Facebook - Privacy Violation?

[fantASTic]

Originally Posted by ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl

I don't think that is the whole problem so much...if you are of legal age there's absolutely nothing wrong with drinking. The problem is when people drink too much. Not saying I've never done it, but it's not all that classy and we all know it.

Like I've said, it's in our code of standards that we can't associate our letters with alcohol. I understand this, even for those of legal age, because of the stereotypes surrounding greek life. It's one way of combating those. So our solution is to say that if you've got alcohol on your page, you have to remove your letters. Of course, no one is going to choose the beer bottle over the letters. Problem solved.

I agree with you...in the fact that if the rules say so, we have to do it. What I disagree with is the fact that even if your profile is set to private, you STILL cannot have them up.

And I fail to see the point of the rule if it's okay for alumnae to do it; I know it's only because we can't really police alumnae like we can actives, or hold their membership up for behavior, etc, but it just seems like trying to fix the stereotype won't work if the majority of Greeks can still drink in letters and put alcohol pix on Facebook.

[exlurker]

Originally Posted by SOPi_Jawbreaker

I don't know. I think it could still be seen as kinda offensive, because it still looks like dressing up like Indians without understanding the culture behind it. It could possibly be seen as perpetuating the stereotype that all Indians wear deerskin clothing, live in teepees, wear feather headdresses, etc. when in actuality, there are many different Native American groups with differing cultural dress, differing traditional types of homes, differing religious/spiritual beliefs, different cultural practices, etc. And it could possibly be seen as cultural misappropriation of a historically oppressed people. I'm not saying that that's what fraternity and sorority members are trying to do when they have Indian parties. But if someone wanted to get offended, they still could.

A CBS affiliate has some updated information about the U. of North Dakota situation posted on its site:

http://www.kxmb.com/News/222272.asp

Excerpts from longer article:

A University of North Dakota sorority has been put on probation in the wake of a party in which some people dressed up as American Indians.

The Gamma Phi Beta sorority was put on probation by both the sorority's central office . . .and by the UND dean of student's office.

That office will investigate a discrimination complaint filed against the sorority by American Indian students. . . .


Edited to add this link / address for the offical national Gamma Phi Beta press release regarding the UND situation:

http://www.gammaphibeta.org/news/det...CATEGORY_ID=11

[brunetteddd]

As far as my sorority is concerned, we are not allowed to drink in our letters, ergo if you have pictures on Facebook of yourself drinking in your letters, you will called into standards. You can also get called in for conduct, but usually it's not because they saw a Facebook picture (unless someone reports an incident and uses the pictures to further prove their point).

However, I've heard of people (mainly those on sports teams) getting in trouble for having pictures of themselves drinking on Facebook. But a good way to prevent that is to un-tag yourself, set lots of privacy limits, etc.

I personally think it's a bit much that someone who is of age to not be allowed to have a picture of themselves with a beer, glass of wine, etc. on their pictures and be part of a sorority/fraternity. Again, you can play the conduct card in those situations, say that there's a picture in which they are clearly in a drunken stupor/acting in bad taste. I feel like in a situation such as that, it's not uncalled for if the person in question is asked to take down the picture/un-tag their self.

[RaggedyAnn]

As far as alumnae are concerned, I can tell you that if alcohol is on our alumnae chapter websites and "Nationals" know about it, someone will address it.

Facebook is harder to police. Alumnae should not change their behavior once they graduate, unless they are raising the bar. You still represent your organization.

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Unless it's a sister she's feudiung with who wants her to get kicked out.

Unless it's someone that has a grudge against the sorority.

And then the HQ kind of is backed into a corner because they made this stupid, ridiculous, all-encompassing rule. Unless they want to appear to be playing favorites, they DO have to discipline someone for something as lame as a pic of them at a winery with their parents.

Then again, in a few years we'll probably be compelled to share our entire medical history with companies we're interviewing at (think Gattaca) so I guess this is kind of small potatoes.

Then too bad for her.

Of course there are procedures for everything. It's unlikely that she would get kicked out for the pictures. Disciplined, yes.

I just fail to see how this is a big deal.

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

Originally Posted by fantASTic

I agree with you...in the fact that if the rules say so, we have to do it. What I disagree with is the fact that even if your profile is set to private, you STILL cannot have them up.

And I fail to see the point of the rule if it's okay for alumnae to do it; I know it's only because we can't really police alumnae like we can actives, or hold their membership up for behavior, etc, but it just seems like trying to fix the stereotype won't work if the majority of Greeks can still drink in letters and put alcohol pix on Facebook.

Private profiles don't do any good. Most of the time, the picture wasn't posted by the person with the drink in hand, but by someone else and was tagged. Unless they can get their friend to remove the photo, it's up their for all of THEIR friends to see. Private profiles are also only as good as the friends you add. Pictures can just be reposted somewhere else. And last but not least, you're supposed to be in Recruitment mode year round. Unless your ONLY friends are in your sorority, it's likely a PNM will see the pictures. Why is it such a big deal? PUT THE BEER DOWN. Wah.

I have no idea what the rules are for alums in my organization. I'm not one and I have a year left. But it doesn't miss the point at all. The REASON that organizations have these all encompassing rules is that COLLEGIANS tend to binge drink and drink under age. It's a problem for all college students...I don't buy that it's a Greek issue, but the rules are a necessary response to show the world that our organizations don't support these behaviors. As a college graduate and an adult, people are much less likely to comment on your behavior in that manner.

[Taualumna]

Originally Posted by ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl

Private profiles don't do any good. Most of the time, the picture wasn't posted by the person with the drink in hand, but by someone else and was tagged. Unless they can get their friend to remove the photo, it's up their for all of THEIR friends to see. Private profiles are also only as good as the friends you add. Pictures can just be reposted somewhere else. And last but not least, you're supposed to be in Recruitment mode year round. Unless your ONLY friends are in your sorority, it's likely a PNM will see the pictures. Why is it such a big deal? PUT THE BEER DOWN. Wah.

I have no idea what the rules are for alums in my organization. I'm not one and I have a year left. But it doesn't miss the point at all. The REASON that organizations have these all encompassing rules is that COLLEGIANS tend to binge drink and drink under age. It's a problem for all college students...I don't buy that it's a Greek issue, but the rules are a necessary response to show the world that our organizations don't support these behaviors. As a college graduate and an adult, people are much less likely to comment on your behavior in that manner.

The beer may be down, but there still might be alcohol in the picture. In fact, it might not even be in your place setting.

Maybe I was brought up with a different outlook on alcohol. Alcohol was and still is considered a "grown up" drink in my family, but it was never condemned or considered a bad thing. I watched my parents drink wine at dinner and I was given a wine glass with grape juice or apple juice so I could be "just like the grown ups." When I turned 19 (the legal drinking age here), the juice was replaced with the real thing. My official 19th birthday was wine and dinner with my family. I don't understand why other people weren't brought up the same way. Maybe if people thought about things this way, we'd have fewer problems.

[nittanyalum]

Originally Posted by Taualumna

I don't understand why other people weren't brought up the same way.

This seems to be the root of all of the issues you vent about here. It's a big wide world full of people from all sorts of different places and experiences. If you embraced that a little more maybe you wouldn't sweat so much of the small stuff.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Taualumna

The beer may be down, but there still might be alcohol in the picture. In fact, it might not even be in your place setting.

Maybe I was brought up with a different outlook on alcohol. Alcohol was and still is considered a "grown up" drink in my family, but it was never condemned or considered a bad thing. I watched my parents drink wine at dinner and I was given a wine glass with grape juice or apple juice so I could be "just like the grown ups." When I turned 19 (the legal drinking age here), the juice was replaced with the real thing. My official 19th birthday was wine and dinner with my family. I don't understand why other people weren't brought up the same way. Maybe if people thought about things this way, we'd have fewer problems.

You keep forgetting you're from Canada. The attitude toward alcohol there is much different (IMO much healthier) than the US (most likely the French influence, whether you live in Quebec or not). At least that's the impression I've always gotten.

Stupid Puritans.

[violetpretty]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

I just can't see it being that big of a deal. Touring vineyards shouldn't be a problem - just don't post pictures of you downing the fruit of the vines. Vines - yes. Glasses of wine - no.

My chapter doesn't have a problem with pictures of members who are at a bar, but if there's a drink in someone's hand, different story. Same with a vineyard. IMO, a vineyard would be less of a problem, considering typical bar behavior vs vineyard behavior.

[SWTXBelle]

lol at the idea of "vineyard behavior"!

[honeychile]

I've been laughing to myself about this thread since it started. Our chapter advisors don't even have a glass of wine with dinner prior to attending a chapter meeting!

Crazy as it may sound, there's a reason for probably every rule that anyone may find stupid.

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

Originally Posted by Taualumna

The beer may be down, but there still might be alcohol in the picture. In fact, it might not even be in your place setting.

Maybe I was brought up with a different outlook on alcohol. Alcohol was and still is considered a "grown up" drink in my family, but it was never condemned or considered a bad thing. I watched my parents drink wine at dinner and I was given a wine glass with grape juice or apple juice so I could be "just like the grown ups." When I turned 19 (the legal drinking age here), the juice was replaced with the real thing. My official 19th birthday was wine and dinner with my family. I don't understand why other people weren't brought up the same way. Maybe if people thought about things this way, we'd have fewer problems.

That's nice and all, but the rest of the world DOESN'T revolve around your family. I used to think it would solve all of the world's problems as well until I started hanging out with European students. I don't know anyone else who can get so completely plastered and start again at 8 in the morning. Binge drinking isn't a US problem. Nor is drinking underage. But both are huge problems for greek organizations.

There is a REASON the code of standards states that alcohol cannot be associated with our letters. Too many bad eggs ruined it for the rest of us. Greeks have a hard time dealing with the constant onslaught of negative publicity for binge drinking and underage drinking as it is. It does not help to be drinking in your letters.

Blanket rules in schools, clubs, greek organizations, etc. are there for a reason. No one can wiggle their way out, that way. Better safe than sorry.

There are bigger things in the world to get upset about. If it is THAT important for alcohol to be prominent in your life that you can't just keep some pictures on your bulletin board or coffee table, then you are not in a healthy place mentally. I don't care where you're from or who you are, it is a VERY small thing to ask that you not put alcoholic photographs on facebook. If you can't handle it, maybe you don't need to be a part of ANY organization or team. Part of teamwork is making small compromises and sacrifices so that the individuals can work as a group.

[Taualumna]

Originally Posted by ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl

That's nice and all, but the rest of the world DOESN'T revolve around your family. I used to think it would solve all of the world's problems as well until I started hanging out with European students. I don't know anyone else who can get so completely plastered and start again at 8 in the morning. Binge drinking isn't a US problem. Nor is drinking underage. But both are huge problems for greek organizations.

There is a REASON the code of standards states that alcohol cannot be associated with our letters. Too many bad eggs ruined it for the rest of us. Greeks have a hard time dealing with the constant onslaught of negative publicity for binge drinking and underage drinking as it is. It does not help to be drinking in your letters.

Blanket rules in schools, clubs, greek organizations, etc. are there for a reason. No one can wiggle their way out, that way. Better safe than sorry.

There are bigger things in the world to get upset about. If it is THAT important for alcohol to be prominent in your life that you can't just keep some pictures on your bulletin board or coffee table, then you are not in a healthy place mentally. I don't care where you're from or who you are, it is a VERY small thing to ask that you not put alcoholic photographs on facebook. If you can't handle it, maybe you don't need to be a part of ANY organization or team. Part of teamwork is making small compromises and sacrifices so that the individuals can work as a group.

You know, I think you have some issues yourself. In any case, sometimes, the photos aren't even from the person's profile. The person could have been tagged and from someone who didn't realize that it was wrong to have alcohol associated with letters. Honestly, I think some people DO have issues with alcohol and yes, I agree with 33girl that it's probably because of religion/culture. Of course, it's very difficult to change things because culture is so ingrained in us :-(

You know what I'd do if *I* made the rules? As long as the person isn't WEARING LETTERS/Letters aren't in the photo, then it should be okay. But I don't make the rules. I just don't think some of the regs are all that considerate of some cultures at times. It's only a personal opinion...that's all.

In any case, I guess I really shouldn't be saying anything, since I'm alum and it doesn't exactly affect me.

[33girl]

The US/Canadian thing as far as Greek regs in general has been going on for a long time and I know we've discussed it on here. I know our policy just used to say follow the laws where you are re alcohol. Now since the states all got blackmailed into passing the 21 law, it's undergrads can't have alcohol, period. That would be fine except that the US isn't the only country that has fraternity & sorority chapters. I'm sure it hasn't helped any of the Greek orgs get more of a foothold in Canada.