NPHC BGLO's how do you feel about non NPHC BGLO's

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

Most don't.

That's why APO isn't a BGLO period and shouldn't even be mentioned in a "nonNPHC BGLO" thread.

I agree! Alpha Phi Omega is supposed to be inclusive of EVERYONE. But I suppose that if you are only familiar with one chapter, then you assume that all the other chapters are the same, too.

On a sidenote...the idea that one chapter (or alumni association, like the Brothers of the Rising Sun) wouldn't include/accept a transferred brother (or alumni) because of his or her gender or ethnicity sickens me. We are ALL brothers.

[KAPital PHINUst]

Originally Posted by ErinKathleenNJ

On a sidenote...the idea that one chapter (or alumni association, like the Brothers of the Rising Sun) wouldn't include/accept a transferred brother (or alumni) because of his or her gender or ethnicity sickens me. We are ALL brothers.

Hey, it was that way for 30 years, and fully permissible by the National Board. IMO, and the opinion of other brothers from all male chapters, there is a certain brotherhood dynamic unique to all-male chapters that by making the chapter co-ed would undermine and/or destroy. Whether one finds that right or wrong is debateable, but at the end of the day, it is what it is.

Delta Chapter is notorious for the upkeep of the all-male tradition and one chapter I respect and support wholeheartedly. I for one will be sad to see the original Delta Chapter die in this manner.

Originally Posted by KAPital PHINUst

Hey, it was that way for 30 years, and fully permissible by the National Board. IMO, and the opinion of other brothers from all male chapters, there is a certain brotherhood dynamic unique to all-male chapters that by making the chapter co-ed would undermine and/or destroy. Whether one finds that right or wrong is debateable, but at the end of the day, it is what it is.

Delta Chapter is notorious for the upkeep of the all-male tradition and one chapter I respect and support wholeheartedly. I for one will be sad to see the original Delta Chapter die in this manner.

Yes, the history of APO is as a male chapter, but then it became co-ed in the 70s. Nationals has made it clear that the remaining all-male chapters must put forth an honest effort to be open to women. Honestly, I really have no problem with the last remaining all-male chapters staying male. But it's not up to me- it is up to the brotherhood.

However, as I stated in my earlier post, if a brother were to transfer to that school, then she should be accepted by them as a brother. She is no less of a brother than any of them. My criticism is towards the small groups within APO who don't follow APO's inclusive nature or policies. (Obviously I understand that a chapter demographics will reflect the campus dynamic- i.e. in a HBCU, a religious school, or a single-sexed institution). Particularly the above mentioned alumni group. APO is not for just one race or gender. This could be further discussed via PM/ in the APO forum (as it has).

Last nitty gritty...notorious means famous for something bad. Juding from your post, I would think you would find Delta's stance to be admirable.


YiLFS

[KAPital PHINUst]

Originally Posted by ErinKathleenNJ

However, as I stated in my earlier post, if a brother were to transfer to that school, then she should be accepted by them as a brother. She is no less of a brother than any of them.

I don't know about other all-male chapters, but Delta doesn't take transfer members of ANY gender. You wanna be a member of Delta Chapter, you gotta be "made" at Delta Chapter

Last nitty gritty...notorious means famous for something bad. Juding from your post, I would think you would find Delta's stance to be admirable.

YiLFS

Seeing how much of an issue being all-male was to APO at large that they had to completely abolish it (and especially how you find all-male chapters and alumni associations, in your words, "sickening"), evidently it was something bad. So my term notorious was in a sense quite fitting under the circumstances.

Wanna holla at me more on the topic? You know how to reach me.....

YiLFS, etc, etc.

[naraht]

I am an Alpha Phi Omega alumnus and on the National Alpha Phi Omega history committee and was representative to the APO chapter at Howard for a while. I'm probably able to give background on this better than most.

Timeline:
12/16/1925: Alpha Phi Omega founded. Membership limited to only men with Scouting (Cub, Scout or Leader) experience.

4/17/1947: First Alpha Phi Omega chapter founded at an HBCU. Johnson C. Smith University (Delta Phi - chapter #117). Howard University is second on 5/22/1948 (Zeta Phi - chapter #165).

1952: Gamma Sigma Sigma National Service Sorority Founded by eight women's service groups. Alpha Phi Omega brothers helped put the groups in contact with each other, but as far as I know were not at the meeting where the Sorority came into being.

1953: Omega Phi Alpha National Service Sorority came into being. Alpha Phi Omega service fraternity chapter at Bowling Green State encouraged women also interested in service to form their own group.

1950s-1970s: Some Alpha Phi Omega chapters continued to have local related women's service organizations integrated into the chapter in terms of service and social events.

1960s: By this point if not earlier many (if not all) Alpha Phi Omega at HBCUs were reflecting the way that the NPHC fraternities were doing things. They called their pledge classes lines, they called the pledge classes by a "club name" like AKA's Ivy Club or Kappa Alpha Psi's Scroll club. Alpha Phi Omega chapters often used the term "Trefoil Club"

1967: Alpha Phi Omega removes the requirement for prior scouting membership at its Constitutional Convention. Many chapters by this time had more or less allowed anyone to join, with those without prior scouting experience simply being registered with their local Scout Council as a volunteer in order to fulfill the requirement.

Late 1960s - Early 1970s Chapters from liberal schools and/or liberal parts of the country were pledging women "underground" and registering them with the National Office simply under their first initial and last name.

Early 1970s: Proposals to go co-ed first seriously raised.

1972: Title IX. All non-social Greek Letter Organizations required to go co-ed. (Note, this is why legally, the NPHC greeks no matter how much service they do are legally counted as social fraternities)

1974: After *much* debate, women are allowed affiliate membership in the Fraternity.

1976: After even more debate than in 1974, women are admitted as full members of the fraternity. As part of the "Gentleman's Agreement", chapters are not required to admit women, nor required to admit women brothers who transfer (Transfering membership requires the incoming chapter to accept them). This was to deal with those all-male chapters who considered leaving the fraternity if they were required to admit women.

1977-1979, a majority of chapters go co-ed. *No* chapters at an HBCU does so.

Up to at least1981: Efforts continute to attempt to get the law changed to have Alpha Phi Omega be exempt from Title IX.

1986: Chartering chapters and rechartering chapters are now required to attempt to recruit from both genders. This, to use a term from a brother from an all-male chapter "neuters" the all-male chapters. It also means that an all-male chapter that goes inactive must come back coed.

1996: All-male chapters make up about 15% of all chapters in the Fraternity.

2005: Opinion given by legal council that Alpha Phi Omega must not bar women from chapters any more. National Board resolution reflecting that passed.

2006: All-male chapters make up 17 of approximately 350 chapters in the Fraternity. National Convention (by close vote) supports National Board. All all-male chapters must co-ed by 2008 convention or show good faith in that direction or have their charters revoked for failure to follow National Pledging Standards and National By-laws. Committee formed including members of all-male chapters to help with transition.

I'll add specific comments on other postings separately.

[KAPital PHINUst]

Originally Posted by naraht

2006: All-male chapters make up 19 of approximately 250 chapters in the Fraternity. National Convention (by close vote) supports National Board.

*at bolded* Translation: SIX VOTES!!!

[naraht]

Originally Posted by KAPital PHINUst

*at bolded* Translation: SIX VOTES!!!

Yes, I couldn't remember the exact number (and I wasn't at that convention.) Do you feel that describing it as a "close vote" rather than a "very close vote" is inappropriate?

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by KAPital PHINUst

*at bolded* Translation: SIX VOTES!!!

Six votes or 600 votes--it passed.

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by naraht

1972: Title IX. All non-social Greek Letter Organizations required to go co-ed. (Note, this is why legally, the NPHC greeks no matter how much service they do are legally counted as social fraternities)

Clarification 501(c)(7) has always been our IRS designations--membership social clubs.

While all of the NPHC orgs now claim service as their cornerstone, most of them were not founded for the express purpose of service. But because of the nature of the groups--selective memberships, even those that were, were still given (c)(7) designations.

So it really had nothing to do with Title IX. We were already protected and no one was seeking to change their designation anyway.

[naraht]

Originally Posted by ladygreek

Clarification 501(c)(7) has always been our IRS designations--membership social clubs.

While all of the NPHC orgs now claim service as their cornerstone, most of them were not founded for the express purpose of service. But because of the nature of the groups--selective memberships, even those that were, were still given (c)(7) designations.

So it really had nothing to do with Title IX. We were already protected and no one was seeking to change their designation anyway.

Agreed, Title IX and IRS designations have nothing to do with each other, but it is the Title IX regulation that forces groups to either be Social Fraternities/Sororities or not Social Fraternities/Sororities. Only Social Fraternities and Sororities have the exemption in Section (A)(6)(a). Not professional F/S, not Honor F/S and not Service F/S. If Delta Sigma Theta were to legally claim to be a Service Sorority rather than a Social Sorority, they would be placing themselves in the legal situation of having to admit men to the collegiate chapters inside the United States. The text of Title IX is at http://www.usdoj.gov/crt/cor/coord/titleixstat.htm . You may want to work through the text of the "Iron Arrow" case http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/script...l=464&invol=67

As for 501c3 vs 501c7, Alpha Phi Omega is 501c3, but that largely has to do with the fact that when Alpha Phi Omega applied for that status, it was more strongly tied to the Boy Scouts of America. I've seen other service groups that are 501c7.

[ladygreek]

Originally Posted by naraht

Agreed, Title IX and IRS designations have nothing to do with each other, but it is the Title IX regulation that forces groups to either be Social Fraternities/Sororities or not Social Fraternities/Sororities. Only Social Fraternities and Sororities have the exemption in Section (A)(6)(a). Not professional F/S, not Honor F/S and not Service F/S. If Delta Sigma Theta were to legally claim to be a Service Sorority rather than a Social Sorority, they would be placing themselves in the legal situation of having to admit men to the collegiate chapters inside the United States. The text of Title IX is at http://www.usdoj.gov/crt/cor/coord/titleixstat.htm . You may want to work through the text of the "Iron Arrow" case http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/script...l=464&invol=67

As for 501c3 vs 501c7, Alpha Phi Omega is 501c3, but that largely has to do with the fact that when Alpha Phi Omega applied for that status, it was more strongly tied to the Boy Scouts of America. I've seen other service groups that are 501c7.

And my point is Title IX did not force us to declare ourselves as a social sorority. We did that when we were founded. So for us Title IX was moot.
We are first and foremost a sisterhood founded for public service. The sisterhood is what makes us social.

And I don't need to work through the text of anything. As a member for 38 years, I know the inner workings of my sorority--you don't.

[ShamikaT]

When I logged on, I saw this:

"Hello, ShamikaT. it appears that you have not posted on GreekChat in several weeks, why not take a few moments to ask a question, help provide a solution or just engage in a conversation with another member in any one of our forums?"

Daaaaaaamn, GC be ALL up in mine!

Ok, lemme contribute some....

First of all, GC has been around since 2000??? What the hell?

DO YOU ALL KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS!?

That means:

*It was the same year Nelly started rapping.

*Peeps were scared of the YtooK thing

*Greekchatters who are in their 30s were in their 20s! Those who are in their 20s were in their 10s!

*I was a sophomore in high school, I couldn't even drive! And I just finished developing my titties.

*I was a virgin, the first time around!

*GC look like it was purchased at the dolla store. It was straight hood! You couldn't send/recieve PMs. You couldn't view who was online. There were little folders beside each thread, and if it recieved 15+ posts, that bitch caught on fire! It was the local access channel of the internets.

Yall still listening???

*Michael Jackson was still black!

*Laffy Taffy was known as a chewy candy

*Kazo was known as a site where you download music

*Tom Earp wasn't gray.

*GC went down more than cheerfulgreek goes down on PrettyBoy.

*Off course, I wouldn't know annnything about some of this! I heard the GC things by rumor.