Judge Obama on performance alone - from the WSJ

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by deepimpact2

Yeah. I get so tired of people accusing me of voting for him and approving of him because of his skin color. That's SUCH a tired way of thinking.

Those people would have a 98% chance of being right about you voting for him (assuming you're black).

[deepimpact2]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

Those people would have a 98% chance of being right about you voting for him (assuming you're black).

How did you come to that conclusion?

I mean besides obvious racists, I don't automatically assume that someone white voted for McCain because he was white. So I fail to see why people automatically assume that black people voted for Obama because he's black. Implicit in such statements is the notion that black people aren't intelligent enough to discern whether someone has the capability to run this country, and they only care about skin color.

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by deepimpact2

How did you come to that conclusion?

I mean besides obvious racists, I don't automatically assume that someone white voted for McCain because he was white. So I fail to see why people automatically assume that black people voted for Obama because he's black. Implicit in such statements is the notion that black people aren't intelligent enough to discern whether someone has the capability to run this country, and they only care about skin color.

I came to that conclusion because you said that people assume you voted for obama because of your skin color... that statement only makes sense if you're black.
I never said that I think you voted for him because he's black, simply that 98% of black people DID vote for him. Race was certainly an important factor in this decision- I will cite that Kerry only received 88% of the vote.
You can say that race wasn't a contributing factor to Obama's high totals in 2008 but I will wholeheartedly disagree. I think that his race helped him more than it hurt him.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

I came to that conclusion because you said that people assume you voted for obama because of your skin color... that statement only makes sense if you're black.
I never said that I think you voted for him because he's black, simply that 98% of black people DID vote for him. Race was certainly an important factor in this decision- I will cite that Kerry only received 88% of the vote.
You can say that race wasn't a contributing factor to Obama's high totals in 2008 but I will wholeheartedly disagree. I think that his race helped him more than it hurt him.

You're mixing words now.

Your conclusion does not logically follow your premise.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

I came to that conclusion because you said that people assume you voted for obama because of your skin color... that statement only makes sense if you're black.
I never said that I think you voted for him because he's black, simply that 98% of black people DID vote for him. Race was certainly an important factor in this decision- I will cite that Kerry only received 88% of the vote.
You can say that race wasn't a contributing factor to Obama's high totals in 2008 but I will wholeheartedly disagree. I think that his race helped him more than it hurt him.

remember too that is 98% of an approx. 12% population.

I think his age and his being in touch with younger voters, regardless of their color, is what gave him his edge also...don't forget that.

There were people out there who feared a McCain presidency due to his advanced age and to what lurked behind should something had happemed to him, if he had made office.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by deepimpact2

How did you come to that conclusion?

I mean besides obvious racists, I don't automatically assume that someone white voted for McCain because he was white. So I fail to see why people automatically assume that black people voted for Obama because he's black. Implicit in such statements is the notion that black people aren't intelligent enough to discern whether someone has the capability to run this country, and they only care about skin color.

PhiGam is just being PhiGam. There is no valid or reliable method of quantifying this.

Voting patterns are largely based on familiarity. It's also why many people blindly vote along party lines with little knowledge of actual platforms (not to mention the history of the political parties).

There are whites who voted for McCain because he was white. Some of them outright stated it and others hid it behind false claims of Obama being a terrorist and whatever other falsehoods. If many of these individuals had an understanding of politics and voted because of conservative or Republican platforms, the race effect would be less evident.

Similarly, there are blacks (and nonblacks) who voted for Obama because he's black. These are blacks (and nonblacks) who knew nothing of him other than he's black. It's not the same thing as what some of us did, which is know about his platform, and vote for him because of it---while acknowledge the historical relevance of a black POTUS.

In previous elections, race and gender mattered in a more abstract sense because they weren't reasons for voting someone. All the candidates were white male.

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

In previous elections, race and gender mattered in a more abstract sense because they weren't reasons for voting someone. All the candidates were white male.

This is a good point and part of what makes this election fascinating.