Tent Talk & "Bottom-Tier" Houses

[33girl]

Originally Posted by LAblondeGPhi

5) Perhaps the Greek Advisor could make a concerted effort to subtly "talk up" the chapters that typically perform less well during recruitment to the PNMs.

Depending on the status/popularity of the GA, this could be great or be beyond epic fail. Our GA was so bad that it got to a point where the only thing that all the sororities agreed on was that they hated her guts.

I also don't think holding rush before freshman year/immediately upon campus arrival helps to curb tent talk AT ALL. If it did, then every school who does it would have every chapter at the same amount and no chapters would ever close. If anything, I think tent talk in this situation is 10x worse. You're new to the campus, maybe away from home on your own for the first time and unless you have family or intimate friends at the school, you have NO clue and are apt to take everyone's advice on the same level. I mean, if you hear a cute man from ABC fraternity saying that JKL sorority is full of fat bitches, you may believe it. Whereas if you don't rush until your second semester, and have maybe had a chance to interact with the ABC fraternity and realize that although they're cute they are total douchebags...you're not going to take everything they say as gospel.

I think a lot of the disappointed PNMs are the ones who do join chapters that maybe weren't as popular as they thought, or as they made themselves appear in rush. If they've had a semester at the least to observe, they're not going to get as much of a jolt.

[LAblondeGPhi]

Originally Posted by 33girl

If anything, I think tent talk in this situation is 10x worse. You're new to the campus, maybe away from home on your own for the first time and unless you have family or intimate friends at the school, you have NO clue and are apt to take everyone's advice on the same level. I mean, if you hear a cute man from ABC fraternity saying that JKL sorority is full of fat bitches, you may believe it. Whereas if you don't rush until your second semester, and have maybe had a chance to interact with the ABC fraternity and realize that although they're cute they are total douchebags...you're not going to take everything they say as gospel.

Hrm, maybe this varies from campus to campus, but I felt like enough women went through recruitment at my school with little knowledge of the ranks specifically because recruitment happened right at the beginning of the term (usually started a few days before classes started). Granted, UCLA is a campus where a good portion of women sign up for recruitment in the few days between when they move in to their dorms and Round 1 (easily 20%-30% of PNMs). I could also be over-estimating this population in general.

I used to think the idea of deferred recruitment was absolutely terribly for struggling chapters, but the older I get, the more I understand your exact point. I also understand the great benefit of having time to assess PNMs, both in the social scene and their grades.

[HQWest]

Originally Posted by LAblondeGPhi

Hrm, maybe this varies from campus to campus, but I felt like enough women went through recruitment at my school with little knowledge of the ranks specifically because recruitment happened right at the beginning of the term (usually started a few days before classes started). Granted, UCLA is a campus where a good portion of women sign up for recruitment in the few days between when they move in to their dorms and Round 1 (easily 20%-30% of PNMs). I could also be over-estimating this population in general.

I used to think the idea of deferred recruitment was absolutely terribly for struggling chapters, but the older I get, the more I understand your exact point. I also understand the great benefit of having time to assess PNMs, both in the social scene and their grades.

Your first instinct was right. Spring recruitment = 4 whole months of tent talk. Plus then the boys get into it too. You can put silence rules on the sorority girls, but can't stop the boys from talking. Most deferred recruitment schools have some kind of rule where sorority girls can't talk to PNMs that they don't already know. That puts you right back with the PNM that is the best connected going in to recruitment has a significant advantage. It also leads to dirty rushing.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by HQWest

Your first instinct was right. Spring recruitment = 4 whole months of tent talk. Plus then the boys get into it too. You can put silence rules on the sorority girls, but can't stop the boys from talking. Most deferred recruitment schools have some kind of rule where sorority girls can't talk to PNMs that they don't already know. That puts you right back with the PNM that is the best connected going in to recruitment has a significant advantage. It also leads to dirty rushing.

If a school is still doing this, they are stupid (and if I'm not mistaken, going against the latest advisories in the Green Book). This ruins one of the main objectives of deferred recruitment...which is for potential rushees to get to know sorority women in normal day to day life, not in a ridiculously structured "party" environment. That way when Freddy Fraternity says that Sorority A is full of snobs, you'll know this is BS, because Andrea A is in a class with you and helped you find the student center when you lost your campus map. If Andrea isn't allowed to speak to you as a fellow human for 4 months, it only enforces any stereotypes.

Plus, most of these dumb rules said that sorority members specifically can't speak to freshmen. This is outright discrimination...it implies that freshmen are the only ones rushing.

And not only that....are these rushees in convent school? Do you honestly think girls rushing at SEC schools (pre-freshman rush) haven't heard as much, if not MORE, from the guys in their orbit as they have from the girls?

First semester freshman rush does not prevent tent talk. PERIOD. The only thing that prevents tent talk is a truly unified Greek community that doesn't permit it to happen. If women come in from HS spouting it, they need to be told, "I know your family/friends/boyfriend/random website said X, and Y, and Z, but we are all part of a Greek family here. We don't talk smack about our family."

[HQWest]

Originally Posted by 33girl

If a school is still doing this, they are stupid (and if I'm not mistaken, going against the latest advisories in the Green Book). This ruins one of the main objectives of deferred recruitment...which is for potential rushees to get to know sorority women in normal day to day life, not in a ridiculously structured "party" environment. That way when Freddy Fraternity says that Sorority A is full of snobs, you'll know this is BS, because Andrea A is in a class with you and helped you find the student center when you lost your campus map. If Andrea isn't allowed to speak to you as a fellow human for 4 months, it only enforces any stereotypes.

Plus, most of these dumb rules said that sorority members specifically can't speak to freshmen. This is outright discrimination...it implies that freshmen are the only ones rushing.

And not only that....are these rushees in convent school? Do you honestly think girls rushing at SEC schools (pre-freshman rush) haven't heard as much, if not MORE, from the guys in their orbit as they have from the girls?

First semester freshman rush does not prevent tent talk. PERIOD. The only thing that prevents tent talk is a truly unified Greek community that doesn't permit it to happen. If women come in from HS spouting it, they need to be told, "I know your family/friends/boyfriend/random website said X, and Y, and Z, but we are all part of a Greek family here. We don't talk smack about our family."

We've been over this before....
The girls who have family members who are Greek have been hearing about who is the Best chapter since they were in diapers, BUT odds are they have only heard mostly positive things about being Greek. They haven't heard "that chapter are the rich B**$," and "those are the fat girls" and "that chapter has the party girls." (Unless their mom is a total jerk? )

This idea that girls will get more involved on campus (join a sports team or write for the school paper or start a anime club, etc.) than they would have if they were in a sorority first semester has not held up.

First semester recruitment DOES help smaller chapters. Girls that are new to the system are more willing to take a chance on a group. It also means girls are less likely to drop out of recruitment if they don't get their first choice. First semester recruitment cuts back on drama.

Most importantly, first semester recruitment DOES prevent dirty rushing - as in "if you don't do X - I'll make sure you never pledge ABC or you HAVE to do this everybody does it."

Been there - done that. Have the T-shirt.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by HQWest

We've been over this before....
The girls who have family members who are Greek have been hearing about who is the Best chapter since they were in diapers, BUT odds are they have only heard mostly positive things about being Greek. They haven't heard "that chapter are the rich B**$," and "those are the fat girls" and "that chapter has the party girls." (Unless their mom is a total jerk? )

This idea that girls will get more involved on campus (join a sports team or write for the school paper or start a anime club, etc.) than they would have if they were in a sorority first semester has not held up.

First semester recruitment DOES help smaller chapters. Girls that are new to the system are more willing to take a chance on a group. It also means girls are less likely to drop out of recruitment if they don't get their first choice. First semester recruitment cuts back on drama.

Most importantly, first semester recruitment DOES prevent dirty rushing - as in "if you don't do X - I'll make sure you never pledge ABC or you HAVE to do this everybody does it."

Been there - done that. Have the T-shirt.

I grew up in a Greek family, and my big bro and his friends were like "ABC is the snobby bitches and DEF is the nice-girl losers and all the other chapters aren't Jewish". So yes, I got some negative stereotypes from my bro, but I guess my take-away was more "wow, every chapter has a downside or something negative that people say about them".

[33girl]

Originally Posted by HQWest

We've been over this before....
The girls who have family members who are Greek have been hearing about who is the Best chapter since they were in diapers, BUT odds are they have only heard mostly positive things about being Greek. They haven't heard "that chapter are the rich B**$," and "those are the fat girls" and "that chapter has the party girls." (Unless their mom is a total jerk? )

I missed where I referred to family members. I was talking about garden variety boys. I remember being 18, and honestly, family members held the LEAST amount of influence as to what/whom I thought was cool.

Originally Posted by HQWest

This idea that girls will get more involved on campus (join a sports team or write for the school paper or start a anime club, etc.) than they would have if they were in a sorority first semester has not held up.

I also missed where I said this was a reason for deferred rush. I said that the reason was for them to GET TO KNOW SORORITY MEMBERS. That could be in a club, in a class, at a party, at a campus job, in their dorm, whatever. Unless you're at IU (and even then) there are sorority members who don't live in their houses. Are you intimating that they don't speak with anyone non-affiliated?

Originally Posted by HQWest

First semester recruitment DOES help smaller chapters. Girls that are new to the system are more willing to take a chance on a group. It also means girls are less likely to drop out of recruitment if they don't get their first choice. First semester recruitment cuts back on drama.

Maybe it helps them make quota, ON PAPER. But do those girls all show up at bid day? Do they stay around for the semester and initiate? Are they still involved as seniors? Some girls are willing to take a chance - but they are 50/50 with the women who will feel took, hornswaggled, bamboozled that the chapter who they thought was on the same social level as the rest of the groups (since all they saw of them was rush, before they even set foot in a college classroom) only mixes once a semester and is a campus joke. I'd rather give bids to women who have heard all the tent talk and stereotypes and seen the sorority warts and all and still want to be there anyway.

Originally Posted by HQWest

Most importantly, first semester recruitment DOES prevent dirty rushing - as in "if you don't do X - I'll make sure you never pledge ABC or you HAVE to do this everybody does it."

Been there - done that. Have the T-shirt.

Originally Posted by pinapple

Round Up

Round up is the weekend after Spring Break this year (March 23-25) and it can be a great opportunity to see Greek Life in all its glory. But again, step wisely. If you are a Senior and go to Round Up. BEHAVE. Everyone is watching. Recruiting is happening. It just is.

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by LAblondeGPhi

I used to think the idea of deferred recruitment was absolutely terribly for struggling chapters, but the older I get, the more I understand your exact point. I also understand the great benefit of having time to assess PNMs, both in the social scene and their grades.

amen to both points. IMO, if AZ had deferred recruitment, a sizeable percentage of the PNMs wouldn't be eligible to go through recruitment at all, due to either low GPA first semester, or to their behavior (you can fill in the blanks here). It would help reduce the numbers in the new member classes (campus total is 200, quota was 83 last August). We wouldn't have to sort through 1200+ PNMs in the dreaded heat and thunderstorms of August. I'm all for it, but doubt it will ever happen.

[HQWest]

Originally Posted by AzTheta

amen to both points. IMO, if AZ had deferred recruitment, a sizeable percentage of the PNMs wouldn't be eligible to go through recruitment at all, due to either low GPA first semester, or to their behavior (you can fill in the blanks here). It would help reduce the numbers in the new member classes (campus total is 200, quota was 83 last August). We wouldn't have to sort through 1200+ PNMs in the dreaded heat and thunderstorms of August. I'm all for it, but doubt it will ever happen.

That is assuming their behavior would be the same for the fall. Anyone can be good for one semester. It would not make the number of PNMs any less. It also makes for more rush crushes and drama