He, she or it? Family keeps baby's gender a secret

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by CutiePie2000

Storm? Nice to name your kid after an American Gladiator character......

Or.. um.. marvel comic character. Way cooler. I'd name a kid Storm
http://i.imgur.com/mtMrX.jpg
Huge pic, just linking.
Or Nightcrawler.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Or.. um.. marvel comic character. Way cooler. I'd name a kid Storm

Or Nightcrawler.

I tend to stick with Swahili names.

It's interesting because my colleague believes that Black folks who give their kids Swahili names are setting the kids up for discrimination and potential failure (he's an extremist but not completely wrong). The same applies to other "strange names." He shits golf size hail when he hears about parents encouraging children to challenge gender. Reading about a "gender challenged" child named Storm would make him fart a thong bikini unicorn.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

I tend to stick with Swahili names.

It's interesting because my colleague believes that Black folks who give their kids Swahili names are setting the kids up for discrimination and potential failure. The same applies to other "strange names." He shits golf size hail when he hears about parents encouraging children to challenging gender. Reading about a "gender challenged" child named Storm would make him fart a thong bikini unicorn.

I think you should bring a camera and a copy of the article and see happens.

Yeah it's possible that some things for the kid(s) might be more difficult later, but there's nothing stopping them from going by another name as an adult. And, it raises the question of whether the parents' goal is to make the child's life easy or to raise their kids the 'right' way, or to make their kids 'happy' and so on. I don't think many if any parents really wish a child's life to be hard, but that doesn't mean they're going to compromise their values to make the child's life easier either.

[CutiePie2000]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

It's interesting because my colleague believes that Black folks who give their kids Swahili names are setting the kids up for discrimination and potential failure (he's an extremist but not completely wrong).

He would probably be interested in this article here:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/...rticle1878414/

PS I personally think some names have certain connotations - Brandy and Destiny are total stripper names. Amber & Crystal are borderline stripper'y sounding. IMHO. I get it that Amber is a fairly "mainstream" name now, but I can't get past the image of "le stripper".

I also get annoyed when people try to give their kids "exotic" foreign names and they cannot get the spelling right. On the Bachelorette, some dude's daughter is named "Cozy", which is short for "Cozette". Nice try, Captain Genius, but "Cosette" from Victor Hugo's "Les Miserables" is spelled with an "S" in it. FAIL.

I also know of a dude from my previous employer whose name was spelled "Juan" and he pronounces it "Jew-wan". This is because his parents were stupid and did not do their research properly. He would also correct people in a rather huffy manner, those who would address him as "Wan" or "Hwan" (which is my phonetic typing approximation for Spanish pronunciation). Sigh.....

And now back to our original thread about parents trying to raise a genderless child or whatever.....

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by CutiePie2000

Storm? Nice to name your kid after an American Gladiator character......

Or....

http://www.parents.com/baby-names/storm/

http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/1/Storm

[preciousjeni]

I'm with it. I would do it myself, but not in the same way. I wouldn't mind telling people what the biological sex of my child is, but I also would allow my children to decide what type of clothing and toys they like, and what activities they want to participate in, without regard to social norms.

Originally Posted by CutiePie2000

Storm? Nice to name your kid after an American Gladiator character......

Are you serious?

[AOII Angel]

Meh. There is lots of debate about the effect of parental action on children versus peer involvement in final outcome of childrens' personalities. This little experiment is easier in theory than practice, and subtle bias will effect the final outcome no matter how much the parents wish otherwise. In the end, boys can wear all the pink they want and play with dolls...it doesn't make them gay or more interesting people or more happy...unless of course they really want to wear pink and play with dolls and their parents beat them rather than let them do so.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

I'm with it. I would do it myself, but not in the same way. I wouldn't mind telling people what the biological sex of my child is, but I also would allow my children to decide what type of clothing and toys they like, and what activities they want to participate in, without regard to social norms.

That's how some families have done it. You know that it can be a constant struggle whether you tell people the biological sex or not.

In fact, gender can be a struggle even when people are socialized with traditional gender norms. Kids can notice early in their lives that they don't fit them; or they can discover later in life that they never felt "like a boy/man." And that doesn't just apply to children who are considered "dual gendered" or transgendered. "Normal" children also experience gender constrast and gender battles.

Originally Posted by ElieM

There can be big money in keeping it ambiguous - if you're a model

Check out Andrej Pejic -

http://www.theage.com.au/lifestyle/f...517-1eqas.html

There are some really good documentaries about this. The fluidity of gender can also be seen with Toshiya (Hara Toshimara), the bassist for the band Dir en grey.






(The other photos won't load. Google image him to see his looks. )

[ElieM]

There can be big money in keeping it ambiguous - if you're a model

Check out Andrej Pejic -

http://www.theage.com.au/lifestyle/f...517-1eqas.html

Pejic has ridden a global wave of popularity in fashion circles with his "femiman" look.
His reputation was sealed this year when he appeared as a "bride" with a towering veil headdress on Gaultier's Paris catwalk.
At the last New York fashion week, Pejic modelled in five menswear shows and four womenswear shows.

[AnotherKD]

One of the biggest problems I have with the family is that they are letting their 5-year-old decide whether or not he wants to have any sort of education at this point. 5-year-olds aren't equipped to make lots of sorts of decisions, and going to school or even having some sort of homeschooling lessons is not high on many's agendas. What happens next year or the year after? If he still doesn't want to have any schooling, will the parents really make him? Seems like a lack of parental responsibility to me.

Same goes with what the kids eat. Sure, they need protein and vitamins and nutritious stuff to make them healthy and strong, but he wants to eat Fruit Roll-Ups all day, fine with me!

Between letting their kids pick out what they want to wear (which, by the way, I'm fine with), deciding what they want to do day in and day out, and what they want to eat, it doesn't sound like these parents are doing much of anything.

[TonyB06]

WTH?? ...bad idea.

((Storm and siblings)) Let's hope yall don't need to spend too much time on the counselors's couch, that appears to be clearly likely in yall's future.

parents. need. a. clue. correction. ...several. clues.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

That's how some families have done it. You know that it can be a constant struggle whether you tell people the biological sex or not.

In fact, gender can be a struggle even when people are socialized with traditional gender norms. Kids can notice early in their lives that they don't fit them; or they can discover later in life that they never felt "like a boy/man." And that doesn't just apply to children who are considered "dual gendered" or transgendered. "Normal" children also experience gender constrast and gender battles.

For me, the bottom line is that I want my (future) children to have the courage to be who they are. That means that my home needs to be a haven of support. I grew up as a "tomboy," which now I'm realizing is really just a nice way of saying your girl kid acts too much like a boy.

I became a woman who has turned the Christian Haustafel on its ear in my own marriage. I find that my lifestyle is looked upon unfavorable by a lot of women who have more traditional marriages. I'm "lazy," even though the reality is that I'm utilizing my strengths to the benefit of my family.

Originally Posted by AnotherKD

One of the biggest problems I have with the family is that they are letting their 5-year-old decide whether or not he wants to have any sort of education at this point. 5-year-olds aren't equipped to make lots of sorts of decisions, and going to school or even having some sort of homeschooling lessons is not high on many's agendas. What happens next year or the year after? If he still doesn't want to have any schooling, will the parents really make him? Seems like a lack of parental responsibility to me.

Same goes with what the kids eat. Sure, they need protein and vitamins and nutritious stuff to make them healthy and strong, but he wants to eat Fruit Roll-Ups all day, fine with me!

Between letting their kids pick out what they want to wear (which, by the way, I'm fine with), deciding what they want to do day in and day out, and what they want to eat, it doesn't sound like these parents are doing much of anything.

I agree with you to an extent. However, I imagine that, with this freedom comes responsibility. At least I hope so. It would for me. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if this course of action were to lead to an earlier adulthood and more confidence in the children.

[AnotherKD]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

I agree with you to an extent. However, I imagine that, with this freedom comes responsibility. At least I hope so. It would for me. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if this course of action were to lead to an earlier adulthood and more confidence in the children.

Well, yes, but responsibility in a toddler/kindergartener is more like if they have the wherewithal to pick up their toys and let their parents know when they have to go to the bathroom so they don't continue to be in diapers or pull-ups until they're 7 years old. I think that the responsibility to choose what is best for the child as far as development growth is concerned (food, education, etc) should at least be seriously encouraged by the parents, but I don't see that happening here at all.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

For me, the bottom line is that I want my (future) children to have the courage to be who they are. That means that my home needs to be a haven of support. I grew up as a "tomboy," which now I'm realizing is really just a nice way of saying your girl kid acts too much like a boy.

Yeah and I used to brag about being a tomboy until I became a young adult and said "wait...wtf am I calling myself a tomboy for and bragging about it?!" I was buying into the gender hype.

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

I became a woman who has turned the Christian Haustafel on its ear in my own marriage. I find that my lifestyle is looked upon unfavorable by a lot of women who have more traditional marriages. I'm "lazy," even though the reality is that I'm utilizing my strengths to the benefit of my family.

I can relate. I'd love to read more about this if you wrote a book about your "story."

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

I'd love to read more about this if you wrote a book about your "story."

You know I've considered it seriously. I'd be tempted to reveal a lot, which might prove scandalous within my church and family. I wouldn't mind it a bit, but I'm not the only one who would be affected.