Cardinal Rule Broken by Our Greek Advisor ;-(

[33girl]

I'm just amused at everyone who is FAR past school age who is treating "10 years ago" like it's "100 years ago." Of course, someone who notably isn't is the OP, who as a collegian, has more of a natural inclination than anyone else to do so.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Since GC NPCers are quick to tell usernames that they cannot join one NPC sorority and then join another NPC sorority/

I am pretty sure most of these GCers would advocate submitting an inquiry to a NHQ if this new Dean claimed to be an initiate of 2 NPC sororities. Those GCers may not recommend a student be the one doing the investigating but they may be in favor of an anonymous (and relatively effortless) membership verification and/or report to an NHQ--or recommending the student hand the task to a nonstudent NPCer. Perhaps those GCers would not believe an NPCer who claims she was given permission to be initiated in 2 NPC sororities 10 years ago. Perhaps those GCers would also grasp why this dishonesty (on the Dean's part) or inconsistency (on the NPC sorority's part if the Dean is telling the truth) may contrast on both a personal and professional level with the Dean's roles at the institution.

*applause*

and

I want to know what sorority she's in.

[adpiucf]

First World Problems.

I've missed you, GC.

[Senusret I]

I want to know which NPHC organization it is.

[sigmagirl2000]

It seems interesting to me that the OP said that this woman's experience and education blew everyone else out of the water? This leads me to believe she was likely in a similar position in previous institutions. (Though I could be completely wrong?). OP, was this a potential issue at her previous place of employment? Were both councils represented there? Both chapters to which she is a "member"? I find it hard to believe that if it were a big deal with either chapter or council, that it wouldn't have already come out in to the open if she is so forthcoming about her membership in both groups. (It also makes me question her ability to advise NCP groups since it seems that she feels membership in such organizations is only 4 years and not as "serious" (I think that's the wrong word, but not coming up with anything better) as NPHC membership.

I guess that doesn't really answer anything. This is one of those rough situations. You don't want to be the whistle blower, yet I can see NPC and NPHC groups alike not being thrilled with the OP for knowing of the dual membership and not saying anything if it comes out in the future.

[NutBrnHair]

The NPC UA states:

“A woman who is or who has ever been an initiated member of an existing NPC fraternity shall not be eligible for membership in another NPC fraternity.”

A member group might have a policy that is more strict, but she didn't break an NPC Unanimous Agreement by joining an NPHC group.

[DubaiSis]

Interesting. So although many of us find it distasteful, it isn't actually breaking a rule as stated. Probably back in the day NPC considered it a non-issue and hasn't been contested with them to date. If this is your sorority (I didn't read from the original that it is but I might have missed something), you might ask them for their input, but otherwise, it sounds like it is merely distasteful and not actually against the rules. I would try to change your mindset to one that values her variety of experience instead of treating it like an unfaithful spouse. It sounds like you otherwise like her so I'd try to get over it.

[Greek_or_Geek?]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

Interesting. So although many of us find it distasteful, it isn't actually breaking a rule as stated. Probably back in the day NPC considered it a non-issue and hasn't been contested with them to date. If this is your sorority (I didn't read from the original that it is but I might have missed something), you might ask them for their input, but otherwise, it sounds like it is merely distasteful and not actually against the rules. I would try to change your mindset to one that values her variety of experience instead of treating it like an unfaithful spouse. It sounds like you otherwise like her so I'd try to get over it.

That's not exactly correct. From this thread, while it may not be against the rules of NPC organizations, we know it is specifically against the rules of at least one NPHC organization.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by Greek_or_Geek?

That's not exactly correct. From this thread, while it may not be against the rules of NPC organizations, we know it is specifically against the rules of at least one NPHC organization.

Right.

And even in those NPHC organizations who do have rules against it, there are those chapters who willfully break the rules because they like the person, or because the applicant downplays what type of organization it was, or outright lies, etc.

I know plenty of great people who made mistakes in undergrad (not the least of which is pledging the "wrong" organization), but you have to live with those mistakes.

If just one NPHC organization allows this, it really, really damages the entire system in more ways than one.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

Interesting. So although many of us find it distasteful, it isn't actually breaking a rule as stated. Probably back in the day NPC considered it a non-issue and hasn't been contested with them to date. If this is your sorority (I didn't read from the original that it is but I might have missed something), you might ask them for their input, but otherwise, it sounds like it is merely distasteful and not actually against the rules. I would try to change your mindset to one that values her variety of experience instead of treating it like an unfaithful spouse. It sounds like you otherwise like her so I'd try to get over it.

It was not breaking an NPC rule but whether it was breaking the NPHC sorority rule remains to be seen (even if the person claims that she was told that it does not break the rules). Based on websites alone, Delta is the only NPHC sorority that explicitly states that applicants cannot be a member of another NPHC or NPC sorority.*** I did not find this on the other NPHC sororities' websites. They may state this during rush/informational or to applicants in another fashion, including verbal and written form. Or, they may let anyone in who in they like and let people slip through the cracks--as SenusretI was talking about. If they slip through the cracks of the chapter, they may slip through the cracks of NHQ if there are no member lists to check.

***That in and of itself is nothing to declare a eureka moment over. The other NPHC sororities may or may not accept an initiated NPC member but, despite it not being explicitly stated on the sorority NHQ's websites, they DEFINITELY do not accept an initiated NPHC member (people whose record of initiation can be accessed by looking up their name in the sorority's records--most people initiated in the past 20 or so years have such records) if the NPHC membership is known. This is not explicitly stated on the non-Delta websites but that is still how they operate. Even if the chapters are being shady, the applications (unless these are underground initiates) have to go to NHQ and 99% of the time the names will be entered properly into databases.

[DubaiSis]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

It was not breaking an NPC rule but whether it was breaking the NPHC sorority rule remains to be seen (even if the person claims that she was told that it does not break the rules).

While what you say is true, what it says to me is there is enough wiggle room in the rules here that she doesn't need to spend any more time worrying about it. We know what Delta's site says (thanks for that), and knowing there are no unanimous agreements among NPHC sororities (and fraternities, although they don't count in this case) on this subject, and knowing it is specifically not addressed in the NPC unanimous agreements, it gets too "looking for skeletons" for my comfort. Except in 1 case, it appears she is not breaking a rule from either NPC or NPHC. For the OP to spend more time researching to find out if the woman actually did break a rule seems counter-productive and unnecessarily busy-body'ish.

Prior to having this knowledge, I still would have said stay out of it, but would appreciate her discomfort with the situation. Now I say it was a good question to ask this forum because you were able to get good information. You have it - unless she's a Delta she hasn't broken a rule, so move on. And if she still finds it that distasteful, she should present this scenario to NPC and suggest the rules be rewritten for the future.

[Greek_or_Geek?]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

While what you say is true, what it says to me is there is enough wiggle room in the rules here that she doesn't need to spend any more time worrying about it. We know what Delta's site says (thanks for that), and knowing there are no unanimous agreements among NPHC sororities (and fraternities, although they don't count in this case) on this subject, and knowing it is specifically not addressed in the NPC unanimous agreements, it gets too "looking for skeletons" for my comfort. Except in 1 case, it appears she is not breaking a rule from either NPC or NPHC. For the OP to spend more time researching to find out if the woman actually did break a rule seems counter-productive and unnecessarily busy-body'ish.

Prior to having this knowledge, I still would have said stay out of it, but would appreciate her discomfort with the situation. Now I say it was a good question to ask this forum because you were able to get good information. You have it - unless she's a Delta she hasn't broken a rule, so move on. And if she still finds it that distasteful, she should present this scenario to NPC and suggest the rules be rewritten for the future.

Not having a policy available to the general public does not constitute "wiggle room."

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

While what you say is true, what it says to me is there is enough wiggle room in the rules here that she doesn't need to spend any more time worrying about it. We know what Delta's site says (thanks for that), and knowing there are no unanimous agreements among NPHC sororities (and fraternities, although they don't count in this case) on this subject, and knowing it is specifically not addressed in the NPC unanimous agreements, it gets too "looking for skeletons" for my comfort. Except in 1 case, it appears she is not breaking a rule from either NPC or NPHC. For the OP to spend more time researching to find out if the woman actually did break a rule seems counter-productive and unnecessarily busy-body'ish.

Prior to having this knowledge, I still would have said stay out of it, but would appreciate her discomfort with the situation. Now I say it was a good question to ask this forum because you were able to get good information. You have it - unless she's a Delta she hasn't broken a rule, so move on. And if she still finds it that distasteful, she should present this scenario to NPC and suggest the rules be rewritten for the future.

Re-read the part of my post with the asteriks. Something not being on 3 NPHC sororities' websites does not mean that there are no regulations. For instance, more often than not, an AKA initiated in the past 1-20 years would be damned if she tried to apply to become an SGRho. However, that specification is on neither's website for whatever reasons.

This issue is not about the NPC sorority's regulations. This issue is only about the NPHC sorority's regulations.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

This issue is not about the NPC sorority's regulations. This issue is only about the NPHC sorority's regulations.

That's not necessarily true. It's not about the NPC Unanimous Agreement, but there still seems to be some question about whether the rules of a specific NPC org might have been violated. Of course, since the person in question didn't identify the NPC org involved, it's all speculation.

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Based on websites alone, Delta is the only NPHC sorority that explicitly states that applicants cannot be a member of another NPHC or NPC sorority.*** I did not find this on the other NPHC sororities' websites. They may state this during rush/informational or to applicants in another fashion, including verbal and written form. Or, they may let anyone in who in they like and let people slip through the cracks--as SenusretI was talking about. If they slip through the cracks of the chapter, they may slip through the cracks of NHQ if there are no member lists to check.

This is why I do think it would be helpful for the OP to identify the NPHC org at issue. At least the status with regard to that organization, and whether there was clearly a rule violation involved or not, could perhaps be resolved.

ETA: I think this information could be helpful for the sake of possibly satisfying curiosity, but I agree that as far as actually doing anything with any information, the OP should let it go.

[thetalady]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

And if she still finds it that distasteful, she should present this scenario to NPC and suggest the rules be rewritten for the future.

GOOD LORD, YES!!!! I am shocked that this enormous hole exists in NPC policies with the expansion of other organizations.