too broke to bury their dead

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Imus

Isn't it a statistical fact that the sales of Toyota and Nissan dropped just like the Big 3's sales dropped?

Everyone's sales dropped. Not everyone had to file for bankruptcy.

[Imus]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Everyone's sales dropped. Not everyone had to file for bankruptcy.

Everyone's sales dropped? Both non-union and union sales dropped? Why did the non-union sales drop? Didn't you say it was the unions fault?


PS. Why did a great non union company like Yugo go out of business?

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Imus

Everyone's sales dropped? Both non-union and union sales dropped? Why did the non-union sales drop? Didn't you say it was the unions fault?

PS. Why did a great non union company like Yugo go out of business?

So Imus, what are you driving at here? That the unions played no role in the collapse of two of the Big 3? That paying out insane wages and benefits for essentially unskilled labor is a good business strategy? What exactly?

A Honda plant was just opened up in Indiana just this year. How long has it been since Michigan opened a new auto plant? Early 90's maybe? Why do yo think that is?

[KSigkid]

Originally Posted by Kevin

So Imus, what are you driving at here? That the unions played no role in the collapse of two of the Big 3?

Imus/Madmax is intensely pro-union, so I think that's exactly the point he/she is driving at in his/her posts.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by goldar

There (sic) pay is only a few bucks an hour more than non union workers at Toyota, Honda, or Nissan. The biggest difference in the Big 3's cost is the underfunded pensions which is management's fault. You should also blame the 20,000 other companies(mostly NON union) that also have underfunded pensions.

That's laughable. It's not just the pay, it's the rigid job descriptions, the overpayment of people like janitors, the refusal to outsource for things like janitorial services, etc. Unions hamstring companies and are the reason decent paying manufacturing jobs in the U.S. are history.

PS. How much do union plumbers make vs non union plumbers? About double?

Actually, the plumbers and pipefitters union actually works with employers to ensure that employers receive a decent profit while providing employment. The formula (in theory) is supposed to actually make it less expensive for a company to use union labor instead of non-union. This is a good example of a union doing what all unions ought to be doing.