Feds to file lawsuit over Arizona immigration law

[DaemonSeid]

Senator John Kyl wants to repeal the 14th Amendment

And Lindsay Graham also


Seriously dude??? Wow.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Senator John Kyl wants to repeal the 14th Amendment


Seriously dude??? Wow.

He doesn't want to repeal the whole thing, just the part giving citizenship birth. That'd be a pretty rational thing to do considering the state of things.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Kevin

He doesn't want to repeal the whole thing, just the part giving citizenship birth. That'd be a pretty rational thing to do considering the state of things.

The result would be an underclass of people who were not citizens of the US or any other country. Those people would HAVE to work under the table. It's a stupid idea no matter ~*the state of things*~

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

The result would be an underclass of people who were not citizens of the US or any other country. Those people would HAVE to work under the table. It's a stupid idea no matter ~*the state of things*~

Mexico and most other countries will grant citizenship to children of citizens. If their citizens are here illegally and have anchor babies, why should it be our problem? Why further victimize innocent American taxpayers with people who shouldn't be here in the first place who will be receiving thousands in subsidies? How is that sane?

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Mexico and most other countries will grant citizenship to children of citizens. If their citizens are here illegally and have anchor babies, why should it be our problem? Why further victimize innocent American taxpayers with people who shouldn't be here in the first place who will be receiving thousands in subsidies? How is that sane?

You're assuming the children are a "problem." They're citizens. 2nd and 3rd generations assimilate into American society. Even the non-citizen children, the ones targeted by the DREAM Act, are fully functioning productive members of society.

And furthermore how would revoking the children's citizenship actually relieve any burden? If they're here they're still going to get medical care for example.

Finally what happens when those non-citizen children have children?

The constitution declares that Mexicans by birth—that is, natural born Mexicans—are:[1]

* those individuals born in Mexican territory regardless of the nationality of their parents;
* those individuals born abroad if one or both of their parents was a Mexican national born in Mexican territory;
* those individuals born abroad if one or both of their parents was a Mexican national by naturalization; and
* those individuals born in Mexican merchant or Navy ships or Mexican merchant or Army aircrafts

First generation comes here, second generation is born here, third generation has NO citizenship (or nationality as Mexico defines it). None. We're a country of immigrants, some brought here by force, some by deceit, some for opportunity.

Immigrants are not why "the state of things" are bad. California is not going bankrupt because of illegal immigrants. Yet they get the blame for all of it because it's easier than fixing the problem.

[DaemonSeid]

Here is what I find 'funny' about this whole thing.

I posted earlier this year that the GOP tasked Micheal Steele with recruiting Hispanics to their cause...now with the flap in Arizona, they can kiss that vote goodbye...so with that, why not make a play on the 14th amendment?

Now Lamar Smith seems a bit more rational, introducing a bill denying brithright citizenship rather than wrecking havok on what's already in existance.

Just my 2 cents.

And just to be clear, click here

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

I posted earlier this year that the GOP tasked Micheal Steele with recruiting Hispanics to their cause...now with the flap in Arizona, they can kiss that vote goodbye...so with that, why not make a play on the 14th amendment?click here

I fail to see why legal Hispanic citizens would be in favor of illegal immigration. It seems that illegal immigration would probably do more financial damage to them than any other subset of the population.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by Kevin

I fail to see why legal Hispanic citizens would be in favor of illegal immigration. It seems that illegal immigration would probably do more financial damage to them than any other subset of the population.

What I posted has nothing to do about Hispanics being in favor or not of illegal immigration. You know like I do, that the whole bill itself in Arizona did nothing more than targeted and profiled ALL Hispanics, as well as inspire xenophobia, so yes, a party that is trying to gain their support designing a bill to single out that same group of people is going to cause loss of support.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

What I posted has nothing to do about Hispanics being in favor or not of illegal immigration. You know like I do, that the whole bill itself in Arizona did nothing more than targeted and profiled ALL Hispanics, as well as inspire xenophobia, so yes, a party that is trying to gain their support designing a bill to single out that same group of people is going to cause loss of support.

The bill expressly says that race is not a factor in reaching probable cause.

We've been over that.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by Kevin

The bill expressly says that race is not a factor in reaching probable cause.

We've been over that.

2 words.

Bull and Shit.

"My ancestors"....we aren't ready for a pissing contest stretcting back 400+ years about who deserves to be here legally or illegally...because if I factor mine in...you would lose.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by Kevin

The bill expressly says that race is not a factor in reaching probable cause.

We've been over that.

Then what are the factors for probable cause that police should use as instructive? Riding a burro while wearing a poncho?

The bill's provisions don't pass the smell test in the slightest.

[starang21]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

What I posted has nothing to do about Hispanics being in favor or not of illegal immigration. You know like I do, that the whole bill itself in Arizona did nothing more than targeted and profiled ALL Hispanics, as well as inspire xenophobia, so yes, a party that is trying to gain their support designing a bill to single out that same group of people is going to cause loss of support.

a speculative argument at best. one that shows your own personal bias. it's not the laws fault that 5 out of every 6 illegal immigrants are hispanic.

just because we have a colonialistic history, doesn't mean we need to rescind the laws of today.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by starang21

a speculative argument at best. one that shows your own personal bias. it's not the laws fault that 5 out of every 6 illegal immigrants are hispanic.

just because we have a colonialistic history, doesn't mean we need to rescind the laws of today.

With all that's been going on in Arizona it's hard to say that this law has the best of intentions in mind.

it's not about rescinding the law it's about not passing laws that are BAD laws which target a specific people i.e. HISPANICS.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Kevin

I fail to see why legal Hispanic citizens would be in favor of illegal immigration. It seems that illegal immigration would probably do more financial damage to them than any other subset of the population.

Probably because they're not a hive mind and have different opinions like everyone else. Hell, as cheesy and dumb as it was, CNN had "Family Divided" featured this past weekend. Large, hispanic family that was split about 50/50 regarding their beliefs on immigration.

[Drolefille]

That bill violates the amendment. Precedent is very clear that not being "under the jurisdiction of the US" only excludes foreign diplomats and an invading army.

Passing such a law is a bad idea both symbolically - as it damages the image of what America is - and practically.