Michelle Obama rumor- October surprise

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by texas*princess

agreed on every count. at this point, i'm voting mccain... at least the guy is specific and not just throwing around the words "hope" and "change".

i live in texas anyway... the republican always wins texas

I had questions about Obama in that regard also until I really looked at his website. He has every issue with detailed plans right out there for anybody to read. My remaining concern is that everything he wants to do costs a lot of money and I'm not sure that his plan for paying for it all will fly with Congress. But, that's our checks and balances system. I'm not sure we can go for the sweeping changes all at once. It may take baby steps to move toward the change.

[shinerbock]

Originally Posted by AGDee

I had questions about Obama in that regard also until I really looked at his website. He has every issue with detailed plans right out there for anybody to read. My remaining concern is that everything he wants to do costs a lot of money and I'm not sure that his plan for paying for it all will fly with Congress. But, that's our checks and balances system. I'm not sure we can go for the sweeping changes all at once. It may take baby steps to move toward the change.

You might not need to take baby steps if you've got large majorities in both houses.

But I hope the steps are small, like you say. That way we won't have to do too much to reverse the damage come 2012.

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

I think the Vote or Die tie-in is the best part of this episode.

Only because it gave rise to the greatness of the PETA compound.

PetaGuy: "Clearly you don't love animals the way WE love animals"
Stan: "Umm, yeah"

Originally Posted by AGDee

My remaining concern is that everything he wants to do costs a lot of money and I'm not sure that his plan for paying for it all will fly with Congress. But, that's our checks and balances system. I'm not sure we can go for the sweeping changes all at once. It may take baby steps to move toward the change.

Sure, with gas prices up aroudn $4.00, I would LOVE to have my taxes raised for all kinds of "silver bullet" social programs!

Kitso
KS 361 times I laugh when I watch that episode and the hybrid human-ostrich thing squeals, "Kill......me, kill......ME!" LOL

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by wreckingcrew

Sure, with gas prices up aroudn $4.00, I would LOVE to have my taxes raised for all kinds of "silver bullet" social programs!

Kitso
KS 361 times I laugh when I watch that episode and the hybrid human-ostrich thing squeals, "Kill......me, kill......ME!" LOL

As a teacher, I don't think you're in the top 1% of the income earners in this country (I know, it's a big let down, but your pay isn't that great, really). He says that he would only increase taxes for those in the top 1% and would actually make the tax breaks larger for those in our tax bracket. And, if we weren't paying for Iraq every day, we'd be saving a lot of $$ too.

But, that is my biggest concern with him too.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by AGDee

As a teacher, I don't think you're in the top 1% of the income earners in this country (I know, it's a big let down, but your pay isn't that great, really). He says that he would only increase taxes for those in the top 1% and would actually make the tax breaks larger for those in our tax bracket. And, if we weren't paying for Iraq every day, we'd be saving a lot of $$ too.

But, that is my biggest concern with him too.

How do you reconcile the top 1% of income with the 75,000 dollar income threshold that Obama has mentioned previously?

Do you really think he's going to be able to get out quick in Iraq? Quick enough that we'd be talking about substantial cost savings? Even if we could do it, I don't think it's be the right thing to do, but I really don't see it happening even if he is elected. What do you think?

ETA: I find Obama pretty likable and I think I'd like to have him as a professor, but I just don't want the government trying to do more for us since what they do already they do relatively poorly.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

How do you reconcile the top 1% of income with the 75,000 dollar income threshold that Obama has mentioned previously?

Do you really think he's going to be able to get out quick in Iraq? Quick enough that we'd be talking about substantial cost savings? Even if we could do it, I don't think it's be the right thing to do, but I really don't see it happening even if he is elected. What do you think?

ETA: I find Obama pretty likable and I think I'd like to have him as a professor, but I just don't want the government trying to do more for us since what they do already they do relatively poorly.

I haven't read all of his documents in a while but I thought it was tax cuts for those under $75K, tax increases for the top 1%. Don't quote me on that though. As I said, I have real concerns about how it's all going to be paid for. Then again, most of what candidates promise don't happen because they find out what they're up against when they actually get into office.

I think we need to have a plan for when we're getting out of Iraq and stick to it. The Iraqi government will lean on us forever rather than take responsibility, if we let them. If they know we're getting out and we actually follow our plan, I think it will be fine. In fact, I think violence in Iraq will decrease because the insurgents are insurging against US more than against their own government.

None of these plans are going to be implemented the day the guy is elected. And, as I said, baby steps toward the ultimate goal are what is realistic. I don't think 4 years is enough time to make a significant difference in our country.

The key issues that I want to see addressed are health care, social security, the economy and the war. Those are my 4 biggies. I would also like to retain as many personal freedoms as possible. Each individual has their own hot button issues though.

[shinerbock]

Originally Posted by AGDee

I haven't read all of his documents in a while but I thought it was tax cuts for those under $75K, tax increases for the top 1%. Don't quote me on that though. As I said, I have real concerns about how it's all going to be paid for. Then again, most of what candidates promise don't happen because they find out what they're up against when they actually get into office.

I think we need to have a plan for when we're getting out of Iraq and stick to it. The Iraqi government will lean on us forever rather than take responsibility, if we let them. If they know we're getting out and we actually follow our plan, I think it will be fine. In fact, I think violence in Iraq will decrease because the insurgents are insurging against US more than against their own government.

None of these plans are going to be implemented the day the guy is elected. And, as I said, baby steps toward the ultimate goal are what is realistic. I don't think 4 years is enough time to make a significant difference in our country.

The key issues that I want to see addressed are health care, social security, the economy and the war. Those are my 4 biggies. I would also like to retain as many personal freedoms as possible. Each individual has their own hot button issues though.

I think a lot of people would disagree with that.

But I think you're right about what Barack has said on taxation. Cuts for people under 75k, no new cuts for people over 75k, and increases for the top 1%.

Regarding personal freedoms, are you pointing toward patriot act stuff, or a host of things? A lot of liberals assert similar concerns, but aren't bothered by personal freedom infringement when it comes to the 1st amendment (campaign finance), 2nd amendment (increased gun control), mandatory health care, decreased financial autonomy (taxation), etc.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by AGDee

I haven't read all of his documents in a while but I thought it was tax cuts for those under $75K, tax increases for the top 1%. Don't quote me on that though. As I said, I have real concerns about how it's all going to be paid for. Then again, most of what candidates promise don't happen because they find out what they're up against when they actually get into office.

Taxes

Obama will cut income taxes by $1,000 for working families to offset the payroll tax they pay.

Provide Middle Class Americans Tax Relief

Provide a Tax Cut for Working Families: Obama will restore fairness to the tax code and provide 150 million workers the tax relief they need. Obama will create a new “Making Work Pay” tax credit of up to $500 per person, or $1,000 per working family. The “Making Work Pay” tax credit will completely eliminate income taxes for 10 million Americans.

Simplify Tax Filings for Middle Class Americans: Obama will dramatically simplify tax filings so that millions of Americans will be able to do their taxes in less than five minutes. Obama will ensure that the IRS uses the information it already gets from banks and employers to give taxpayers the option of pre-filled tax forms to verify, sign and return. Experts estimate that the Obama proposal will save Americans up to 200 million total hours of work and aggravation and up to $2 billion in tax preparer fees.

Restore Fiscal Discipline to Washington

Reinstate PAYGO Rules: Obama believes that a critical step in restoring fiscal discipline is enforcing payas-you-go (PAYGO) budgeting rules which require new spending commitments or tax changes to be paid for by cuts to other programs or new revenue.

Reverse Bush Tax Cuts for the Wealthy: Obama will protect tax cuts for poor and middle class families, but he will reverse most of the Bush tax cuts for the wealthiest taxpayers.

Cut Pork Barrel Spending: Obama introduced and passed bipartisan legislation that would require more disclosure and transparency for special-interest earmarks. Obama believes that spending that cannot withstand public scrutiny cannot be justified. Obama will slash earmarks to no greater than what they were in 2001 and ensure all spending decisions are open to the public.

Make Government Spending More Accountable and Efficient: Obama will ensure that federal contracts over $25,000 are competitively bid. Obama will also increase the efficiency of government programs through better use of technology, stronger management that demands accountability and by leveraging the government’s high-volume purchasing power to get lower prices.

End Wasteful Government Spending: Obama will stop funding wasteful, obsolete federal government programs that make no financial sense. Obama has called for an end to subsidies for oil and gas companies that are enjoying record profits, as well as the elimination of subsidies to the private student loan industry which has repeatedly used unethical business practices. Obama will also tackle wasteful spending in the Medicare program.

Make the Tax System More Fair and Efficient

End Tax Haven Abuse: Building on his bipartisan work in the Senate, Obama will give the Treasury Department the tools it needs to stop the abuse of tax shelters and offshore tax havens and help close the $350
billion tax gap between taxes owed and taxes paid.

Close Special Interest Corporate Loopholes: Obama will level the playing field for all businesses by eliminating special-interest loopholes and deductions, such as those for the oil and gas industry.

Source: http://www.barackobama.com/pdf/Obama...tForChange.pdf

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

You might not need to take baby steps if you've got large majorities in both houses.

But I hope the steps are small, like you say. That way we won't have to do too much to reverse the damage come 2012.

I was watching...well one of those political shows...last night and one of the guys said something that struck me. Our government was set up to cause "gridlock" so that drastic changes wouldn't unsettle the entire population.

[shinerbock]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

I was watching...well one of those political shows...last night and one of the guys said something that struck me. Our government was set up to cause "gridlock" so that drastic changes wouldn't unsettle the entire population.

Not just to avoid unsettling, but to avoid rash or extreme decisions based on crisis, to avoid irreversible shifts in policy, etc.

[UGAalum94]

The website was better than I thought. I don't know if it is more expansive than before or if I just didn't look in the right places. I hadn't looked since the start of the primaries.

I don't think there's a problem for which the answer isn't "spend more money" but that's kind of what I expect from all Democrats honestly and lately a lot of Republicans as well. Of course how the government is going to get the money is never spelled out as well as how to spend it. Honestly though, Obama has been a little better about this than most people with his comments about taxes on anyone making more than 75,000 as household income. Scary but honest.

And of course with education especially, there's a lot of stuff that it's hard for me to accept that it's the federal government's job to do. He also seems unaware that some of the educational programs he favors don't deliver the clear benefits he seems to think they do. And the commentary about No Child Left Behind is laughable. But all politicians are bad about NCLB.

The page is substantial but kind of affirms how much Obama supports that I don't. I don't want to pin my hopes for change on more federal government spending, thanks.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by UGAalum94

The website was better than I thought. I don't know if it is more expansive than before or if I just didn't look in the right places. I hadn't looked since the start of the primaries.

I don't think there's a problem for which the answer isn't "spend more money" but that's kind of what I expect from all Democrats honestly and lately a lot of Republicans as well. Of course how the government is going to get the money is never spelled out as well as how to spend it. Honestly though, Obama has been a little better about this than most people with his comments about taxes on anyone making more than 75,000 as household income. Scary but honest.

And of course with education especially, there's a lot of stuff that it's hard for me to accept that it's the federal government's job to do. He also seems unaware that some of the educational programs he favors don't deliver the clear benefits he seems to think they do. And the commentary about No Child Left Behind is laughable. But all politicians are bad about NCLB.

The page is substantial but kind of affirms how much Obama supports that I don't. I don't want to pin my hopes for change on more federal government spending, thanks.

And, if you don't agree with his policies, then I don't think you should vote for him. I do appreciate that you took the time to read his site. There really is a lot of substance there so he's not just all words. Someone pointed it out to me when I had similar concerns and I was impressed with how much detail he actually has out there. I do think it has become more expansive because all that wasn't there the first time I looked either.

[BabyPiNK_FL]

Had to chime in on that South Park episode:

Diddy: I like it when you vote B****/Shake them ti***es when you vote B****!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hilarious!

And yeah, given the choice between douche and turd sandwhich, I think I'm going for Cynthia McKinney.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

I was watching...well one of those political shows...last night and one of the guys said something that struck me. Our government was set up to cause "gridlock" so that drastic changes wouldn't unsettle the entire population.

"The question is not how to make government work, but how to make it stop."
-P.J. O'Rourke