Not Religious and Interested in Fraternity Recruitment

[DubaiSis]

I think there's a similar issue with sororities, although there are 2 NPC sororities on record as being nonsectarian. I don't know if there are any fraternities who are. But in my case, there is a clearly religious aspect to our ritual that I know for sure some members wouldn't agree with religiously (me for instance, but I wasn't as clear in my agnosticism (?) at 18). I believe the policy for non-Christians is to remain silent during that portion although it was never discussed as far as I know but I don't think the Jewish members of my sorority would be required to recite every bit of our ritual, just as an example.

My suggestion would be to feel out the chapter and not worry about the literal ritual. If they feel a little crispy for you, look elsewhere. Even the fraternities that have a strongly religious background might be a good fit for you based on the actives, the campus, the times, etc. Don't limit your choices based on a 100+ year old ritual. You can take the positive ideals (be a good person, don't be a douche) out of a Christian, Jewish or Hindu prayer without having to vow allegiance to any particular god. But that's just my opinion.

[Leslie Anne]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

I think there's a similar issue with sororities, although there are 2 NPC sororities on record as being nonsectarian. I don't know if there are any fraternities who are. But in my case, there is a clearly religious aspect to our ritual that I know for sure some members wouldn't agree with religiously (me for instance, but I wasn't as clear in my agnosticism (?) at 18). I believe the policy for non-Christians is to remain silent during that portion although it was never discussed as far as I know but I don't think the Jewish members of my sorority would be required to recite every bit of our ritual, just as an example.

Same here.

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

My suggestion would be to feel out the chapter and not worry about the literal ritual. If they feel a little crispy for you, look elsewhere. Even the fraternities that have a strongly religious background might be a good fit for you based on the actives, the campus, the times, etc. Don't limit your choices based on a 100+ year old ritual. You can take the positive ideals (be a good person, don't be a douche) out of a Christian, Jewish or Hindu prayer without having to vow allegiance to any particular god. But that's just my opinion.

But do we really know this for sure?

It's a sticky situation that I don't believe is so easily tossed aside.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by Leslie Anne

But do we really know this for sure?

I think she meant in general, which is true. I don't have to be a devout Catholic to understand/appreciate the golden rule.

[Leslie Anne]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

I think she meant in general, which is true. I don't have to be a devout Catholic to understand/appreciate the golden rule.

Yes, I understand that. My comment was in response to the part of her quote I highlighted in red, about not having to vow allegiance to any particular god. I don't think we can make a generalization about that.

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

I think she meant in general, which is true. I don't have to be a devout Catholic to understand/appreciate the golden rule.

No, you don't have to be a devout follower of Confuciounism(sp) to appreciate the golden rule..

OP-

You are making this much more of an issue than it really is. At their core, NIC fraternities are social groups, not religious cults. We really dont put as much emphasis on religion as you think we do..really. You may run into an occasional reference to God in certain rituals and creeds but that doesn't mean you're pledging yourself to God because you read or repeat such rituals or creeds anymore than it would if using money with "in God we trust" printed on it would. Make sense? Personally, I'm areligious and I never had an issues with participating in any rituals, neither did my Muslim, Jewish, or Hindu brothers.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by jazing

That is actually a phrase coined to King Hillel.

Which he probably learned while living in Babylon, where he was born, as it dates back to at least 1500 years before him to the Code of Hammurabi. The reality is almost every religion (if not every religion and indeed every society) has some form of the Golden Rule.

Lilgiant2016, check these threads:

Atheists as members

Christianity in ritual

Religion and GLOs

As you will see from these threads, there are (a few?) fraternities that will expect members to affirm belief in a Supreme Being (the main one I can think of being one that you have mentioned), and there are fraternities where the religious aspects will be more pronounced than others. (Again, a handful come to mind.) There are also many fraternities that will be pretty much non-sectarian.

Go to rush events, get to know the guys and I bet you'll get a good feel for where you'd fit in.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

I think there's a similar issue with sororities, although there are 2 NPC sororities on record as being nonsectarian. I

Actually, there are three (Alpha Omicron Pi, Delta Phi Epsilon and Phi Sigma Sigma). AOII may not have explicitly stated it, but the fact that the founders were both Jewish and Christian pretty much says it for me.

As far as fraternities, Pi Lambda Phi comes up as the first non-sectarian fraternity through a quick googling. However, part of their creed is that they "pledge allegiance to my country, and to its national symbol."

Lilgiant2016, have you sat out the PoA because of the under God part, or because of the concept of the thing?

[jazing]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Actually, there are three (Alpha Omicron Pi, Delta Phi Epsilon and Phi Sigma Sigma). AOII may not have explicitly stated it, but the fact that the founders were both Jewish and Christian pretty much says it for me.

As far as fraternities, Pi Lambda Phi comes up as the first non-sectarian fraternity through a quick googling. However, part of their creed is that they "pledge allegiance to my country, and to its national symbol."

Lilgiant2016, have you sat out the PoA because of the under God part, or because of the concept of the thing?

While Pi Lambda Phi says non-sectarian, all three of their founders were of Jewish ideals. They can even be considered the first Jewish fraternity, except they didn't limit their admittance like ZBT would a few years later. A lot of their chapters back in the day (one of our chapters brothers is a legacy) pushed the Jewish aspect.