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03-14-2012, 01:34 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,730
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby
IThey are using hip hop culture to promote organizations that are, historically, comprised of the white and privileged. I think there is a distinct difference between, for example, a Wizard of Oz-themed bid day shirt and a Notorious B.I.G.-themed bid day shirt. I also think there is a difference between, say, the Society of Women Engineers using a "99 Problems" slogan and an NPC group using the same slogan.
It's specifically the friction between the exclusivity of NPC groups and the origins of hip hop culture that rubs me the wrong way. It's sorta like when a conservative political candidate runs some music in their ad by a liberal artist, and the artist has to be like "hey, stop that!".
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Are you implying that "Wizard of Oz" is a symbol of whiteness whereas "Notorious BIG" and "99 Problems" are symbols of Blackness? Should NPC orgs, and white people in general, therefore avoid these references?
I'm not buying that because it creates a nonsense, surface-level response to inequality which pretends that this is all about people feeling offended by ANY type of reference. "Just stay away from it altogether and there will be no problems." I call nonsense on that. There are clear images of white people mocking non-white cultures, including racial slurs, blackface, and "dressing Black for a day." Every reference to something that is one aspect of one component of nonwhiteness is not offensive regardless of intent and outcome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mevara
Just a note with the shirts I posted none of them are approved by the respective org. They are just shirts by a (popular) third party vendor.
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Did you know that the Minerva one was in reference to an NPHC sorority? I am still searching for the racial and ethnic mockery there beyond the nonlicensed (probably white) third party vendor's motives.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33girl
I just read the lyrics to 99 Problems, and the song is apparently delineating all the problems the lyricist has...however, girl problems are not one of them. What does that have to do with a sorority? (Or the SWE, for that matter)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby
Actually, on further thought, I revoke my statement that it would be okay for the SWE to use it, but for different reasons, namely that it is not very egalitarian to refer to a woman as a "bitch".
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So, now the issue is gender inequality and sorority life? *brain fart* I thought the issue was supposed to be mimicking and mocking Black folkseseseses. LOL.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby
Sorry for the double-post, but I just got an e-mail from HQ saying it will be taken down ASAP. Goodbye, blackface Sir Fidel.
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We all have a voice!
Last edited by DrPhil; 03-14-2012 at 01:37 PM.
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03-14-2012, 01:59 PM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 839
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrPhil
Did you know that the Minerva one was in reference to an NPHC sorority? I am still searching for the racial and ethnic mockery there beyond the nonlicensed (probably white) third party vendor's motives.
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No I did not know that Minerva was a reference to an NPHC sorority as it is also a reference for Kappa. And I only used that one because DeltaBetaBabay thought that the use of the word "homeboy" was offensive and I was wondering if using "homegirl" would also be offensive.
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03-14-2012, 02:34 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,730
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mevara
No I did not know that Minerva was a reference to an NPHC sorority as it is also a reference for Kappa.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticCat
On the seller's website, it is marketed as a "Kappa Kappa Gamma Minerva HoodieBuddie." I can see how the color could suggest Delta rather than Kappa, though.
There are some ugly shirts on that site.
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*breathes a sigh of relief*
Thank you, Black baby Jesus.
Ignore my Delta and Minerva rant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NutBrnHair
"It truly amazes me when people feel the need to publically critique organizations to which they do not belong."
"If you can't say something nice..."
Some of you are being so "small-minded."
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Shut up.
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03-14-2012, 02:36 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: ILL-INI
Posts: 7,207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrPhil
Should NPC orgs, and white people in general, therefore avoid these references?
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Nope, I just said that it doesn't sit well with me, and I wouldn't wear such a shirt if one were made for my group. Others are free to do whatever they want, and to feel however they want about the issue.
To offer another analogy, it feels to me a little like having a bachelorette party in a gay bar. There are still parts of the country where black women are largely unwelcome in NPC groups.
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03-14-2012, 02:45 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,730
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby
Nope, I just said that it doesn't sit well with me, and I wouldn't wear such a shirt if one were made for my group. Others are free to do whatever they want, and to feel however they want about the issue.
To offer another analogy, it feels to me a little like having a bachelorette party in a gay bar. There are still parts of the country where black women are largely unwelcome in NPC groups.
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Thanks for the explanation. I always understood your point, I am just wondering where the line is drawn.
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03-14-2012, 08:13 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Peeing on you and telling you it's rain apparently...
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*Retiring from hiatus for two seconds*
I didn't see the Sir Fidel shirt as a an adoption of a minority culture by elitist white groups. All of black culture is not ruined by a single hip hop reference on a Phi Mu t-shirt. As a "race" we have far bigger concerns.
I see it as an adoption of popular culture just as they would use "Wizard of Oz" theme or "Sex and the City" or a "How I Met Your Mother" theme. It's just what's hot in the streets right now to say "____ is my home boy" or whatever the kids are liking right now. The so called "hip hop" culture is what many young people are into and PNMs and others see these references and think it's "super cute" as we'd say down here.
It's not like they'd one day print a shirt saying "This N**** right here is my home girl" or something. At least not anyone with common sense.
Would I buy that shirt? No, but that's because it's ugly and we have way cuter things with more pink on it, not because I find it racist.
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03-14-2012, 09:09 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BabyPiNK_FL
*Retiring from hiatus for two seconds*
I didn't see the Sir Fidel shirt as a an adoption of a minority culture by elitist white groups. All of black culture is not ruined by a single hip hop reference on a Phi Mu t-shirt. As a "race" we have far bigger concerns.
I see it as an adoption of popular culture just as they would use "Wizard of Oz" theme or "Sex and the City" or a "How I Met Your Mother" theme. It's just what's hot in the streets right now to say "____ is my home boy" or whatever the kids are liking right now. The so called "hip hop" culture is what many young people are into and PNMs and others see these references and think it's "super cute" as we'd say down here.
It's not like they'd one day print a shirt saying "This N**** right here is my home girl" or something. At least not anyone with common sense.
Would I buy that shirt? No, but that's because it's ugly and we have way cuter things with more pink on it, not because I find it racist.
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This. All of this. much more eloquent then i was being.
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ΠΑΓ to my sisters forever loyal
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03-14-2012, 10:02 PM
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Moderator
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Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Hotel Oceanview
Posts: 34,519
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrPhil
So, now the issue is gender inequality and sorority life? *brain fart* I thought the issue was supposed to be mimicking and mocking Black folkseseseses. LOL.
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The tone of the song seems inappropriate for ANY sorority to use...black, white, brown or fuchsia.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BabyPiNK_FL
I see it as an adoption of popular culture just as they would use "Wizard of Oz" theme or "Sex and the City" or a "How I Met Your Mother" theme. It's just what's hot in the streets right now to say "____ is my home boy" or whatever the kids are liking right now. The so called "hip hop" culture is what many young people are into and PNMs and others see these references and think it's "super cute" as we'd say down here.
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If that's the case, then let's turn it around. When is the last time you saw a BGLO or MCGLO having a shirt or party or whatever themed around How I Met Your Mother?
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It is all 33girl's fault. ~DrPhil
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