Getting rid of collegians because they don't fit the image?

[irishpipes]

And to answer your question about why they left some active members: they could not get a guarantee from the University or the Pan-Hellenic Council that they chapter (which happens to be, I believe, their oldest surviving chapter) would be allowed to re-open its doors once the last "old" member graduated.

This information must be incorrect. The chapters at DePauw are:
Alpha Phi 1887
Alpha Chi Omega 1885
Delta Gamma 1949
Delta Zeta 1909
Kappa Alpha Theta 1870
Kappa Kappa Gamma 1875
Pi Beta Phi 1942

He references the "oldest surviving chapter." Well, DePauw hosts the Alpha chapters of both Kappa Alpha Theta and Alpha Chi Omega. They don't have "image" problems at DePauw, unless things have changed drastically recently. No other chapter could be the oldest surviving. Alpha Phi, DG, and KKG all still have their Alphas open, ane we all know DG and Pi Phi have chapters older than 1949 and 1942. The LJ poster didn't have these facts straight, which could lead one to believe that other facts are not straight...

[33girl]

Dani, I said I was being shallow, LOL.

IP - when he says "their oldest surviving chapter" he means "their" as in the national sorority, not "their" as in DePauw.

Originally Posted by 33girl

Dani, I said I was being shallow, LOL.

IP - when he says "their oldest surviving chapter" he means "their" as in the national sorority, not "their" as in DePauw.

Loved your last sentence, btw.

*shaking my head at some of these douchebags*

[archangel689]

I'm not one to go and defend this type of behavior normally, but as a brother that joined in colony status and a founding father...


IMAGE IS SO highly regarded because recruitment is so important at this time and it so incredibly difficult to find new members because you are small and everyone looks on you as weak.

Members HAD TO PUT THE GROUP before themselves in order for the group to survive! Men that didn't shave, or had bad habits with regard to showering, or had bad clothing style are asked to fix these things, and a lot of times they didn't want to! and left the group because of it... and this is perfectly acceptable...

We never asked anything of anyone that they couldn't control... and we certainly never booted anyone because of genetics... We never asked that you not be your self, we just simply asked that you be your best self.... and represent us as best you can.

I think that DZ has probably endured the same problems we did... and are attempted the same thing, and It doesn't surprise me that a large faction of their group quit, or left or was asked to leave, THIS IS COMMON FOR COLONIES AS the group figures out and ESTABLISHES its identity!!!

Unfortunately, I think that these girls, were not willing to make the needed changes to support growth of the colony!!!

Now that our colony is a chapter, and is now stablizing, I've noticed that because their reputation has been built, recruiting is FAR FAR FAR easier and the guys worry a lot less about image...

It's really hard starting a colony, especially when you're dealing with freshmen who are retarded and superficial as hell and inspect who they join with a microscope.

I saw this covered on CNN and I was outraged that this was displayed on TV like a fucking soap opera, and that pledged author needs to put a sock in it.

[GDIfly]

They weren't colonizing; they were dwindling. There is a huge difference between choosing founding members based on their ability to recruit a strong alpha class and kicking out initiated sisters because they aren't recruiting the prettiest, thinnest, whitest, and/or sluttiest girls.

[archangel689]

I don't agree with that statement. A dwindling and weak group below healthy numbers faces a lot of the same challenges a colony does... reputation being one of them. In fact, on some campuses, including mine--once a chapter drops so far in numbers it loses chapter status and, is, in affect, technically a colony, such as in this case.

I am under the impression from the CNN news report that the girls were asked to make certain changes to their behavior (which would include superficial things like makeup, or hair, etc) to better represent and sell the sorority; and the girls didn't want to and left.


This, some people would find alarming. But if the sorority isn't selling what the majority of freshmen girls want to buy, the colony will continue to dwindle in numbers and die.

This is the cold hard truth.

Originally Posted by GDIfly

They weren't colonizing; they were dwindling. There is a huge difference between choosing founding members based on their ability to recruit a strong alpha class and kicking out initiated sisters because they aren't recruiting the prettiest, thinnest, whitest, and/or sluttiest girls.

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

Originally Posted by archangel689

I don't agree with that statement. A dwindling and weak group below healthy numbers faces a lot of the same challenges a colony does... reputation being one of them. In fact, on some campuses, including mine--once a chapter drops so far in numbers it loses chapter status and, is, in affect, technically a colony, such as in this case.

I am under the impression from the CNN news report that the girls were asked to make certain changes to their behavior (which would include superficial things like makeup, or hair, etc) to better represent and sell the sorority; and the girls didn't want to and left.


This, some people would find alarming. But if the sorority isn't selling what the majority of freshmen girls want to buy, the colony will continue to dwindle in numbers and die.

This is the cold hard truth.

Those girls didn't look like they had a grooming problem or that they didn't know how to put on make up. In the picture they all look clean, well groomed, made up...just not barbies. I get the impression it might have been more along the lines of changing their body types and clothing styles. Which involves genetics and something that can be very important to a person's identity.

[archangel689]

Originally Posted by ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl

Those girls didn't look like they had a grooming problem or that they didn't know how to put on make up. In the picture they all look clean, well groomed, made up...just not barbies. I get the impression it might have been more along the lines of changing their body types and clothing styles. Which involves genetics and something that can be very important to a person's identity.

Then someone is a sicko.

[backuppath]

I actually posted this on another board. But here is my opinion as a fellow greek at DePauw.

I actually graduated from DePauw University in 2006. I was not a Delta Zeta there, but I was a Rho Gamma (recruitment guide) my senior year. I am absolutely disgusted by the way nationals handled this situation. I think it is difficult for any chapter at DePauw because the school is very small and stereotypically charged. It seems that a lot of pressure is put on appearance at DePauw. It is rare to see someone wearing sweatpants to class (unless it was a heavy drinking night the night before). The campus is inondated with pearls, designer labels and greek letters. Girls tend to be very up to date with fashion, and it is well known that DePauw kids have a "work hard play hard" attitude. About 80% of the campus is greek and your greek status defines who you are around campus. it is often overheard "do you know so and so? she was an alpha alpah." usually a statement like that is enough to pass judgment.
By no means am i condoning the behavior of students at depauw, because as i am now removed from the campus and lifestyle i actually realize how shallow and immature greek life was at times. Yes, of course i had great memories, lasting friendships, and out chapter did a lot for the community. I still support greek life and depauw university, but it was often taken to the extreme because of the size and emphasis on popularity/appearances.
My first year recruitment was a blur, but i remember going to the DZ house. before we even walked in many of the girls were saying things like "what a waste of time," "do we really have to go in?" "i really want to skip this house and go on to the others," "there's no reason to be here." The one thing i do remember about DZ was the fact that the girls who talked to me didn't even go to DePauw. Clearly, we didn't have much to talk about if you couldn't talk about campus, classes, involvement, etc. I just remember thinking how odd it was. I thought it actually made the house look worse because they had to bring in girls from other schools. Even though rush is fake in itself, this was the more disturbing display of falsity we saw through the whole process in my opinion. Although i do hate to admit this, when i cut Delta Zeta during recruitment i did cut them based on their stereotype. But i also wonder if i would have felt differently if i had actually met the women who lived in the house. maybe meeting the actual DZs, they would have erased the stereotypes i already had in my head. I can't help but think so.
the one thing i have to say about the women of DZ at DePauw is that they are such a strong bunch of girls and they have my support behind their decisions to deactivate.
I think that the nationals made a terrible mistake in overlooking the charm these women had. I think that DePauw needs more greek women like the Dela Zetas.

[33girl]

archangel:

This wasn't a colony. This was DZ's second oldest chapter. And the "individualistic" outlook of the chapter was nothing new.

Did you see the pictures of the girls? They were hardly ugly or ungroomed. They just weren't Paris Hilton clones. And they were smart enough to question what was being asked of them and whether it really was true to the values of DZ as it was founded.

Not to mention that the women of the chapter were all active on campus - they were hardly the social retards people painted them as.

[archangel689]

Second oldest, ouch.

So, they weren't having trouble with recruitment?


I don't know then. I can only offer input from my perpective, the DZs I know, and how my campus operates. From my perspective, even old fraternities, when tiny, are much like colonies, except with a very large alumni base that is "helping" them. Usually really old chapters get alot of attention (I guess like what we see here).

Nationals are somewhat fanatical about their oldest chapters... we've been trying to get our "other" Alpha back for years. They can be really ridiculous about our bigger chapters. So, I guess its possible that someone would just be that crazy and boot these girls because they weren't the exact image of what they wanted.


I was simply offering an alternative possibility...

Originally Posted by 33girl

archangel:

This wasn't a colony. This was DZ's second oldest chapter. And the "individualistic" outlook of the chapter was nothing new.

Did you see the pictures of the girls? They were hardly ugly or ungroomed. They just weren't Paris Hilton clones. And they were smart enough to question what was being asked of them and whether it really was true to the values of DZ as it was founded.

Not to mention that the women of the chapter were all active on campus - they were hardly the social retards people painted them as.