Miami University Pi Beta Phi Suspended

[MUGreek2011]

"So pledges AND initiated members play on the basketball teams. So what??? That's how it should be."

We have an entire fraternity intramural league for that. The event I mentioned was an opportunity, early in their pledging, for the pledge class to bond on its own. There are a multitude of opportunities for them to do stuff with brothers, this was an opportunity for them to do something as a pledge class, and now that is gone. As to the other poster who said 'why can't the chapter just do something together with the pledges', trust me, we do. Probably 80% of the active brothers are there cheering on their pledges, as they are at the other events like this. It was a really neat event, I'm sure the pledges enjoyed getting cheered on by ~75 people. Many of them cited that tournament as one of the better moments of their pledging, as they realized that we really wanted the best for them and they had a whole chapter behind them for the first time. Now that's gone.

"Calling a spade a spade" is fine amongst your brothers or behind closed doors, but to do as he did in a public manner is not mature or professional. It makes him look like he has a big chip on his shoulder against Sigma Chi, and/or makes it look like sour grapes because the chapter he advises is losing rushees to them. I've never been to Miami, have no clue of the fraternity reputations there, and that's exactly how it comes across to me.

As far as losing rushees to Sigma Chi: Jerry couldn't care less where teenage kids rush, just that they do and that they end up being better men for having been in a fraternity. Like I said, he's helped many fraternities, including mine, who competes more directly with the one he advises than Sigma Chi does. If he was only motivated by helping his own chapter, he wouldn't be assisting mine, who has gotten kids that his chapter wanted badly. But you know what? Even after that, as his chapter goes downhill (through no fault of his own), he continues to help those who seek his help. If you had been to Miami, you would know the chapters involved and would know that his chapter does not recruit the same types of guys at all so his chapter isn't losing anyone to Sigma Chi. He talks in the article about how Sigma Chi used to be an exemplary chapter, as any alpha should be. This is not a petty man dealing with petty matters. He is retiring in a semester and is airing the greek system's dirty laundry in hopes we might rectify it. Hell, he's given us the tools to do so, it's high time it's done. This man has done everything in his power to help the greek system, not tear it down. Please quit making assumptions without knowing the campus landscape at all, as they have been completely inaccurate.

Here's my question: if Pi Phi is such a raging bunch of alcholic brats who drag the whole Greek community down, why have they continued to exist? Why do they keep getting good sized pledge classes? Why do fraternities continue to mix with them? Obviously the only time that anyone truly gives a shit about what they do is when they get caught and it gets Miami's name dragged through the mud.

See the response above mine. Not many fraternities do mix with them--they hang out almost entirely with one fraternity in particular. Which is fine, but to suggest that a sorority filled with drunken brats will not recruit well is to overestimate freshman rushees who mostly just want to get into the 'top tier' (read: best looking) sorority.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by MUGreek2011

The event I mentioned was an opportunity, early in their pledging, for the pledge class to bond on its own. There are a multitude of opportunities for them to do stuff with brothers, this was an opportunity for them to do something as a pledge class, and now that is gone.

And what about the fraternity whose pledges are not athletic and could care less, who feel compelled to participate? Do you really think they enjoy it? There are tons and tons and TONS of ways for pledge classes to bond with each other without the whole Greek community watching them and judging them.

Originally Posted by MUGreek2011

Please quit making assumptions without knowing the campus landscape at all, as they have been completely inaccurate.

My point exactly. This article will be widely distributed in the wake of all that's happened, and 99% of the people who read it won't know jack about Miami. If he's writing things that people outside the Miami community will read, he needs to think about how those people will interpret them. And I'm betting a lot of people will interpret them just as I did - see some of the previous posts on this thread.

Originally Posted by MUGreek2011

See the response above mine. Not many fraternities do mix with them--they hang out almost entirely with one fraternity in particular. Which is fine, but to suggest that a sorority filled with drunken brats will not recruit well is to overestimate freshman rushees who mostly just want to get into the 'top tier' (read: best looking) sorority.

According to a friend who is an alum, there are very, very few unattractive girls at Miami. To state that best looking = top tier seems somewhat simplistic. All that aside, there is still some amount of self-policing that can be done when a group's actions are found inappropriate by the Greek community. That apparently hasn't happened.

[MUGreek2011]

Originally Posted by 33girl

And what about the fraternity whose pledges are not athletic and could care less, who feel compelled to participate? Do you really think they enjoy it? There are tons and tons and TONS of ways for pledge classes to bond with each other without the whole Greek community watching them and judging them.

I'll bet you're one of those people who think we shouldn't keep score in youth sports too? Everyone's a winner!

My point exactly. This article will be widely distributed in the wake of all that's happened, and 99% of the people who read it won't know jack about Miami. If he's writing things that people outside the Miami community will read, he needs to think about how those people will interpret them. And I'm betting a lot of people will interpret them just as I did - see some of the previous posts on this thread.

Or maybe he made a conscious decision that the call to arms to improve was more important what some uninformed, judgmental outsiders will think?

According to a friend who is an alum, there are very, very few unattractive girls at Miami. To state that best looking = top tier seems somewhat simplistic. All that aside, there is still some amount of self-policing that can be done when a group's actions are found inappropriate by the Greek community. That apparently hasn't happened.

Well, that's just not true. I go there now--maybe your friend has extremely low standards, but even within the sorority system (self-selected), we all know which sororities are largely attractive and unattractive. I'm not going to name names because that's not the kinda guy I am, but rest assured there are those on both ends of the spectrum.

With all that being said, my primary reason for posting here in the first place was to defend one of Miami's greek community's greatest assets from attacks by people who knew not about what they spoke. I have no desire to spend the rest of my day going back and forth with someone who clearly doesn't know what they are talking about, so I'm going to go sit by the pool and indulge in a summer beverage instead. Cheers.

[LaneSig]

Originally Posted by MUGreek2011

With all that being said, my primary reason for posting here in the first place was to defend one of Miami's greek community's greatest assets from attacks by people who knew not about what they spoke. I have no desire to spend the rest of my day going back and forth with someone who clearly doesn't know what they are talking about, so I'm going to go sit by the pool and indulge in a summer beverage instead. Cheers.

I didn't realize that guys could flounce.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by LaneSig

I didn't realize that guys could flounce.

We've had a plethora lately.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by MUGreek2011

I'll bet you're one of those people who think we shouldn't keep score in youth sports too? Everyone's a winner!


Or maybe he made a conscious decision that the call to arms to improve was more important what some uninformed, judgmental outsiders will think?


Well, that's just not true. I go there now--maybe your friend has extremely low standards, but even within the sorority system (self-selected), we all know which sororities are largely attractive and unattractive. I'm not going to name names because that's not the kinda guy I am, but rest assured there are those on both ends of the spectrum.

With all that being said, my primary reason for posting here in the first place was to defend one of Miami's greek community's greatest assets from attacks by people who knew not about what they spoke. I have no desire to spend the rest of my day going back and forth with someone who clearly doesn't know what they are talking about, so I'm going to go sit by the pool and indulge in a summer beverage instead. Cheers.

1. No, definitely not, I just think there are far better ways for pledges (male and female) to bond than taking part in a campus competition.

2. "Improvement" is not an excuse to act like a dick and call people out, especially if you're old enough to know better.

3. Apparently the apple isn't falling far from the tree.

4.