Difficult question - Page 3

33girl · #31 09-05-2006, 05:13 PM

As far as I know, a group of alumnae cannot decide to close a chapter of a national sorority. They can take away your house if they run a housing corporation, but as far as closing the chapter itself, only the national HQ can do that.

I can't imagine a group of alums that would be so vicious as to recommend their own chapter be closed just because they didn't get their way. If that's the case, you REALLY need to get with your national people and tell them what's happening and that you guys want to achieve - it's the alums that are holding you back.

adpiucf · #32 09-05-2006, 05:14 PM

Your alumnae need to get a life. This is no longer their chapter and they have no say in the goings-on until the chapter and/or your appointed regional officers invite them in for a sit-sit. Talk to your advisers and regional team and figure out a way to tell these nosey alumnae that this is not their concern. Your chapter alumnae cannot close your chapter. They have absolutely no power and no say in how you conduct your chapter. They would be much better off getting involved in an alumnae association and focusing on building up alumnae life and alumnae activities.

kathykd2005 · #33 09-05-2006, 05:36 PM

I'm so sorry to hear about quota--I do have to say that this happened once to my college chapter, and we definitely bounced back--we made quota three years in a row after it. I understand your concern--these concerns are valid. Keep your head up; you ladies will definitely get through this!!!

FSUZeta · #34 09-05-2006, 05:41 PM

sockpuppet3, is your chapter a national panhellenic sorority , a national pan-hellenic sorority or a local?

ASUADPi · #35 09-05-2006, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SockPuppet3

Well, the update isn't very good. Recruitment just ended not too long ago. We got 1/5 of quota. We're the only chapter who didn't make quota, and all the others even got quota plus.

It's pretty sad around here. Chapter morale is extremely low.

Some of the alums have called for a "closed meeting". I don't know what that is, but it doesn't sound good. Rumor has it that they're talking about closing the chapter. Can they do that? Whose decision is it to close us (if that's what happens)? I wouldn't think alums have any say in that matter. But, I dunno.

So, now you're up to speed. Thanks to all who offered advice... It was all probably moot, tho.

Okay, not knowing how the chapter has done the last couple of recruitments, I'm just telling what I "know".

My chapter of initiation just closed last May (05). But this was after a special advisor was assigned to the chapter, 2 school years prior (like the 03-04 school year). This was after multiple recruitments where they didn't make quota. It wasn't just something that was decided overnight, after one poor formal recruitment, or because a bunch of alums got together and had a "closed" meeting.

Closing a chapter is a big deal. There are a lot of logistical things that have to be thought about. If you have a house, will you sell the house, will you rent it out? Will you try to come back on campus? What happens to the girls? Those are just a few questions, there's millions more though.

Honestly, I would just take a deep breath and not fret too much. Unless you guys have been repeatedly talked to by your HQ about your numbers or were put on a "recruitment improvement plan", be concerned, numbers are what keeps us all around, but again not knowing all the details, I don't think they (HQ) will jump the gun and close the chapter.

As for your alums, I have to go with what my sister said, they need to get a life. They don't get to decide if a chapter stays open or not. Heck if alums got to decide I'm guessing that my chapter would have never closed.

SockPuppet3 · #36 09-05-2006, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FSUZeta

sockpuppet3, is your chapter a national panhellenic sorority , a national pan-hellenic sorority or a local?

We are NPC.

To answer other questions, we have struggled with formal recruitment for a while. This is the first one I was ever involved with (on this end), and it was a mess. Having gone through formal recruitment last year, and getting to see what other groups on my campus can do, I'm not surprised we did so poorly - the other groups seem to be so much more "with it" than us. I love my sisters, and we worked our butts off, but it just doesn't seem to be enough. We've had such a poor reputation on campus for so long now that I don't know how we'll be able to pull out of this slump.

I really thought it would get better once some of our alumnae moved on, but their involvement is still so strong. And when your chapter is already weak, it's hard to turn away people who are willing to help. I think we're just being helped by the wrong people. HQ always seems interested in helping us, and the chapter consultants who visit usually make comments like, "Obviously, you have a great sisterhood, you just need to get your numbers up." We're like, "Obviously. We get that. How can you help us do that?"

So what is a closed meeting anyway? Has anyone ever participated (in any form) in one? It isn't scheduled for a while, so I have some time to get my thoughts together. Of course I'm assuming I have a chance to express my thoughts. If it's just a gripe session run by alumnae, then I don't want to go (nor do I see why we would be required to attend). If it's a chance for us to try to figure out a new game plan, then I'm all for it. I just hope it isn't too late.

We don't have a house, so ASUADPi, that isn't really an issue we're having to worry about. We have all talked about the other questions you've mentioned (what happens to sisters? will we try to come back - again?) Our chapter was closed around 20 years ago and reopened around 5 years later. From what I gather, it's been 15 years of uphill battles for us. I'd hate for someone else to be going through this 15 years down the line.

I just don't know. I feel like we need some serious HQ intervention. But, that might just be asking for trouble. I just want to contact HQ and say, "Please, please please help us - but don't close us."

ASUADPi · #37 09-05-2006, 08:16 PM

Heres what I don't get...

If your chapter has been closed and then recolonized once already you think your HQ would have a bit more invested interest in it. It boggles my mind that you (the chapter) has only one advisor, who as you said is more "in name only".

I don't even know which sorority you are part of or where you are, but it makes me want to go and help your chapter out. I mean recruitment is recruitment is recruitment no matter what sorority you are part of.

But I'm also one of those people who thinks along the lines of "no matter what the letter we're all greek together".

sweetie I'm going to pm you.

adpiucf · #38 09-05-2006, 08:45 PM

SockPuppet, are you an exec board officer? If you aren't, then don't worry about what is or isn't coming. As a new sister on the other side of recruitment for the first time, this fall will be a learning experience for you as you go through your first full year as an initiated sister. Recruitment may have seemed confusing and disorganized-- but some would view the recruitments of even the strongest chapters as chaotic and loud. That doesn't mean you guys are doing it wrong or the stronger chapters on campus did it right-- campus reputations precede you and from your past posts even you and your own real life sister don't think much of your group.

Meantime: Express your concerns to your chapter president and offer to take on a leadership role to assist in recruiting, boosting morale, boosting campus image, etc. The best you can do right now is to be a good student, a good sister and to present your sorority in a positive light by being a chapter asset and a good person. If things aren't improving and the exec isn't taking you up on your offer to step up and move into a leadership role, then step back and re-evaluate if you want to remain a member of the chapter.

The alumnae of your chapter have no business telling your chapter how to operate. You are not obligated to take their advice or attend their meetings. Your exec board, along with advisers, and your regional directors work together to keep the chapter operating. Much goes on behind the scenes that most chapter members are not aware of. This year as a first-timer behind the scenes you've learned a lot and there is still much to know about how a chapter operates. But you have also had up until now to observe how the chapter operates and you know that change can be slow... or that people can be resistent to change. It is all in how you present your case and express yourself to determine if others will follow your lead. Change can't come overnight. And sometimes people need to feel like they came up with an idea themselves if they are to accept it.

We can give you tips on recruitment and chapter morale until we are blue in the face, but unless you're a chapter officer and putting said ideas into place or you know your chapters plans for the year, it's a moot point. I'm sorry you had a lousy recruitment. Clearly, there's a lot your chapter needs to do to gain a competitive foothold on campus and gain quality members to get to chapter total. Your alumnae aren't needed for this recruitment or chapter operations (but they can be handy to aid with chapter morale, sisterhood events, and traditions... but they should not be inviting themselves into chapter operations without a formal invitation from the chapter exec)-- you need chapter members like you who are interested in helping the chapter grow. Talk to your president and step up. Follow the chapter chain of command. If your HQ needs to be involved, your exec and advisory board will make that call. These are the chapter officers you elected to make decisions for the chapter, after all. And soon it will be time to bring in a new board of officers. Be a part of that next wave.

If your advisers aren't being responsive, your exec needs to take that up with the advisers and the regional officers who support your chapter on national level.

33girl · #39 09-06-2006, 12:44 AM

I don't think it's her advisors that are the problem, more that the chapter consultants aren't giving them concrete information as to HOW to get numbers up. Advisors are not panaceas and in some cases, their involvement can actually be bad for the chapter. Not to mention at some schools, the pickings are slim. The chapter needs an advisory board full of capable advisors that are alumnae that can be hands on. That's easier said than done in some areas of the country.

But anyway - tell the consultants that you need something more than "get your numbers up." They are being paid to help you. If they can't do that, THEY NEED TO FIND SOMEONE WHO CAN. If they aren't doing that, they aren't doing their job.

AGDee · #40 09-06-2006, 05:38 AM

If this young lady isn't on the Exec Board/Council, she may not know just what help has been offered directly to the officers by the consultants either. I've also seen situations where consultants offer all kinds of ideas, but the officers (President/VPR) are resistive to new ideas/change/new ways of doing things (like COR). It's hard to know, as outsiders.

SockPuppet3, have you discussed any of this with the officers in the chapter? What are their reactions? Do they know the appropriate volunteers to contact to ask for help?

Having been an advisor or on our regional volunteer team for 18 years now, I can honestly say that a plea for help from a chapter is responded to positively, with as many resources as possible being poured into that chapter. The last thing we ever want to do is close a chapter, and when we do end up going that route, it's only after huge attempts from everybody to turn things around. But sometimes, if collegians aren't filing reports regularly, we don't even know there is a problem (since we aren't psychic!). I can also say that if the other collegians are having all the same concerns and fears that you are, then PNMs can sense that during recruitment and the chapter won't give much of a sense of sisterhood, so those things NEED to be addressed.

SockPuppet3 · #41 09-06-2006, 01:40 PM

Thanks, everyone, for your responses. I'll try to address some of the issues you've raised.

I'm not an officer. I hold a chair position, but all of us do - our chapter is too small to have all positions covered without complete involvement from the sisterhood. Some of us even hold multiple chairs.

I'm sure there have been discussions among the Officers that I'm unaware of. I don't mean to suggest that I'm completely in the know. I haven't had an "official" discussion with them regarding my concerns. I guess I feel like they have an obligation to share pertinent information with the sisters, and I've been leaving the ball in their court, hoping they'll fill the rest of us in soon. I'm still waiting...

I don't know what to do about our advisor. I realize that having a better advisor won't fix everything. But I have to think it would help. I've mentioned to the chapter that I think we need to find someone who will be more involved, but the general response is, "Why?" (I need to say that there are some sisters who recognize why, and they are with me on this, but it's hard to know who to contact, how, when, etc., and what do we say to our current advisor? "We're sorry, we want someone who's going to help us. Thanks, tho.")

It is just so overwhelming. I was hoping to have a group of new members to help with all this. But we're so busy convincing these girls they didn't make a mistake that we don't seem to have the time/energy to devote to the chapter revamping that needs to happen. It's just hard to know how to increase chapter morale, improve our chapter's reputation, successfully COB, go to class, eat, sleep, blah, blah, blah... There doesn't seem to be enough time.

I talked to my real life sister about what's going on. She put me in touch with an alum (of my chapter, not hers) from several years ago. It was really great to talk to her. She didn't realize things were as hairy as they are, and plans to help as much as she can. She's about 2 hours away, planning a wedding, working full-time, etc, so she doesn't know how much she can help. But, at least I feel like I'm finding people other than the recent graduates who are willing to help us with this endeavor. She's going to try to attend the closed meeting. (I still don't know what that is, but I guess I'll find out soon enough.)

33girl · #42 09-06-2006, 02:51 PM

Again, I'll reiterate what I said in my posts in your other thread.

It sounds as though (to quote the Shari Bobbins episode of the Simpsons) the majority of the sisters are "happy with things the way they are." If most of the sisters feel that way - and your HQ isn't closing you down - it's going to be very hard to change things. If things were as ghastly as you make out, I think you would have been closed long ago (especially since there's no issue of holding on to real estate). I mean, I would love to hear from someone else in your chapter as to whether they think they're having a good sorority experience. I just feel like I'm getting a really really onesided view here.

I'm not trying to be Debbie Downer, but unless there's a little something inside the rest of the members that wants to change and is afraid to - one person can't change a chapter.

Incidentally, did your chapter follow the things the alumnae suggested or not? Do you think you would have done better doing the opposite of what you did?

And OK, I'm adding more to this.

I'm just trying to imagine how I would have felt if a sister participated in her first formal rush after being initiated, decided it had gone terribly, and called up her bio sister (who's from a chapter higher up on the food chain than ours and who just kicked our butts in rush) and then went, on her own, without the rest of the sorority knowing, to one of our alums and told her that everything is a fountain of suck in the chapter. I think I would pretty much tell her to go screw even if she told me she had found the cure for cellulite. You may be doing all this with the best of intentions, but it's coming out all wrong. You said you hoped to have a group of NMs to help with all this - that just tells me that you've given up on the current sisters completely.

SydneyK · #43 09-07-2006, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SockPuppet3

Well, the update isn't very good. Recruitment just ended not too long ago. We got 1/5 of quota. We're the only chapter who didn't make quota, and all the others even got quota plus.

I'm a little dense this morning. Are you saying that quota was 5 and you only got 1, or that you got one-fifth of quota (say quota was 100 and you only got 20)? I can't imagine quota being as low as 5, but you never know, so I had to ask.

Another question: Is your campus using the new release figures? If not, maybe you could talk to someone in the Greek Life office about looking into that - sounds like it could help.

SockPuppet3 · #44 09-10-2006, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SydneyK

I'm a little dense this morning. Are you saying that quota was 5 and you only got 1, or that you got one-fifth of quota (say quota was 100 and you only got 20)? I can't imagine quota being as low as 5, but you never know, so I had to ask.

Another question: Is your campus using the new release figures? If not, maybe you could talk to someone in the Greek Life office about looking into that - sounds like it could help.

We got one-fifth of quota. Quota was 15 and we got 3.

I don't know if we're using the new release figures. I don't really think it would affect us much, since we're the smallest group on campus. Don't the new release figures mostly affect the bigger chapters?

SoCalGirl · #45 09-10-2006, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SockPuppet3

We got one-fifth of quota. Quota was 15 and we got 3.

I don't know if we're using the new release figures. I don't really think it would affect us much, since we're the smallest group on campus. Don't the new release figures mostly affect the bigger chapters?

My understanding is that it forces the groups with higher return rates to cut a lot more women a lot earlier. Forcing PNMs to face reality and look at other chapters more closely.