kappa sigma at fgcu?

[Rambler1869]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

FGCU did not invent this rule. Many schools require council membership for liability purposes.

So it sounds like your issue is not with FGCU, but with IFC, an entity that does not want you at this time.

Not necessarily; the school does need all groups to be registered, provide a copy of bylaws, and list of all members for liability purposes; but that's just about it. The governing body is a seperate matter.

The fight is with FGCU, not the IFC. A group of students, does not have the right to ban a lawful group of students to form an organization. They can prevent that group from being members of their own organization (IFC can vote no to IFC recognition; but they cannot vote to have them not form at all). However, the school itself, by equal protection laws is still bound to let every organization apply to become a registered student organization.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by Rambler1869

Not necessarily; the school does need all groups to be registered, provide a copy of bylaws, and list of all members for liability purposes; but that's just about it. The governing body is a seperate matter.

The fight is with FGCU, not the IFC. A group of students, does not have the right to ban a lawful group of students to form an organization. They can prevent that group from being members of their own organization (IFC can vote no to IFC recognition; but they cannot vote to have them not form at all). However, the school itself, by equal protection laws is still bound to let every organization apply to become a registered student organization.

Your organization was formed.

You needed to be a member of a Greek council to be a Greek organization.

You were allowed (by FGCU) to petition for membership in IFC.

IFC didn't want you right now. You'll have to wait.

[Rambler1869]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

Your organization was formed.

You needed to be a member of a Greek council to be a Greek organization.

You were allowed (by FGCU) to petition for membership in IFC.

IFC didn't want you right now. You'll have to wait.

Formed, off campus - not using school facilities. This goes back to the heart of the issue.

You do not need to be a member of a Greek council to be a Greek organization; this is a very common misconception.

The point, was being allowed to become a Registered Student Organization; which can be outside of IFC. As you do not need to be part of the Greek Council, to be a Greek organization; IFC recognition would be the ideal route, however it isnt needed to be a fraternity on a public university. As it stands, these men were denied the right to even apply as an RSO.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by Rambler1869

Formed, off campus - not using school facilities. This goes back to the heart of the issue.

You do not need to be a member of a Greek council to be a Greek organization; this is a very common misconception.

The point, was being allowed to become a Registered Student Organization; which can be outside of IFC. As you do not need to be part of the Greek Council, to be a Greek organization; IFC recognition would be the ideal route, however it isnt needed to be a fraternity on a public university. As it stands, these men were denied the right to even apply as an RSO.

If you want to be recognized by the school as a GLO and the school requires GLOs to have council membership, then yes, you do.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by KSigAdvisor

Knight Shadow, I don't think calling you out is productive, but facts are facts, and you are wrong on your liability comment. Creative a fictitious "governing body" does not absolve FGCU from liability in any way. Unless you can provide proof, I believe you completely made up that comment. One thing you are right about is that "many" universities adopt this policy, but listen on. PRIVATE universities adopt this policy because they can do whatever they want. They are private and can ban all fraternities if they'd like. FGCU is a public university and an arm of the State of Florida. Being a governmental entity, they cannot operate this way. If they hold steadfast to the position that they can, then we will have to duke it out in court someday, but we are hoping to avoid litigation because it is costly and lengthy. In the meantime, the undergraduates are being punished unfairly. They are being denied the same rights you enjoy, and that is unfair to them.

LOL

You can believe I made up the comment if you want.

It's clear that you think talking in circles and throwing a "XXX v. YYY" in your lengthy responses shows that you know what you're talking about.

If you feel that your rights have been violated, stop bitching to random usernames and take it up in court. If your argument is as strong as you think it is, you should be on FGCU's campus in no time.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by KSigAdvisor

Dr. Phil, quit taking shots, we are trying to be productive, and I think we are past the name calling.

No.

Rambler1869:
There are a lot of institutions that will not allow organizations to charter a chapter unless they will automatically or eventually be under a Greek council. This allows all GLOs to be under an "umbrella" so that this "umbrella" (in combination with the local/regional or district/national entities of the GLOs) can keep it all in check. Then the Greek Life offices and the institutions have a context through which they can impose their rules and regulations.

People used to say that the rules and regulations of their GLOs supercede those of the institutions, but it actually works the other way around much of the time because the institutions are "allowing" them to be on that campus.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by KSigAdvisor

"You needed to be a member of a Greek council to be a Greek organization."

No, we don't, according to the equal protection clause of the 14th amendment. We don't have to be accepted by IFC to be recognized by FGCU.

Oh wow.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by KSigAdvisor

What are you "Oh, wowing," Dr. Phil? Please provide support under any law of this State of federally where it is legal to deny recognition to students because their fellow students don't want them around. Please.

Again, we will win in court, but if we can avoid it, we will. So you guys know, filing a complaint in federal court and going through the first few stages can cost up the $50,000. We don't waste fraternity capital on lawsuits until we absolutely have to. It's called being fiscally responsible. We focus on keeping our undergraduate dues and liability costs among the cheapest in the fraternal world.

Then why the hell are you complaining about it here? What do you think we, as usernames, are going to do to change the outcome?