CNNs Black in America w/ Soledad O'brien: July 19-27

[SummerChild]

IASK,
I didn't see the documentary (had some other very time-consuming stuff going on that didn't allow me to watch) - however, I guess it strikes me that, really, what we are facing today, e.g., teenage pregnancy...well, unfortunately, it's really not a new phenom in our community. How many of us come from single parent families? parents who were teenagers at the time of our births? The newsflash is that single parent families have been everpresent in AA families since the days of the migrations when AA women brought their kids up north and many fathers stayed home. I'm sorry, this is not a new phenom. And the men should be ashamed. In the 60's and 70's there were teenage mothers. I know as many of my friends came from parents who were teenage mothers (and we are in our 30s). Newsflash, we need to get it together b/c all of this stuff (like kids thinking about things that are way too mature for their little minds) is not new to the 21st century. For example, when I was growing up, I had a mother and a father in the home. However, I was aware of their bills and that we couldn't go on every field trip b/c we just didn't have the money...and I'm a 70's baby from a 2-parent blue collar household. If you would have asked me what I would buy with 50 dollars, I probably would have said a doll. But who knows, I might have said that I would give the money to my parents so that they could go grocery shopping. Who knows...b/c goodness knows that we ate hot dogs every kind of way that they could be made. And I'm not joking. My point is that it's not a new phenomenon so I caution us about condemning this generation. The fact of the matter is that, newsflash, many of them *come from* broken homes - meaning that someone of an earlier generation failed them. They didn't come up with this stuff all by themselves. It is so easy to sit back and say, we were so much better than you guys. But the fact of the matter is that, they come from us. These girls and guys having babies as teens - most of them come from households that are a mess. Guess what, those households come from households that were a mess too. I think that the only solution is to own up to it, we have failed some of these kids, and we need to start fixing our own crap.

SC

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

Black In America was...interesting to some degree. I found some of the stories worth watching (the guy who was paying kids to learn and a few others) but overall I would say I am only shocked that there weren't segement titles like "baby mama" and "get yo swirl on: Interracial dating".

One thing that really was not talked about was the fact that many black children do not have childhoods. When the kids who were getting paid for grades were asked what they wanted to do with their money their answers were "help my daddy pay rent" and "save for tuition and maybe a home one day (I loved this answer! You go girl!)" while these are great things for young black people to be concerned about we still have to consider that these kids are like 9. Black kids are usually forced to face drugs, sex, mortality, financial issues, homelessness, joblessness, and stress at the level of adults and no one seems to notice. Depending on your age and how you grew up if you ask yourself what you would have done with 50 or 60 dollars when you were 9 you'd probably say buy toys or something a lot less adult than pay rent.

I did not see mental health is the documentary. Did I miss that part?

What is up with everyone saying "she should have kept her legs closed" ? I fully understand that women are responsible for their part in making babies out of wedlock, but is there ever going to be a day when someone says "keep it in your pants". As a YBW I have realized and partially accepted the fact that I am more responsible for any actions between me and the male kind. Don't like it, but it is what it is I guess.
Young men get condoms; young women get condemned.

I was watching Divorce Court and for 3 episodes in a row the judge told women that they should have considered the fact that a man can walk away at anytime and the high divorce rate before they decided to lay down and have children. While this is true partly, the judge was talking to married women. If you can't expect the man that you marry and make vows to to take of your children (that you two made together) then what should be done. Should everyone remain childless?

Another note on child rearing...I worry so much about what will happen to future generations because there is so little guidance. I look at my cousin who is 16 with a baby and I wonder what is he going to teach her? What morals and ideals will he instill in her? What values will he teach? What can he teach? He hasn't lived long enough to learn how to succeed in this world so how is he going to teach his daughter to do so? He thinks that feeding, clothing, providing a roof over her head and checking her homework is all a parent does. While that is a major part of parenthood there is so much more to it. Since thats all his parents did (and they didnt do that all of his life) that's what he thinks he needs to do. His mom's mom was 15 when she had his mom. His mom was 15 when she had him and now he's 16 with a baby and has no idea how to raise her. He thinks its cool that she looks just like him. My mom (who had me after 30) showed me bookmarks and pamphlets about success and spirituality and books on a wide range of topics and told me that those were the things she tried to instill in me. She said she may have come up short on some of them, but she did the best she could. My cousin is almost half the age my mom was and he doesn't even like to read. God forbid he read something about parenting or anything not required for school. His mind is on playing baskteball for the highschool next year not saving for his daughter's tuition. At one point when someone became a teen parent they let their dreams go in hopes that they would be able to make their child's dreams possible and one day (after the child is grown) go back to making their own dreams happen. While it is not entirely necessary to give up your dreams so your child can succeed most teen parents these days don't even consider that an option.

[I.A.S.K.]

Originally Posted by SummerChild

IASK,
however, I guess it strikes me that, really, what we are facing today, e.g., teenage pregnancy...well, unfortunately, it's really not a new phenom in our community.
They didn't come up with this stuff all by themselves. It is so easy to sit back and say, we were so much better than you guys. But the fact of the matter is that, they come from us. These girls and guys having babies as teens - most of them come from households that are a mess. Guess what, those households come from households that were a mess too. I think that the only solution is to own up to it, we have failed some of these kids, and we need to start fixing our own crap.

SC

I completely agree with everything you said and I cant stand it when people condem my generation (I'm a very late 80's baby).

Bill Cosby had me peeved because he made it seem as if young black people were nothing but ignorant backward pieces of "dirty laundry" that black america does not want to deal with. Although, I understand what he meant with his comments I still can't get with him because of the way he describes my entire generation negatively. To hell with what the few people who do stand up for us try to say the majority opinion about young black people is negative.

My peers and I live with laws that say three or more of us together is a gang! What is this crap? If I went out with my two cousins (god forbid it if we wore similar colors) we'd be harassed and treated like criminals. I have been out with a friend and we were almost arrested for STWB (standing together while black). We are snubbed by ALL other (Africans, Asians, Whites, Latinos) people as well as older black people. Where do young people turn if those we should look to for guidance look back at us with contempt?

I see and have seen how young people get messed up by their parents and then don't know how to fix themselves. I am blessed to have a parent who could expose me to so much, but most of my generation is not as blessed as I have been. And even being as blessed as I am I still deal with more drama and problems than a little bit. (My mom and I just got into an argument because I didnt want to put one of her bills in my name. I know my mom and love her to death, but she never pays any bill on time. This a major utility bill. This means that when she doesn't pay it hurts my credit score and I'm a broke college student with no credit at all. So that means I go from no credit to bad credit, but if the bill is not in my name she doesn't get that essential service) When I do well in school, activism, speaking or whatever I am praised, but I am considered abnormal. Many older black people see me as someone who is beating the odds; not as someone who is realizing her God given potential with the help of strong men and women to guide me. I been to many events where I am the only young person (these are black events) and I get ignored. I remember one reception where I was going around "networking" and 90% of the people I met and told about my work blew me off. At the dinner I made an awesome speech and then all of them wanted to shake my hand and get my card.
God knows and I know that I am NOT that special! Everything that I do each child born is able to do. The difference is in the support system that they (dont) have and the opportunities available to them.
I lived in the hood. So I would come back from trips to UN world conferences to a neighborhood filled with trash. The closest stores sold porno mags, lil debbie cakes, candy, chips, and cheap juice/soda (also known as quarter waters or nutbusters). I used to say that we go from broken homes to broken schools and back day in and day out. If no matter where you go no one believes in and supports you what do you do?
I am motivated by negativity. If you don't believe in me that makes me work so hard that your only choices are to believe in me or turn your back on the truth because that is what I am; The Truth. But every person has their limit. At some point you stop trying to prove people wrong. At some point you just don't care anymore. Young Black People usually get to that point very quickly because they are being pushed and pulled to that point by so many forces.

As much as I know about how we are failing each other as a community and what ways we know of that can fix this......
I honestly don't see the necessary changes happening in the near future (and by near future I mean the next century).
I have faith; I have hope; I have a desire to work, but even with all of this i feel helpless at times!

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

Where do young people turn if those we should look to for guidance look back at us with contempt?

Where young people usually turn to... Each other--like minded individuals--that may be unsavory.

Mentoring and mentorship have fallen by the wayside.

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

When I do well in school, activism, speaking or whatever I am praised, but I am considered abnormal. Many older black people see me as someone who is beating the odds; not as someone who is realizing her God given potential with the help of strong men and women to guide me. I been to many events where I am the only young person (these are black events) and I get ignored. I remember one reception where I was going around "networking" and 90% of the people I met and told about my work blew me off. At the dinner I made an awesome speech and then all of them wanted to shake my hand and get my card.
God knows and I know that I am NOT that special! Everything that I do each child born is able to do. The difference is in the support system that they (dont) have and the opportunities available to them.

I wonder what city do you reside? Or what region? Because it is a "crabs in a barrel mentality that is killing us. My city thinks similarly and takes each other down without hesitation. What I have determined that part of this is because most kneegrows work for a corporate structure that has a culture of vulture. And they get so ingrained into it because of the money, when none of it is ours or matters in the end-game. I find it sad and another shackle we have to release ourselves. But it is doubtful.

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

If no matter where you go no one believes in and supports you what do you do?
I am motivated by negativity. If you don't believe in me that makes me work so hard that your only choices are to believe in me or turn your back on the truth because that is what I am; The Truth. But every person has their limit. At some point you stop trying to prove people wrong. At some point you just don't care anymore. Young Black People usually get to that point very quickly because they are being pushed and pulled to that point by so many forces.

As much as I know about how we are failing each other as a community and what ways we know of that can fix this......
I honestly don't see the necessary changes happening in the near future (and by near future I mean the next century).
I have faith; I have hope; I have a desire to work, but even with all of this i feel helpless at times!

Some of us older folks feel similarly The more things change, the more they stay the same.

That is why many of us say: keep yourself "educated" and always under study... The reason why we say this because you must NEVER stop learning because the Truth sets you free. Long time ago, all we had was faith and our ability to read the Bible. Now, things have changed and it is a brave new world out there. The internet keeps us connected and it has changed the way humans interact forever. Soon our governments are going to change into a new one with new and different challenges. Either we grow into a differrent kind of understanding or we rot, wither and die as we are young.

That haplessness you and many other feel is normal when times are tough. And for some reason we have to be keep striving. Because:

Mother To Son

Well, son, I’ll tell you:
Life for me ain’t been no crystal stair.
It’s had tacks in it,
And splinters,
And boards torn up,
And places with no carpet on the floor –
Bare.
But all the time
I’se been a-climbin’ on,
And reachin’ landin’s,
And turnin’ corners,
And sometimes goin’ in the dark
Where there ain’t been no light.
So boy, don’t you turn back.
Don’t you set down on the steps
‘Cause you finds it’s kinder hard.
Don’t you fall now –
For I’se still goin’, honey,
I’se still climbin’,
And life for me ain’t been no crystal stair.

- Langston Hughes, 1922

[I.A.S.K.]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Where young people usually turn to... Each other--like minded individuals--that may be unsavory.

I think it is. The blind can't lead the blind to safety. Or anywhere positive for that matter.

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Mentoring and mentorship have fallen by the wayside.

In a million and one ways! Mentor's are a scarcity. At my school only the kids with behavorial problems (as in they showed out and did what they wanted when they wanted, but were not really bad kids) got mentors. Accelerated (black) kids didn't get anything. You either had to have the highest grades in the school or be the badest kid in the school to get attention. I mean in 6th grade my reading tests showed that I was reading on a second semester high school senior's reading level, but I wasn't in an advanced literature class until my mom and I decided I was either going to get into one or change schools. I constantly got the best grades, but was never tested for advanced placement in school. Since we moved a lot and my grades were really good my mom didnt press the subject. When I was in elem. school in a predominately white area I was in advanced writing classes. Coincidence? Hell NO! I think the lack of attention to accelerated black students was because of CIB mentality and low expectations of people in and around the public school system.

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

I wonder what city do you reside? Or what region? Because it is a "crabs in a barrel mentality that is killing us.

OMG! CIB mentality should be illegal! I've lived in different areas, but for most of the bad educational experiences I was in Georgia.

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Some of us older folks feel similarly The more things change, the more they stay the same.

That is why many of us say: keep yourself "educated" and always under study... The reason why we say this because you must NEVER stop learning because the Truth sets you free.

I feel you. I vowed to never stop learning when I heard two things:
1. If you want to hide something from [expletive deleted] put it in a book because [expletive deleted] don't read.
and
2. The world can take whatever it wants from you. It can take life and limb, but what's up here (pointing to brain) No one and nothing can take that. Its yours forever.


This one was supposed to be short...my bad.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

In a million and one ways! Mentor's are a scarcity. At my school only the kids with behavorial problems (as in they showed out and did what they wanted when they wanted, but were not really bad kids) got mentors. Accelerated (black) kids didn't get anything. You either had to have the highest grades in the school or be the badest kid in the school to get attention. I mean in 6th grade my reading tests showed that I was reading on a second semester high school senior's reading level, but I wasn't in an advanced literature class until my mom and I decided I was either going to get into one or change schools. I constantly got the best grades, but was never tested for advanced placement in school. Since we moved a lot and my grades were really good my mom didnt press the subject. When I was in elem. school in a predominately white area I was in advanced writing classes. Coincidence? Hell NO! I think the lack of attention to accelerated black students was because of CIB mentality and low expectations of people in and around the public school system.

All kids need mentors, often the your mentor is not your ethnic group. Personally, if they are earnestly interested in your success, it should not matter. But that's why you "diversify" your "repertoire"--because you NEVER know who you learn from. Sometimes, you can get an education on the streets... LOL.

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

I feel you. I vowed to never stop learning when I heard two things:
1. If you want to hide something from N***** put it in a book because N******s don't read.
and
2. The world can take whatever it wants from you. It can take life and limb, but what's up here (pointing to brain) No one and nothing can take that. Its yours forever.


This one was supposed to be short...my bad.

First you put "red" up in the AKA Ave... LOL... Then you say the N-word on GC. I really am not liking that kind of profanity on the AKA Ave. So slow your roll or I start deleting posts.

This thread is about the CNN special and how the show was pretty much an "and" moment... There were some parts that were clarified, some parts folks will be forever talking about, and some parts that we all want to forget.

Can you help me tie in your experiences with the CNN special? How do they connect? Do you wish to clarify?

[I.A.S.K.]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

All kids need mentors, often the your mentor is not your ethnic group. Personally, if they are earnestly interested in your success, it should not matter. But that's why you "diversify" your "repertoire"--because you NEVER know who you learn from. Sometimes, you can get an education on the streets... LOL.



First you put "red" up in the AKA Ave... LOL... Then you say the N-word on GC. I really am not liking that kind of profanity on the AKA Ave. So slow your roll or I start deleting posts.

This thread is about the CNN special and how the show was pretty much an "and" moment... There were some parts that were clarified, some parts folks will be forever talking about, and some parts that we all want to forget.

Can you help me tie in your experiences with the CNN special? How do they connect? Do you wish to clarify?

First I apologize for the Nword. That is my error and thank you for correcting it. Also, the red was for distinction only. I appologize for that as well. My mind's color sensor was not on.

To clarify,

I did not mean to imply that all kids did not need mentors. Nor did I mean that the mentors needed to be black. Any mentor would be great. I think it would be awesome if young kids could get a mentor of another race who can open their minds to different cultures and ways of thinking. The world would be a much better place. I just meant that the black kids who weren't at the absolute top of the class did not get mentors. To be completely accurate all students who did not spend a lot of time in front of admins (for good or bad) were left out. I distinguished between advanced black kids and others because they did not get any extra attention. Almost every white (or other) kid who showed a little potential was tested for advanced classes, but most of the black kids were not. As it relates to CNN's duh moment that they called Black In America... In black women and the family part of it focused on the education of young black people. In this mediocre coverage of the black woman and the family the idea of mentorship was not explored directly and neither were many other things. The lapses of CNN sparked this discussion which is how my experiences came into play. They relate to CNN because they are the problems of the black woman and the family as well as the black man that were not covered, but could and should have been.



SummerChild,
I would have to agree with you about Georgia's public education system being one of the worst. It is very bad. I went to schools in other states and it was entirely different. CIB mentality was a part of it because of the way the shcool system was run then and still is now. CIB mentality is definitely at play when it comes to decision makers in the school system and the election of them. Also, the expectation was that students would not do well. I mean if your goal is to have less than half of your students pass the graduation exam (which was maybe a an increase of 2 or 3 percent from the last year [a total of 9 more students out of 300] ) then there is a serious expectation problem.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

To clarify,

I did not mean to imply that all kids did not need mentors. Nor did I mean that the mentors needed to be black. Any mentor would be great. I think it would be awesome if young kids could get a mentor of another race who can open their minds to different cultures and ways of thinking. The world would be a much better place. I just meant that the black kids who weren't at the absolute top of the class did not get mentors. To be completely accurate all students who did not spend a lot of time in front of admins (for good or bad) were left out. I distinguished between advanced black kids and others because they did not get any extra attention. Almost every white (or other) kid who showed a little potential was tested for advanced classes, but most of the black kids were not. As it relates to CNN's duh moment that they called Black In America... In black women and the family part of it focused on the education of young black people. In this mediocre coverage of the black woman and the family the idea of mentorship was not explored directly and neither were many other things. The lapses of CNN sparked this discussion which is how my experiences came into play. They relate to CNN because they are the problems of the black woman and the family as well as the black man that were not covered, but could and should have been.

But the that's the thing in a "Gaussian Distribution" or a "Bell shaped curve". The dunces who act out will get the beat down mentors to save face--think of them like "pre probation officers"... LOL. And the super geniuses who "they" think can make them lots of money will get "coaches" and "counselors"--think of them like Guantanamo Bay interrogators.

To truly mentor Black children takes several types of people. One to be a coach, one to "motivate to accelerate", and one be that mental health worker, etc. But NO ONE DOES that for free and with the breakdown of the Black family, it will not happen anytime soon.

CNN does not comprehend the Black family dynamics. And the goal of the documentary was to give folks a tasting of it is like in the day and life of kneegrows in America. That taste was bitter and foul. The stats were enough. America has problems that need to be fixed. "A country's success is how the least of their countrymen are treated..." (Forgot who said that)

Your other issue of who gets tested and who does not for advance placement classes, that is called the issue of tracking. And tracking usually is ensured by parents who are on it with their kids. If parents are not queued up, then no matter how smart "Johnny" tests, he is not going to get a fair shake. Period. Now parents should not be "helicoptering", but many are and that is how "affirmative action" is done these days...

So, know that your past formed you to who you are today and you have learned to question (which is a good thing, in some cases). But, you also have to search for your own answered by asking direct questions that can be tested by a process, rather than using "circular logic".

[SummerChild]

IASK,
Yes, there is a problem in GA. I get on my bfriend's case all the time about whether teachers and administrators are doing their jobs...and why the kids are out of school so much. They are out roughly 2 weeks for winter break, 1 week for spring break, then there are at least 5-10 teacher in-service days per year when the kids are not in school, then the usual holidays during the school year. I think that they are out roughly 6 weeks - out of a 9 month year!!! Really, let's be honest, I don't think that the kids are even in school enough to learn what they are supposed to learn. Why are they out of school so much?

He explained that teachers need training days and those are the in-service days. I'm sorry, teachers can train after work or on the weekend, can't they? They are salaried so how come they can't put in a little extra time *after* the school day is over so that the kids won't have to miss another day of education. In any other occupation one is required to work a weekend here or there or an evening, why not with teachers? Why do the kids have to miss a day of education for teacher training. He and I disagree on this matter.

In the same vein, teachers are so poorly paid that it is a wonder that *any teachers* care about their jobs. It is ridiculous what they are paid. Then again, it may not be that bad if you divide the salary by 9 and then extrapolate it out to what teachers would be paid if they worked the 3 extra months. I don't know.

I definitely think that low expectations is a problem and children produce what they are expected to produce. My bfriend has very high expectations and accepts no excuses - from parents or the kids. He regularly goes to their houses to talk with the parents if the parents don't come out and talk with him at the parent conferences and the kids are not doing well or just not doing their homework...but his expectations are high for the kids. I hate to hear about kids placed in special ed unnecessarily or put on all kinds of medication for add, adhd, ahhdd, and everything else that kids are medicated for these days. Some of them just seem to need a good old fashioned butt whipping to clear up their attention and acting out issues.

Re acting out in class, he has explained to me that AA boys behave much differently from other boys, and even from AA girls. These differences in behavior are often seen as "bad" behavior. He said that they are just different ... and somewhat misunderstood. He teaches a number of AA boys and has his entire career. He said that he uses different techniques with them as compared to AA girls, for example. But he recognizes the differences...in part, because he was one of them. I wish there were more AA men in the classroom to work with AA boys. I think it would make a world of difference for some of the boys.

SC

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

First I apologize for the Nword. That is my error and thank you for correcting it. Also, the red was for distinction only. I appologize for that as well. My mind's color sensor was not on.

To clarify,

I did not mean to imply that all kids did not need mentors. Nor did I mean that the mentors needed to be black. Any mentor would be great. I think it would be awesome if young kids could get a mentor of another race who can open their minds to different cultures and ways of thinking. The world would be a much better place. I just meant that the black kids who weren't at the absolute top of the class did not get mentors. To be completely accurate all students who did not spend a lot of time in front of admins (for good or bad) were left out. I distinguished between advanced black kids and others because they did not get any extra attention. Almost every white (or other) kid who showed a little potential was tested for advanced classes, but most of the black kids were not. As it relates to CNN's duh moment that they called Black In America... In black women and the family part of it focused on the education of young black people. In this mediocre coverage of the black woman and the family the idea of mentorship was not explored directly and neither were many other things. The lapses of CNN sparked this discussion which is how my experiences came into play. They relate to CNN because they are the problems of the black woman and the family as well as the black man that were not covered, but could and should have been.



SummerChild,
I would have to agree with you about Georgia's public education system being one of the worst. It is very bad. I went to schools in other states and it was entirely different. CIB mentality was a part of it because of the way the shcool system was run then and still is now. CIB mentality is definitely at play when it comes to decision makers in the school system and the election of them. Also, the expectation was that students would not do well. I mean if your goal is to have less than half of your students pass the graduation exam (which was maybe a an increase of 2 or 3 percent from the last year [a total of 9 more students out of 300] ) then there is a serious expectation problem.

[SummerChild]

Um, unfortunately, I am not sure if the bad educational experience in Georgia is a result of CIB. It might be just b/c Georgia has one of the worst educational systems in the country. Um, that might be it. I know of others who moved to Georgia who also performed very well in Georgia whom were simply average or good students in other states. This is from someone whose beau is an elementary school teacher in Georgia. His school performs well but in general, ... well, I think that much of the south leaves something to be desired in terms of public education. Ok, now everyone from the south can jump on me. But that seems to be reality. He thinks that it's b/c much of the south has traditionally focused more on agriculture than traditional education and now things are changing but they are still playing catchup to some extent relative to the north, which was industrialized earlier.

SC

Originally Posted by I.A.S.K.

I think it is. The blind can't lead the blind to safety. Or anywhere positive for that matter.



In a million and one ways! Mentor's are a scarcity. At my school only the kids with behavorial problems (as in they showed out and did what they wanted when they wanted, but were not really bad kids) got mentors. Accelerated (black) kids didn't get anything. You either had to have the highest grades in the school or be the badest kid in the school to get attention. I mean in 6th grade my reading tests showed that I was reading on a second semester high school senior's reading level, but I wasn't in an advanced literature class until my mom and I decided I was either going to get into one or change schools. I constantly got the best grades, but was never tested for advanced placement in school. Since we moved a lot and my grades were really good my mom didnt press the subject. When I was in elem. school in a predominately white area I was in advanced writing classes. Coincidence? Hell NO! I think the lack of attention to accelerated black students was because of CIB mentality and low expectations of people in and around the public school system.




OMG! CIB mentality should be illegal! I've lived in different areas, but for most of the bad educational experiences I was in Georgia.





I feel you. I vowed to never stop learning when I heard two things:
1. If you want to hide something from [expletive deleted] put it in a book because [expletive deleted] don't read.
and
2. The world can take whatever it wants from you. It can take life and limb, but what's up here (pointing to brain) No one and nothing can take that. Its yours forever.


This one was supposed to be short...my bad.