Funding cuts leave many without home heating assistance in Macon

[knight_shadow]

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

Feel free to actually point out how I derailed the conversation if you disagree.

Train of conversation goes like this:
"I don't want to judge but... "
"You're judging."
"but it looks bad."
"It shouldn't look like anything. People need to think."
"I did think... that she should sell it if she's really needy."

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Train of conversation goes like this:
"I don't want to judge but... "
"You're judging."
"but it looks bad."
"It shouldn't look like anything. People need to think."
"I did think... that she should sell it if she's really needy."

LOL. I see the train of conversation as this:

OP: "There is irony in this photo and it sucks that the photo was taken in front of her big flat screen TV. I don't know her but that photo kinda sucks."
Drolefille: "You are judging and that TV has nothing to do with anything (that's also an assumption)...oh look the article says she was once employed."
PiKA: "Yeah there is irony in that photo but perhaps the TV was bought during better times."
Drolefille: "Forget what you said about better times and irony in the photo...you are also judging and again that TV has nothing to do with anything (that's also an assumption) and I wish people would get their heads out of their asses and think (that's also an assumption)."
The audience: "Badumpalumpadumpalump...womp womp!"
PiKA: "Well, um...there is irony in that photo and the rest of what I'm going to type goes beyond my initial point of irony and will be interpreted to you as insult to the poor regardless of what I type."
Me: "Yeah I see how there can be irony in that photo and it reminds me of people in housing projects who have DishTV."
Drolefille: "Pointing out irony is different than judging."
Me: "Not really. They were also pointing out irony and I was also stating that it not only looks ironic but, if she hasn't done so already, she needs to try to sell that technology in the background of that photo."
The audience: "Badumpalumpadumpalump...womp womp!"

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by FHwku

if you're gonna complain about being turned away from the Energy Assistance Program (it helps with home heating bills in the winter,) maybe you shouldn't do it in front of your big ass TV.

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Yet the TV has nothing at all to do with whether or not someone can afford heating. So yeah, you're being judgmental. There's no way that things could have been going better for her two years ago and/or she got it as a gift and/or it's really none of anyone's damn business.

Originally Posted by PiKA2001

Yes, she probably did buy the TV during "better days" but she shouldn't have taken that picture. It just looks....bad.

Originally Posted by Drolefille

But the point is it shouldn't look like anything. People should remove heads from anuses and think before judging.

So, it went from "don't take a picture in front of a big TV" to "stop being judgmental because she could have gotten the TV earlier" to "yea, she probably did get the TV earlier, but she shouldn't have taken a picture in front of it" to "remove your heads from your asses."

With your background, it makes sense that you would be able to provide a different perspective, but that doesn't mean that others aren't allowed to pose questions. We don't know this woman, so this is just discussion.

[Drolefille]

K_S, i'm very specific about telling people directly if I'm including them in the heads/asses category. If I'd included PIKA in that statement, I would have said so.

And see my previous comment about the difference between asking questions and making judgments. If you don't think that where PIKA ended up in this conversation was judgmental, that's your prerogative. I didn't make anyone say anything they didn't want to say, and like I said, I'm not moved by the argument that my tone was the problem here.

/or you know, I'm just bitchy because I have an ex or something.

ETA: These are personal opinions btw. Informed by my professional experiences, but personal. The things my professional opinions are oriented towards are more like emotions, thinking patterns, and mental illnesses. In my job I wouldn't call someone a judgmental asshole. Unless I thought it would really clinically benefit him to hear it.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

With your background, it makes sense that you would be able to provide a different perspective, but that doesn't mean that others aren't allowed to pose questions. We don't know this woman, so this is just discussion.

That assumes that others in this thread don't share Drolefille's background or that most people with Drolefille's background share her sentiments outside of a professional context (personal opinions are often kept separate from the professional).

Ain't no one posing questions and no one is pretending to know the woman in the photo. It's really just a general discussion of social welfare based on appearances and that's what the irony of the photo is--appearances. LOL.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

K_S, i'm very specific about telling people directly if I'm including them in the heads/asses category. If I'd included PIKA in that statement, I would have said so.

You included PiKA in the "needing to think" category and that's why he responded as he did. LOL.

Originally Posted by Drolefille

And see my previous comment about the difference between asking questions and making judgments.

Asking questions for what? What is there to ask? LOL.

Originally Posted by Drolefille

...I'm not moved by the argument that my tone was the problem here.

I wouldn't say you were not totally unmoved by the subject matter. You already said you were defensive based on your experiences.

This discussion is really quite funny to me because such discussions assume that people are so fragile that they can't hear some brutal truths even if the brutal truths don't apply 100% to their personal circumstances. Smart people who can let go of their ego for a minute are able to see whether their life choices have shaped their financial outcomes. That's one of the first lessons when talking to people within the Black community about poverty. If you're going to be all mad and assume that people are judging you (in general) just because they are only going based on the information in front of them (i.e. a flat screen TV when you're asking for financial assistance), you will have a very long financial road ahead of you.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

That assumes that others in this thread don't share Drolefille's background or that most people with Drolefille's background shares her sentiments outside of a professional context (personal opinions are often kept separate from the professional).

Ain't no one posing questions and no one is pretending to know this woman. It's really just a general discussion of social welfare based on appearances and that's what the irony of the photo is--appearances. LOL.

Why is she taking a picture in front of that big ass TV? wasn't explicitly asked, but I gathered that from the responses.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

You included PiKA in the "needing to think" category and that's why he responded as he did. LOL.

No, I didn't, those were the same sentence.

Asking questions for what? What is there to ask? LOL.

I don't know, ks is the one saying they're being asked.

I wouldn't say you were not totally unmoved by the subject matter. You already said you were defensive based on your experiences.

Yep, but I don't take responsibility for anyone else's responses, nor do I believe my tone is responsible for some how taking this thread down the road it went, somehow making people say assholish things.

This discussion is really quite funny to me because such discussions assume that people are so fragile that they can't hear some brutal truths even if the brutal truths don't apply 100% to their personal circumstances. Smart people who can let go of their ego for a minute are able to see whether their life choices have shaped their financial outcomes. That's one of the first lessons when talking to people within the Black community about poverty. If you're going to be all mad and assume that people are judging you (in general) just because they are only going based on the information in front of them (i.e. a flat screen TV when you're asking for financial assistance), you will have a very long financial road ahead of you.

I think there's a pretty big difference between talking to, and talking about. And if this had been a more general conversation rather than a specifically targeted one I would have felt differently about the responses.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by PiKA2001

Why don't you put your money where your mouth is then? If you are against YOUR tax cut and believe you shouldn't receive it then donate it (as opposed to saving it) to a non profit that assists the needy.

I really don't think you're getting my point here. I think since you are ASSUMING that I'm a Republican you are reading between the lines and think that I'm anti welfare. I never said anything about letting people live in cardboard boxes or cutting out welfare, but we need to be helping the people who really need help and not the people trying to maintain their lifestyle. How is it "fair" if a lady who shows up in line first but owns a late model car and an expensive entertainment system gets assistance over a lady who has never been able to afford a car or a entertainment system? IDK if you read the article posted by Low C but do you think that family should get utility credits, foodstamps, free school lunch program? I mean, they are struggling!

I do put my money where my mouth is. I vote Democratic. I donate money to charity. I also save money so that I do have that cushion we have been talking about. It's called being responsible. If I wasn't putting my money where my mouth was, I'd just go out and buy a 3D TV and a new surround sound system and maybe some furniture with the money.

As for "fair", I'll let you in on something. Life isn't fair. The asshats who set up the program made the program that way. It's not the fault of the woman who needs assistance that has more means than her neighbor and gets the assistance because she showed up first if that's the way the program was set up. I haven't had time to read the story posted by Low C sharp since I've been working all day, but I'll get around to it. This country has been all about cutting off aid because people think the poor are just trying to get something for nothing....until of course someone THEY know needs assistance.

Also, I think you are missing the point that you have no way of knowing that people are trying to "maintain their lifestyles." Sorry, if welfare money is a lifestyle, it's a pretty crappy one.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

Why is she taking a picture in front of that big ass TV? wasn't explicitly asked, but I gathered that from the responses.

I already know why she's taking the picture in front of the TV: She wasn't thinking about the irony and wasn't paying attention to her background. The photographer and reporter probably were. LOL.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

As for "fair", I'll let you in on something. Life isn't fair.

So keep the judgmental party going.

[knight_shadow]

Ahhh...there's that party affiliation thing.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

I think there's a pretty big difference between talking to, and talking about. And if this had been a more general conversation rather than a specifically targeted one I would have felt differently about the responses.

I don't think there's any difference between talking to and talking about and that difference that you see is based on your perception (just as the perceived difference between pointing out irony and judging).

No one cares about this woman and her TV. She was used as an illustration of a larger point. She, specifically, was lost in the discussion pages ago. We've moved on to talking about people in the projects who have rims on their cars and how poor people can sell their flat screen TVs.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

I don't think there's any difference between talking to and talking about and that difference that you see is based on your perception (just as the perceived difference between pointing out irony and judging).

No one cares about this woman and her TV. She was used as an illustration of a larger point. She, specifically, was lost in the discussion pages ago. We've moved on to talking about people in the projects who have rims on their cars and how poor people can sell their flat screen TVs.

Feel free to disagree, but I'd rather be talked to about something than talked about behind my back, for example. And working with a community provides a lot more knowledge than the anecdata presented so often by people who have minmal experience or contact with the population. While the discussion has indeed moved on, originally it was directed at the individual (and later a few other individuals).