Women should get free birth control, panel says

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

The angry taxpayers are cleaning up the unicorn shit, also known as preventive health services, that only an idiot would consider stolen.

LOL! Every penny paid for in preventative health services is very wells spent. Otherwise we can go back to the days when syphillis was rampant like in Henry the VIII's time. Sounds great!

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

LOL! Every penny paid for in preventative health services is very wells spent. Otherwise we can go back to the days when syphillis was rampant like in Henry the VIII's time. Sounds great!

Send it Elephant Walk's way first.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

LOL! Every penny paid for in preventative health services is very wells spent. Otherwise we can go back to the days when syphillis was rampant like in Henry the VIII's time. Sounds great!

I'm confused on how preventative health services wouldn't exist, without public money.

Currently, gobs and gobs of private money goes into preventative care. And it works, better than the governments inefficient system. Why not enhance the private sector over the public, so that citizens are able to choose what to do and not do with their money?

The fact that you think that you have the right to tell anyone what to do with their money is absolutely disgusting. If you believe in limiting that personal freedom, you probably also want to ban gay marriage...at least if you didn't want to be hypocritical.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

I'm confused on how preventative health services wouldn't exist, without public money.

Because we're not operating in a hypothetical market - we're operating in an actual, defined system, one in which insurance companies have very little incentive to push preventative services (due to consumer, government and market pressures), and one in which their slavish devotion to quarterly earnings trumps the long-term cost benefit of pushing preventative measures anyway.

[AlwaysSAI]

Must this thread, of all threads, really turn into yet another GC barking contest?

ROOF! My bark is the loudest.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AlwaysSAI

Must this thread, of all threads, really turn into yet another GC barking contest?

ROOF! My bark is the loudest.

Uh...do you have something to share about the actual topic? That's the best way to keep a thread on topic.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by AlwaysSAI

Must this thread, of all threads, really turn into yet another GC barking contest?

ROOF! My bark is the loudest.

Is your bark the loudest? Or is your house the most dry?

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by AlwaysSAI

Must this thread, of all threads, really turn into yet another GC barking contest?

ROOF! My bark is the loudest.

Yes, people disagreeing and discussing matters at a moderately high level really takes a dump on a thread, doesn't it?

Take off your moderator pants, put on a pot of tea, and chill out. EW is somewhat one-note, but a lot of times there's an interesting point to discuss underneath the Libertrolling.

Also, it's like the most anti-Feminist thing on Earth to say "this thread, of all threads" - seriously?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Because we're not operating in a hypothetical market - we're operating in an actual, defined system, one in which insurance companies have very little incentive to push preventative services (due to consumer, government and market pressures), and one in which their slavish devotion to quarterly earnings trumps the long-term cost benefit of pushing preventative measures anyway.

I thought Elephant Walk was "smart enough" to know all of this. I guess not.

I was looking forward to reading different opinions on this. I welcome those who can express those opinions in a manner different than Elephant Walk.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Because we're not operating in a hypothetical market - we're operating in an actual, defined system,

Of course.

However, I suppose my hypotheticals come with caveats. If we are to remove healthcare funding from the federal budget, we are to remove total government intervention in the market. The problem is that we get a little free-market one way...but no free-market in another similar instance.

For example, the banks were able to spend boundless amounts of money and hand-out tons of loans. An exhibition of free-market Austrian capitalism. Except, that in direct opposition to this was the fiat money system, the FDIC, and the federal reserve. These federal regulations and propping up systems created moral hazards creating a collapse. No moral hazards/no government intervention...a functioning market. But when the invisible hand is not allowed to work, it is a nightmare.

With that said, I'm advocating the removal of the federal intervention in the health-care market...but if we remove universal health care, we must remove the whole disgusting mess.

So when you talk about,

one in which insurance companies have very little incentive to push preventative services (due to consumer, government and market pressures), and one in which their slavish devotion to quarterly earnings trumps the long-term cost benefit of pushing preventative measures anyway.

Which is created by a system propped up by the government, expounded by the fiat money system and welfare, you're going to have this mess. In spite of this consistent meddling by the federal government, the insurances still like preventative care. Insurance companies and companies that provide insurance love preventative care because it makes having you in their insurance cheaper. If they have a slavish devotion to quarterly earnings, they would have a slavish devotion to preventative measures which saves money. And they do. Do you really think that many corporations (including the one I work for) provide a gym because they want everyone to be skinny and hot?

No.

When you have a regulatory agency which consistently withholds drugs from the populace where it might be someone's last hope, where you have a federal government that prevents cheap drugs from other countries in order to support corporations (form of corporatism, eventual fascism), where you have a government who has now forced the populace to buy insurance (which again is another form of corporatism, eventual fascism) which in itself creates a terrible moral hazard and greatly increases the cost of care, and ultimately a government who props up a multiplicity of companies, you have a problem. The problems these last two or three decades have seen in regards to healthcare are not a result of a government hands-off approach, simply the opposite. The government has been too involved.

The Austrian Free-Market is compassion. The socialized market fakes compassion for power. Power over the powerless.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

I'm confused on how preventative health services wouldn't exist, without public money.

Currently, gobs and gobs of private money goes into preventative care. And it works, better than the governments inefficient system. Why not enhance the private sector over the public, so that citizens are able to choose what to do and not do with their money?

The fact that you think that you have the right to tell anyone what to do with their money is absolutely disgusting. If you believe in limiting that personal freedom, you probably also want to ban gay marriage...at least if you didn't want to be hypocritical.

Since I actually work in the real health system, this whole post is laughable. The fact that you actually think that providing people with preventative health care limits personal freedom gives me a pretty good idea of the level of logic skills you exhibit. I will refrain from getting into a philosophical debate with you about libertarianism. It's all well and good if every person has the same resources and the same belief system, but it quickly becomes deadly when people don't.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Since I actually work in the real health system, this whole post is laughable.

Excellent lambasting of the post. You and DrPhil are pretty much in the same boat, mentally.

The fact that you actually think that providing people with preventative health care limits personal freedom gives me a pretty good idea of the level of logic skills you exhibit.

Woah, talk about leaps of logic! I never said that providing people with preventative health care limits personal freedom. That's silly.

However, taking money at the barrel of a gun (the IRS/government is the gun) to give to other people is limiting personal freedom.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

Excellent lambasting of the post. You and DrPhil are pretty much in the same boat, mentally.

Oh yes, we definitely started with you and not the other way around.

Good luck with your hypotheticals.

[AOII Angel]

Wow...it must feel really horrible to be in American in EW's head. All this forced tyranny that has been going on for decades...how can he stand it?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Wow...it must feel really horrible to be in American in EW's head. All this forced tyranny that has been going on for decades...how can he stand it?

Hopefully he can't and will be escaping to a one-person island in the Pacific. Then he can talk shit with no risk of retort.