Arizona State University - TKE

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

Is this particular incident about race? Yes.

Now I know that is what he was attempting to convey. Thanks for interpreting.

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

...the overall problems with Greek life at ASU/in Arizona....

(I don't care about Greek Life at ASU/in Arizona and I never said their overall Greek Life problems are about race.)

I thought Kevin was saying that the stupidity of throwing a racially themed party was a result of a larger issue with the culture of Greek Life/problems with Greek Life. I'm still amused that this thread became about ASU problems with Greek Life instead of a discussion of why racially themed parties keep happening. Even the greatest Greek system in the world can have members who think a racially themed party is a good idea.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

Kevin, I agree.

Is this particular incident about race? Yes. Are the overall problems with Greek life at ASU/in Arizona about race? No.

I believe that's the basic point you were getting at, correct?

Pretty much.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Pretty much.

Interesting.

If you agree that this particular issue of racially themed parties is about race then, going back to the point of my original posts, what in the shit are you all talking about? LOL. Why are you all pretending as though the larger issue that deserves more discussion is "problems with Greek Life"? That Band-aid is worn and needs to be changed.

[Kevin]

Ok?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Because it's easier to just talk about "problems with Greek Life" than it is to talk about racial campus climate and racial societal climate.

FYP.

[AOII Angel]

I think none of us wanted to get into a discussion of why young white students feel the need to be racially insensitive. Personally I feel it is because they are ignorant. The AZ Greek Life discussion is an ongoing underlying thread that many of us have been following for awhile now. This is just more kindling on the fire.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

FYP.

Not really. Alcohol and drug abuse, hazing, racial insensitivity, these are all issues--and out of those, only racial insensitivity won't get anyone physically hurt or killed.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Kevin

...racial insensitivity won't get anyone physically hurt or killed.

If you believe that then your head is up your ass. What world do you live in?

And the fact that you believe that confirms that the larger issue that needs discussion is racial cluelessness and dumbassness---if the prevalence of these events is of concern rather than merely seeing this as further evidence of Greek Life problems.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

If you believe that then your head is up your ass. What world do you live in?

And the fact that you believe that confirms that the larger issue that needs discussion is racial cluelessness and dumbassness---if the prevalence of these events is of concern rather than merely seeing this as further evidence of Greek Life problems.

One incident or even a few =/= a prevalence.

TKE did something very ill advised, Alpha Delta Phi, Alpha Sigma Phi, Chi Phi, Delta Chi, Delta Kappa Epsilon, Delta Sigma Phi, Delta Tau Delta, Delta Upsilon, Kappa Alpha Order, Kappa Sigma, Lambda Chi Alpha, Omega Delta Phi, Phi Gamma Delta (FIJI), Pi Kappa Alpha, Pi Kappa Phi Sigma Alpha Mu, Sigma Chi, Sigma Phi Beta, Sigma Phi Epsilon, Sigma Tau Gamma, Theta Chi, Theta Delta Chi and Zeta Beta Tau did no such thing.

You've got to keep things in perspective.

And in other news, ASU has severed ties with TKE, but it appears the TKE chapter will stay at ASU and just be undergroundish, no university support, but full support from the home office.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Kevin

One incident or even a few =/= a prevalence.

Has there only been one "or even a few" of these incidents across the country in the past 5 years?

Incidents are examined in prevalence when there is a pattern of occurrence. It is easy to predict and detect racially themed parties with and without social media. Even a Greekchat search for "racially themed patterns" reveals how these parties are more common than they should be and that includes MLK parties.

Originally Posted by Kevin

TKE did something very ill advised, Alpha Delta Phi, Alpha Sigma Phi, Chi Phi, Delta Chi, Delta Kappa Epsilon, Delta Sigma Phi, Delta Tau Delta, Delta Upsilon, Kappa Alpha Order, Kappa Sigma, Lambda Chi Alpha, Omega Delta Phi, Phi Gamma Delta (FIJI), Pi Kappa Alpha, Pi Kappa Phi Sigma Alpha Mu, Sigma Chi, Sigma Phi Beta, Sigma Phi Epsilon, Sigma Tau Gamma, Theta Chi, Theta Delta Chi and Zeta Beta Tau did no such thing.

TKE is not the only fraternity (or white people in general) across the country that has done one of these parties.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Has there only been one "or even a few" of these incidents across the country in the past 5 years?

Incidents are examined in prevalence when there is a pattern of occurrence. It is easy to predict and detect racially themed parties with and without social media. Even a Greekchat search for "racially themed patterns" reveals how these parties are more common than they should be and that includes MLK parties.



TKE is not the only fraternity (or white people in general) across the country that has done one of these parties.

I think if you want to know why this continues to occur, look at the comment section of the USA Today article about ASU shuttering the chapter. There are many racist people commenting that feel justified due to one or another slight that they list. I'll call their complaints "reverse racism" as it's what they used to lump all those complaints under. Anyway, some fraternities have always liked to push the taste edge to purposefully be controversial. Apparently they have found this to be very successful in that endeavor. TKE at ASU did a bang up job at it and some of their students may even get expelled. Actions have consequences.

[DrPhil]

Is it the newest USA Today article or the one from 2 days ago?

The newest:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...party/4811083/

[Sciencewoman]

Given the fact that several moms in the Indiana recruitment thread couldn't understand why weather-cancelled recruitment parties weren't rescheduled on the "open" MLK Day, DrPhil's point about the larger issue has a lot of merit. As much as I support GLOs, the mere suggestion that sorority rush should take precedence over a hard-won day of recognition is incredibly offensive to me.

Since this is GreekChat, it also makes sense that GCers are concerned about this incident as it particularly relates to fraternity members and the larger fraternity community.

[AZTheta]

Here's a new article about the SAE chapter at the University of Arizona.

You guys can argue all you want. There is a HUGE problem here in Arizona, in general, with the behavior of the Greeks (male AND female).

Personally, I think that having a racially insensitive party speaks volumes, all of which are negative. And racial insensitivity can be linked to physical harm and death. That is a no-brainer. Would this TKE action have gotten so much attention had it been a non-Greek party? Given the current climate, I don't know. I do know that this has given the ABOR more ammunition to shutter the system, if they are so inclined. And I do care very much about the Greek system at the University of Arizona.

[Lovethesand]

Originally Posted by Kevin

And in other news, ASU has severed ties with TKE, but it appears the TKE chapter will stay at ASU and just be undergroundish, no university support, but full support from the home office.

I read this and just one question: WHY does the home office continue to support this chapter?