University of Alabama NPC recruitment 2019 thread

[Sororitysock]

Originally Posted by Alabama_Mama_2

Quota was 106, with secondary quota (upperclass students) at 5.

People really need to look hard at that secondary quota number. I keep hearing "rushing as an upperclassman is so much easier because of the secondary quota" poppycock more and more frequently. At Alabama, a school so competitive that secondary quotas might as well have been named after them, secondary quota was less than 5% of primary quota. That's not because there weren't many upperclassmen rushing. I hope that those that need it will let that statistic sink in.

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by Sororitysock

People really need to look hard at that secondary quota number. I keep hearing "rushing as an upperclassman is so much easier because of the secondary quota" poppycock more and more frequently. At Alabama, a school so competitive that secondary quotas might as well have been named after them, secondary quota was less than 5% of primary quota. That's not because there weren't many upperclassmen rushing. I hope that those that need it will let that statistic sink in.

Actually that number is based on how many upperclass women turned in a signed MRABA...so it is based on the number of upperclass women in recruitment at that point...just like freshman quota is based on the number of freshman doing same....

[navane]

Originally Posted by Titchou

Actually that number is based on how many upperclass women turned in a signed MRABA...so it is based on the number of upperclass women in recruitment at that point...just like freshman quota is based on the number of freshman doing same....

But the chapters still have to carry those upperclass women to the end of recruitment, yes? It seems to me that, if they weren't as keen on pledging upperclass women, they could simply release those women earlier in the game.

[Sororitysock]

Originally Posted by Titchou

Actually that number is based on how many upperclass women turned in a signed MRABA...so it is based on the number of upperclass women in recruitment at that point...just like freshman quota is based on the number of freshman doing same....

I am well aware of how RFM works and quota is calculated.

Originally Posted by navane

But the chapters still have to carry those upperclass women to the end of recruitment, yes? It seems to me that, if they weren't as keen on pledging upperclass women, they could simply release those women earlier in the game.

Yes, this. Plus a large factor is the upperclassman PNM dropout rate before they even get to preference, because it turns out that upperclassman recruitment isn't easier and Top Tier Tau and Phrat Phavorite Phi still dropped them.

Maybe it's easier to look at it this way. There are 17 sororities that participate in primary recruitment at Alabama. That means roughly 85 women categorized as upperclassmen received bids (17 x 5). Do we really believe there were anywhere near as few as 85 upperclassman PNMs in that group of 2239 who showed up for the first day of recruitment? I would love to see that number.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by Sororitysock

People really need to look hard at that secondary quota number. I keep hearing "rushing as an upperclassman is so much easier because of the secondary quota" poppycock more and more frequently. At Alabama, a school so competitive that secondary quotas might as well have been named after them, secondary quota was less than 5% of primary quota. That's not because there weren't many upperclassmen rushing. I hope that those that need it will let that statistic sink in.

Originally Posted by Titchou

Actually that number is based on how many upperclass women turned in a signed MRABA...so it is based on the number of upperclass women in recruitment at that point...just like freshman quota is based on the number of freshman doing same....

Originally Posted by navane

But the chapters still have to carry those upperclass women to the end of recruitment, yes? It seems to me that, if they weren't as keen on pledging upperclass women, they could simply release those women earlier in the game.

I'm trying to understand how this works here.

Example: There are 10 chapters. 1000 women sign up for recruitment. There are 900 freshmen and 100 upperclassmen. The rounds go on, PNMs are cut, and remaining are 800 freshmen and 80 upperclassmen.

A combined quota would be 88 (800 freshman plus 80 upperclassmen divided by 10 chapters). But separate quotas would be 80 for the freshmen and 8 for the upperclassmen... which is still the same number.

So how is having an upperclassmen quota a benefit? Does it require a certain number of upperclassmen PNMs to be carried through each round?

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

I'm trying to understand how this works here.

Example: There are 10 chapters. 1000 women sign up for recruitment. There are 900 freshmen and 100 upperclassmen. The rounds go on, PNMs are cut, and remaining are 800 freshmen and 80 upperclassmen.

A combined quota would be 88 (800 freshman plus 80 upperclassmen divided by 10 chapters). But separate quotas would be 80 for the freshmen and 8 for the upperclassmen... which is still the same number.

So how is having an upperclassmen quota a benefit? Does it require a certain number of upperclassmen PNMs to be carried through each round?

You are overlooking one important thing...the upperclassmen in a no UC quota situation will be dropped sooner because the groups want freshmen first as they will be in the chapter longer. So the UC women end up with fewer options and tend to drop out. That's why the separation came about -to give the UC PNMs a better -and fairer - chance.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by Titchou

You are overlooking one important thing...the upperclassmen in a no UC quota situation will be dropped sooner because the groups want freshmen first as they will be in the chapter longer. So the UC women end up with fewer options and tend to drop out. That's why the separation came about -to give the UC PNMs a better -and fairer - chance.

I guess I'm not understanding what you're saying here. I can't see why it's more fair for them.

If my math is correct, each chapter is gaining the same number of members, regardless of whether or not there is an upperclassmen quota, correct? And there's no obligation for the chapters to carry upperclassmen through to the next round, correct?

So how does having that quota benefit the upperclassmen, and for what reason are chapters carrying more upperclassmen forward with the separate quota?

If each chapter is gaining the same number of members either way, and they would prefer to have more freshmen, what is "forcing" them to take non-freshmen?

[unarose]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

I guess I'm not understanding what you're saying here. I can't see why it's more fair for them.

If my math is correct, each chapter is gaining the same number of members, regardless of whether or not there is an upperclassmen quota, correct? And there's no obligation for the chapters to carry upperclassmen through to the next round, correct?

So how does having that quota benefit the upperclassmen, and for what reason are chapters carrying more upperclassmen forward with the separate quota?

If each chapter is gaining the same number of members either way, and they would prefer to have more freshmen, what is "forcing" them to take non-freshmen?

If I understand correctly just from what Titchou has said, the primary and secondary quotas aren't really combined to make one total quota. Like, if Primary quota is 80 and Secondary quota is 8, then the chapters have 80 spots for freshmen regardless of how many upperclasswomen they choose to invite back. Sure, adding them together may equal 88, but that includes the 8 spots for upperclasswomen and those don't automatically become freshmen availability for chapters who have dropped all the upperclasswomen. It gives the chapters a little leeway to include those women if they really want them. Nobody is forced to take them, but it does give them more of an equal playing field because they're not having to compete as directly for the spots the freshmen will fill.

I hope I got that right, Titchou.

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

I guess I'm not understanding what you're saying here. I can't see why it's more fair for them.

If my math is correct, each chapter is gaining the same number of members, regardless of whether or not there is an upperclassmen quota, correct? And there's no obligation for the chapters to carry upperclassmen through to the next round, correct?

So how does having that quota benefit the upperclassmen, and for what reason are chapters carrying more upperclassmen forward with the separate quota?

If each chapter is gaining the same number of members either way, and they would prefer to have more freshmen, what is "forcing" them to take non-freshmen?

UC quota is voluntary for the chapters. So they may take one or all 8. And you are still looking at the freshman quota as an overall quota....in a way. The chapters will tend to release UC women early and so those women drop out. The odds that you would have 100 women left at the end of recruitment is less likely with no UC quota and more likely with it. UC quota, in Cajun French terms,is lagniappe- a little something extra that doesn't cost you anything...

[navane]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

I guess I'm not understanding what you're saying here. I can't see why it's more fair for them.

If my math is correct, each chapter is gaining the same number of members, regardless of whether or not there is an upperclassmen quota, correct? And there's no obligation for the chapters to carry upperclassmen through to the next round, correct?

So how does having that quota benefit the upperclassmen, and for what reason are chapters carrying more upperclassmen forward with the separate quota?

If each chapter is gaining the same number of members either way, and they would prefer to have more freshmen, what is "forcing" them to take non-freshmen?

I *think* I understand what you're getting hung up on and I'm trying to work out a way to help explain. Let's say that there are 10 chapters and 150 PNMs at preference. So, there should be 15 new members for each chapter on bid day, right?

But, figuratively speaking, let's say that we put the 150 PNMs into basket. 30 of those PNMs are upperclasswomen and the rest are freshmen. We tell each chapter that they get to make a list of their favorite 15 out of everyone in the basket. More likely than not, the majority of the PNMs picked are going to be freshmen because the UC women are seen as less desirable due to time left on campus. So, to make an awkward comparison, sometimes being UC is like getting picked last on the playground.

Now, you might say that, regardless, 150 divided by 10 is still going to be 15 and those UC PNMs in the basket are going to be placed somewhere. Yes, that's true. So, if chapters don't want to "have" to take the UC PNMs, they will simply drop them ahead of pref so that they don't ever make it to the basket. That leaves more room in the basket for the more desirable freshmen.

However, if we tell chapters to go ahead and put favorites into a 150 person freshman basket and a bonus UC basket, then that will help encourage them to keep UC women around longer.

Does that make any sense at all?