Infringement

Ottor 246 · #1 12-20-2006, 09:03 AM

I agree. This whole thing only becomes a big deal if we don't handle it now.

It's not as if this is going to be the "trial of the century" or anything. My guess is that as soon as those jokers get a letter from a real lawyer, they'll fold up like a cheap lawn chair and steal someone else's symbol.

JoinerLxa · #2 12-20-2006, 09:32 AM

I think its "standard practice" for IHQ (or their legal firm) to send a
"cease and desist" letter to the perpetrators, notifying them that they
are violating U.S. law and could be prosecuted. As long as they don't
become "famous", nothing more would happen. I think that satisfies the
"defend or loose" condition for keeping the copyright.

I once was on faculty at a university in Indiana that did not allow
"fraternities". Instead they had "service/social organizations" that for
all practical purposes were local fraternities/sororities. All "unofficially"
adopted greek-letter names. One called itself "LXA"...they used our
letters, COA, and other emblems. Supposedly they were "initiated"
by LXA at Ball State U. and given permission to use LXA (at least
that's what they told their rushees).

After a little "infiltration", I discovered they knew nothing of LXA.
They didn't even know what PCC, VQV and ChTK stood for!

I also found out IHQ had sent them a "C&D letter" in the early 90's,
but had taken no further action. When I left in 2001, they had
"lost their charter" from the Univ. due to infractions, so I don't know
if they still exist...they were continuing to operate without Univ.
recognition at the time. They were basically the "football players'
frat".

FYI

docroc67 · #3 12-20-2006, 11:14 AM

Greetings,

I noticed last week that a seller of First Day Covers on eBay had to stop using the COAs of various fraternities and sororities that were represented by a company that held the rights to use them on sportswear and so forth. The licensing company threatened to take legal action.

Yours in ZAX,

Mike R., Z-U Zeta

JonoBN41 · #4 12-20-2006, 12:30 PM

Mike, do you mean the sellers of existing FDCs, or the makers of new ones?

docroc67 · #5 12-20-2006, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonoBN41

Mike, do you mean the sellers of existing FDCs, or the makers of new ones?

Brother Jono,

I think the fellow in question does both. I am pretty sure that they normally go after the makers. But, they may be arguing that even the display of them in this situation is not authorized.

I am not a legal expert, but I do know that he has started to cover up the COAs on the FDCs! However, the COAs are still there when they get to the buyer.....

Happy Holidays (Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!),

Yours in ZAX,

Mike R., Z-U Zeta

JonoBN41 · #6 12-20-2006, 06:01 PM

Mike,

All this particular stuff revolves around eBay's so-called VeRO (Verified Rights Owners) program. About 5,000 participants have signed up for it.

What you mentioned about the FDCs sounds similar to what the Delta Sigma Theta sorority has undertaken. Read about their position in their Me page on eBay, paying particular attention to the last part of their statement ("in any other way engage...donate those items to DST's archives").

http://cgi3.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...&userid=dst-gt

I know of at least two collectors who've run afoul of their policies by listing their sorority pins on eBay. The organization made them remove pictures of the badges, while still allowing the sale.

Now I'm no legal expert either, but it doesn't make any sense to me.

It's like eBay saying I can sell a used Chevrolet, but cannot post a picture of the car since I'm not licensed by General Motors.

How can anyone prohibit a person from taking a picture of something they legally own? The possibilities are endless.

Does anybody else understand this stuff, or are these folks abusing the VeRO program out of pure militancy?

PiLambda1 · #7 12-20-2006, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonoBN41

Mike,

All this particular stuff revolves around eBay's so-called VeRO (Verified Rights Owners) program. About 5,000 participants have signed up for it.

What you mentioned about the FDCs sounds similar to what the Delta Sigma Theta sorority has undertaken. Read about their position in their Me page on eBay, paying particular attention to the last part of their statement ("in any other way engage...donate those items to DST's archives").

http://cgi3.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...&userid=dst-gt

I know of at least two collectors who've run afoul of their policies by listing their sorority pins on eBay. The organization made them remove pictures of the badges, while still allowing the sale.

Now I'm no legal expert either, but it doesn't make any sense to me.

It's like eBay saying I can sell a used Chevrolet, but cannot post a picture of the car since I'm not licensed by General Motors.

How can anyone prohibit a person from taking a picture of something they legally own? The possibilities are endless.

Does anybody else understand this stuff, or are these folks abusing the VeRO program out of pure militancy?

Fun Fact I bet no one on the board knows: DST actually USED to be an ALL-MALE Pharmaceutical Fraternity that was started in the early to mid 1800s. Their Nationals folded many many moons ago. Up until about 10 years ago there were two chapters left, Rutgers and....St. Louis College of Pharmacy. The Rutgers Chapter folded 5-7 years ago leaving the Chi Chapter of Delta Sigma Theta at St. Louis College of Pharmacy the last one left operating without a national office. They are still recognized by STLCOP as well. They go down to Harris Stowe and buy their DST stuff from them...:-)

They are a great bunch of guys!

john1082 · #8 12-20-2006, 02:51 PM

I had not heard of this, but I'm not surprised at all. When did this happen? An inquiring old fart mind wants to know.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoinerLxa

I think its "standard practice" for IHQ (or their legal firm) to send a
"cease and desist" letter to the perpetrators, notifying them that they
are violating U.S. law and could be prosecuted. As long as they don't
become "famous", nothing more would happen. I think that satisfies the
"defend or loose" condition for keeping the copyright.

I once was on faculty at a university in Indiana that did not allow
"fraternities". Instead they had "service/social organizations" that for
all practical purposes were local fraternities/sororities. All "unofficially"
adopted greek-letter names. One called itself "LXA"...they used our
letters, COA, and other emblems. Supposedly they were "initiated"
by LXA at Ball State U. and given permission to use LXA (at least
that's what they told their rushees).

After a little "infiltration", I discovered they knew nothing of LXA.
They didn't even know what PCC, VQV and ChTK stood for!

I also found out IHQ had sent them a "C&D letter" in the early 90's,
but had taken no further action. When I left in 2001, they had
"lost their charter" from the Univ. due to infractions, so I don't know
if they still exist...they were continuing to operate without Univ.
recognition at the time. They were basically the "football players'
frat".

FYI

boz130 · #9 12-20-2006, 01:07 PM

These guys probably saw that the CofA was one of the most ornate in the fraternal world and chose it for that reason.

DeltaBetaBaby · #10 12-20-2006, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ottor 246

I agree. This whole thing only becomes a big deal if we don't handle it now.

It's not as if this is going to be the "trial of the century" or anything. My guess is that as soon as those jokers get a letter from a real lawyer, they'll fold up like a cheap lawn chair and steal someone else's symbol.

Ha, or when their PARENTS receive a letter from a real lawyer.