't be a lady about it, then rhosigmazeta had the responsibility to be lady enough for the both of them. That, to me, is what being Greek is all about, taking the high ground no matter what.
It is not for me to question what Greek life means to you, I don't doubt you're a credit to your founders; but it is also important to take a bull by the horns and tackle prejudices and animosity head on. Compassion and humility cost nothing.

I for one do have a concern when a new organization has to come to the internet for support and morale. Most of our organizations certainly didn't have that luxury. There are public libraries with Baird's Manual...in fact, my school had two. If you want to learn about expansion, history, all that...it's there..
It doesn't bother me that prospective rushees come to GC seeking information or guidance. But it does bother me that the founders of an organization don't seem to have the independence to go about this on their own until at least the organization has been properly founded..
I have to disagree strongly. It's a long hard slog to get a fraternity or sorority group up and running, not seeking advice from those who have been there seems odd to me - just reinventing the wheel. Yes create something new, put something of yourself in it but having the humility to seek advice is not a bad thing. Granted most organisations did not have the luxury of such Internet forums, although many were formed up to a century or more ago, it is also likely they also did not have similar non-technological support networks. But such opportunities exist today. I doubt that Baird's manual (I have not read it for availability reasons but understand it to have details like chapter size, date info, emblems etc) would answer most of the questions facing a potential interest group/GLO founder today. Once you're established and have recognition and a healthy amount of members you are in a MUCH easier position, you can do more, have more options, resources, etc.
Your comment "But it does bother me that the founders of an organization don't seem to have the independence to go about this on their own until at least the organization has been properly founded.." hits me the hardest.
I'm trying - as many of you know - to start a chapter of a Greek Letter Organisation. If I want some advice from someone on my campus about setting up a fraternity etc, TOUGH. If I want to speak to someone who is or has been in a sorority or fraternity, TOUGH. Not all of us are surrounded by the advantage of having Greek life on campus or positive greek role models on our campus or in our geographical region - I for one am not. And that's one of the reasons I post here, why I've read so many hundreds or thousands of threads, because fantastic as the international organisation I aspire to affiliate my interest group to are, I don't want to go running to them every 'five minutes' I have a question I cannot answer on my own. I'm not sure what you mean by properly founded I guess you mean an established recognised group on campus. Dardendr, if everyone waited to reach that point before not going at it solely on their own (ie asking for help) then progression (new GLOs/chapters) in the Greek world would never happen. It's not only ideas for interest parties, academic programming, community service ideas etc which an aspiring founder or embryonic interest group might seek here - sometimes it's just a little support. That's why wishinhopin's thread is long. People need that. It's hard sometimes starting up, facing barren meeting rooms where one/two or even zero people turn up, spending your own $$ on advertising, refreshments, amazing amounts of time and it takes so long to see results it's no wonder people need support. Lack of interest early on doesn't mean your idea of starting a group is a bad idea and as a prospective founder, though you believe in your idea you sometimes can't help but wonder whether other people do too or whether it's never gonna work. That's why a pep talk comes in handy sometimes, or reading a story of how someone else 'made it'. The starter of this original thread has begun to start a group, created a website, someday hopefully she'll have the sisters she desires; it doesn't mean in the meantime she'd be ill-advised to seek and listen to others' experiences of the same thing.

This is way long so apologies for that but I really felt this.

-- Richard.

[Dionysus]

Originally posted by decadence

---------
[carnation] Does the name "Rainbowbrightcs" ring a bell?
[Dionysus] Do a search, la la la.

Ok, I did and I'm totally lost Rainbowbrightcs's posts were nothing out of the ordinary? Several posts in the Chitchat forum - perfectly normal being as it's one of the most popular forums here. Greek life posts like Thread: I'm a Brother! Go you! that is really cool." or Thread: Websites "well i have some ideas for you..." or rush posts like "These are why I am going to Rush. I want the love and life long friends. I want to cry on some ones shoulder and have them cry on mine. I want them to change me for the better. I want to make a difference in the community (if not the world) I want to give and receive. I want to be 65 and have my college room mate come to dinner. I want to walk in to a room with stranger and have them come up to me becuase they know I am in XYZ. I don't want to be afraid of going up to a stranger becuase she is an alumni of XYZ!"
Honestly, what am I meant to be looking for?? She's helpful and supportive to other GC members, rushing for some of what most GC'ers would consider the "right" reasons. I'm just lost by that suggestion Carnation & Dionysus.

I didn't find much either. I assumed by doing a search, one would find out what carnation was talking about. Maybe it was deleted.

That's why I said "do a search".

[Senusret I]

I understand your points. Good luck to you and the original poster.

[texas*princess]

Originally posted by Dionysus
I didn't find much either. I assumed by doing a search, one would find out what carnation was talking about. Maybe it was deleted.

That's why I said "do a search".

I did a search too and came up with the same thing.. maybe carnation knows what's going on

[ChaosDST]

Originally posted by kddani
While you all may or may not agree as to whether or not it was kosher for her to have posted this message (everyone, of course, is entitled to their opinions), does it make you feel good to belittle the poster and to embarass her?

What purpose does that accomplish?

She hasn't done anything to warrant that- she hasn't insulted anyone here or been rude. There's no reason for anyone to do that to her.

Who is belittling anyone?

Some of you are just way too sensitive......

[GeekyPenguin]

I don't even know what is going on here - I feel like the Earpman!

I think the girl who sent that email was really rude, but let's face it, sororities are catty, esp. at smaller schools where Greek Life isn't that big of a deal.

And I have no clue what this rainbowbrightCS thing is about - carnation, care to elaborate?

[ChaosDST]

Originally posted by decadence
For a start she didn't post it with any indentifying details of the sender AT ALL. And so damn WHAT if she was looking for a little moral support after getting a nasty e-poison pen letter like that??!! Geez starting up a chapter/interest group/whatever is HARD people and if people can't come here with the good and the bad or just to get something off their chest then I for one think it's a real SHAME.

I wish people wouldn't post things like 'Perhaps her analysis of the situation is accurate." that is n-o-t-n-i-c-e! If you feel like typing something downright mean do us all a favour and click delete before you send or PM it to me and I'll delete the thing!!

-- Richard

I'm the one who posted "perhaps her analysis of the situation is accurate."

Just for your reading pleasure, I'll say it again:

Perhaps her analysis of the situation is accurate. You all are extremely sensitive and are rallying behind a cause for which you have limited background.

So, get over the fact that my words were n-o-t-n-i-c-e.