Innocent bystander Derrion Albert killed

[DrPhil]

Kids aren't "so bad now."

We just hear more about the negative because of the Internet and other media outlets.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Kids aren't "so bad now."

We just hear more about the negative because of the Internet and other media outlets.

The internet was up-and-coming when I was coming up, but I still don't recall hearing things being as bad as they are nowadays.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

The internet was up-and-coming when I was coming up, but I still don't recall hearing things being as bad as they are nowadays.

I recall hearing it when you were coming up. I'm 7 years older than you.**

You wouldn't have heard it unless you were a news watching kid or scoured the up and coming Internet for news stories (or you saw it firsthand, as many people did). Since your childhood, crime and violence are much more popular to report for mainstream media outlets. Here we are discussing this on a "fun" social networking site. This fuels the fear of crime and fear of "omg, times are changing!!!" that you hear from people--even young people who don't know what the hell things were like 10-20 years ago, anyway.

** I also recall hearing about it when I was a kid and there was no Internet or mainstream/super cool/hip and popular media outlets to report it. We'd hear via word of mouth; and the local and evening news and news papers always got a kick out of reporting things that they knew would shock people's sensibilities. Yes, I was a news watching/newspaper reading kid because my parents made us do that.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Yes, I was a news watching/newspaper reading kid because my parents made us do that.

Same here

I recall hearing it when you were coming up. I'm 7 years older than you.**

You wouldn't have heard it unless you were a news watching kid or scoured the up and coming Internet for news stories. Since your childhood, crime and violence are much more popular to report for mainstream media outlets. Here we are discussing this on a "fun" social networking site. This fuels the fear of crime and fear of "omg, times are changing!!!" that you hear from people--even young people who don't know what the hell things were like 10-20 years ago, anyway.

** I also recall hearing about it when I was a kid and there was no Internet or mainstream/super cool/hip and popular media outlets to report it. We'd hear via word of mouth; and the local and evening news and news papers always got a kick out of reporting things that they knew would shock people's sensibilities.

I'm not naive enough to think that violence was non-existent during my upbringing. "Community policing" was widespread when I was growing up, though. There were several instances where fights were going to jump off, but parents and residents stepped in before things got out of control. Those kids were properly dealt with after the fact, too.

I agree that the internet and "NOW NOW NOW" media has contributed to our knowing about these incidents sooner, but (outside of LA/Chi gang issues) I don't remember hearing of this many truly disturbing events.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

I'm not naive enough to think that violence was non-existent during my upbringing. "Community policing" was widespread when I was growing up, though. There were several instances where fights were going to jump off, but parents and residents stepped in before things got out of control. Those kids were properly dealt with after the fact, too.

I agree that the internet and "NOW NOW NOW" media has contributed to our knowing about these incidents sooner, but (outside of LA/Chi gang issues) I don't remember hearing of this many truly disturbing events.

Right...this is all about the community efforts for your particular community and the fact that you don't "recall" hearing "this many" truly disturbing events in the news.

Not the same thing as kids today being off the wall and things being hugely different than they were when you were young.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Right...this is all about the community efforts for your particular community and the fact that you don't "recall" hearing "this many" truly disturbing events in the news.

Not the same thing as kids today being off the wall and things being hugely different than they were when you were young.

Multiple communities (I was a military brat, so I moved around a lot), but I see your point.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

Multiple communities, but I see your point.

LOL...it could be 200 communities (although only 1% of those would have effective "community policing") and the point is still the same.

[cheerfulgreek]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

The internet was up-and-coming when I was coming up, but I still don't recall hearing things being as bad as they are nowadays.

I agree. If it isn't getting bad or much hasn't changed, then why all the school shootings?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by cheerfulgreek

I agree. If it isn't getting bad or much hasn't changed, then why all the school shootings?

Why all of what school shootings ("school shootings" and mass killings like Columbine aren't the same criminological dynamic)? The ones that always happened or just the ones that made national news? Speaking of, have there been any school shootings in the national news in the past month?

There were school shootings when I was in middle school and high school. Students were holding principals up at gunpoint. The media and the majority of the American public just didn't care until it was white people bringing guns to school. Then it was more than "those bad minorities in those poor neighborhoods with their crackhead parents." That's all.

[There were also pregnancy pacts when I was in middle school and high school. That's why I am humored by the media attention given to those girls who did that pregnancy pact this year. Oh, the outrage...this didn't happen when WE were kids...and let's blame Jamie Lynn Spears.]

[cheerfulgreek]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Why all of what school shootings ("school shootings" and mass killings like Columbine aren't the same criminological dynamic)? The ones that always happened or just the ones that made national news? Speaking of, have there been any school shootings in the national news in the past month?

There were school shootings when I was in middle school and high school. Students were holding principals up at gunpoint. The media and the majority of the American public just didn't care until it was white people bringing guns to school. Then it was more than "those bad minorities in those poor neighborhoods with their crackhead parents." That's all.

[There were also pregnancy pacts when I was in middle school and high school. That's why I am humored by the media attention given to those girls who did that pregnancy pact this year. Oh, the outrage...this didn't happen when WE were kids...and let's blame Jamie Lynn Spears.]

DrPhil I agree, and I've never looked at it like that. However, don't you think there are good reasons to dwell on school shootings even though they are rare? I dunno, I just think they're an unprecedented kind of adolescent violence.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by cheerfulgreek

However, don't you think there are good reasons to dwell on school shootings even though they are rare?

No, dwelling on the acts themselves exaggerates their prevalence.

Observe the potential for such incidents, but dwell on the underlying point of raising children well and giving children and young adults healthy and positive outlets. The same stuff that we should be teaching each generation, anyway. This will buffer the negative effects of the Internet and other intrusive media outlets and social influences.

[cheerfulgreek]

Originally Posted by jojapeach

Why do things seem out of control to some of us (even early 30s like me)? Too many symptoms, but my top ones are lackadaisacal(sp?) parenting and kids too easily influenced by what they see in the media. The kids play violent video games but fail to separate the game from real life. Songs on the radio and videos on tv like "Girl Fight" glamorizing "swinging them thangs". (Sorry, I couldn't think of anything more current.) Value of life and self are just out of the equation in so many areas of this generation.

I know we had violence when I was a kid because a student in my HS was shot and killed on a rival campus in my sophomore year, but there were probably 2 total murders during my 4 yrs of HS.

Originally Posted by DrPhil

No, dwelling on the acts themselves exaggerates their prevalence.

Observe the potential for such incidents, but dwell on the underlying point of raising children well and giving children and young adults healthy and positive outlets. The same stuff that we should be teaching each generation, anyway. This will buffer the negative effects of the Internet and other intrusive media outlets and social influences.

I actually agree with both of these posts.