Protests In Wisconsin

[agzg]

Originally Posted by ThetaDancer

So apparently someone called Scott Walker pretending to be David Koch and put the recorded conversation online. The site at which the conversation was originally posted crashed but I guess it can also be found here.

Anyone have any clue if that is real? It sounds exactly like Walker but I'm just hesitant to believe anyone's this dumb.

I'm listening to it now, and it's like - he's saying pretty much the same stuff he's already said - the Koch impersonator is actually seeming to make him a little uncomfortable...

[AOEforme]

From USA today: "Walker spokesman Cullen Werwie confirms the governor is on audio of the call posted Wednesday on the website of the Buffalo Beast, a left-leaning New York newspaper" (http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-02-23-wisconsin-public-unions_N.htm)

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by IrishLake

There is such a thing as volunteer fire departments. It's not unheard of around here for small municipalities to ax the fire department and/or police department budget. County sheriffs deputies then take over patroling that area, and the fire department goes to a volunteer, or looks to a neighboring department.

Originally Posted by Drolefille

While many smaller or rural areas around here have volunteer fire depts with backup coming from larger cities, I've never seen a regular FD get fired.

You can't even put together a volunteer dept that fast. If that town goes through with it, then they better have a good backup plan.

We're not talking about a small rural town. We're talking about a city with a population of over 27,000. The only "volunteer" fire departments I've ever heard of were actually pay per call, not true volunteers. Most of our fire departments have some pay per call members and those people are "on call" for certain shifts. But seriously, relying on an ALL volunteer fire department in this day and age seems kind of crazy. That may have worked if people were farmers and could hear some signal to go to a fire, but when everybody is at their real jobs, who goes to a fire if it is all volunteer? By the time they'd get back to their city of residence, the whole city could be wiped out.

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by AGDee

We're not talking about a small rural town. We're talking about a city with a population of over 27,000. The only "volunteer" fire departments I've ever heard of were actually pay per call, not true volunteers. Most of our fire departments have some pay per call members and those people are "on call" for certain shifts. But seriously, relying on an ALL volunteer fire department in this day and age seems kind of crazy. That may have worked if people were farmers and could hear some signal to go to a fire, but when everybody is at their real jobs, who goes to a fire if it is all volunteer? By the time they'd get back to their city of residence, the whole city could be wiped out.

I think Troy is all volunteer.

[ThetaDancer]

Originally Posted by agzg

I'm listening to it now, and it's like - he's saying pretty much the same stuff he's already said - the Koch impersonator is actually seeming to make him a little uncomfortable...

Yeah some of it was same old same old. But some of it was news to me...like his plan to send out 6,000 "at risk for being laid off" notices as a scare tactic and that he considered planting people in the protests to cause trouble.

And some of it was just plain weird (like the Reagan stuff, or talking about his plan as "a bomb"). Delusions of grandeur. And of course the whole "Yes that would be outstanding" in response to "after you crush these bastards I'll fly you to Cali."

It's also the closest admission I've heard from him about this being coordinated in multiple states.

Walker: I talk to Kasich every day-John's gotta stand firm in Ohio. I think we could do the same thing with Scott in Florida. I think, uh, Snyder-if he got a little more support-probably could do that in Michigan. You start going down the list there's a lot of us new governors that got elected to do something big.

Koch: You're the first domino.
Walker: Yes, this is our moment.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by PiKA2001

I think Troy is all volunteer.

Sort of. After 10 years of service, they are eligible for a pension. They also have 180 firefighters. Allen Park has 27.

[sceniczip]

Our fire department is a lot volunteer and some paid. Here's the link to the history http://www.valleycityfire.com/siteco...x/page/History It's actually pretty interesting I had a friend who was a volunteer. He lived about a mile away and when on call he just hung out at home.

We do have an ongoing joke that if your house ever catches on fire you better grab the marshmallows on the way out

We have a city about 5 miles away that has a full fire department. It's not ideal but if we had to we could always use them too.

[Drolefille]

http://redantliberationarmy.wordpres...state-capitol/

The police have joined the protest. They refused to kick out the protesters and are staying to protest with them.


ETA: Police officers have both participated and policed throughout the protests, however the officers were ordered to clear the protesters out by 4am and they have now refused.
WPPA Press release

HEAD OF POLICE UNION ASKS GOVERNOR TO KEEP CAPITOL OPEN AND ANNOUNCES LAW ENFORCEMENT SLEEPOVER

MADISON—Following action by lawmakers to approve a rule change that clears the way for closing down the State Capitol and ejecting the people protesting
Governor Walker’s bill to curtail union activity, the head of the Wisconsin Professional Police Association called on the governor today to keep the capitol
building open and allow the peaceful protesters to remain.

“The law enforcement officers from across the state that have been working at the Capitol and have been very impressed with how peaceful everyone has
been,” said WPPA Executive Director Jim Palmer. “As has been reported in the media, the protesters are cleaning up after themselves and have not caused any problems. The fact of that matter is that Wisconsin’s law enforcement community opposes Governor Walker’s effort to eliminate most union activity in this state, and we implore him to not do anything to increase the risk to officers and the public. The costs of providing security can never outweigh those associated with a conflict.”

Palmer also announced that, beginning tonight, the WPPA is formally requesting its members from across the state to come to the Capitol to sleep amongst the throngs of other union supporters. “Law enforcement officers know the difference between right and wrong, and Governor Walker’s attempt to eliminate the collective voice of Wisconsin’s devoted public employees is wrong,” continued Palmer. “That is why we have stood with our fellow employees each day and why we will be sleeping among them tonight.”

[KSUViolet06]

Rally in Ohio capital today.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content...1&cmpid=aunews

[KSUViolet06]

A Senate Committee (Ohio) voted 7-5 this morning to send Senate Bill 5, the collective bargaining bill, to the full Senate for a likely vote this afternoon.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content...z.html?sid=101

[Kappamd]

^^^The bill has since passed in the Senate and now moves to the House where it also expected to pass.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=13041121

[AOEforme]

Proof it was never about balancing a budget:
http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/03/09/wisconsin.budget/index.html?hpt=T1&iref=BN1

Bill passes without Senate Democrats present because ALL fiscal matters are removed from the bill.

Disgusting. In addition to collective barganing, Wisconsin's college programs were slashed, recycling programs (started by a Republican) dismantled, and a Early Release Work program (that was designed to reduce prison costs) is gone.

In addition, insurance companies are no longer required to cover contraceptives.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by AOEforme

Proof it was never about balancing a budget:
http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/03/09/wisconsin.budget/index.html?hpt=T1&iref=BN1

Bill passes without Senate Democrats present because ALL fiscal matters are removed from the bill.

Disgusting. In addition to collective barganing, Wisconsin's college programs were slashed, recycling programs (started by a Republican) dismantled, and a Early Release Work program (that was designed to reduce prison costs) is gone.

In addition, insurance companies are no longer required to cover contraceptives.

Work Release getting cut is a shame. It's a great motivator, and those guys get hired very quickly. I'm sure it's a 'Prisoners are taking our jobs'/'Tough on crime' bullshit.

Also, does the Healthcare bill require coverage of contraceptives? Fuck Walker.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Also, does the Healthcare bill require coverage of contraceptives? Fuck Walker.

That's up for interpretation apparently.

http://womenslawproject.wordpress.co...h-care-reform/

Michigan's new governor isn't doing so great either:
The Michigan League for Human Services this week cited a new analysis by the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy that found households earning $17,000 or less would pay 1.1 percent more of their income in new taxes, while those making $355,000 or more would pay 1/10th of 1 percent more under Snyder's proposals. A recent league analysis also found that Snyder's plan will cut business taxes by 86 percent while increasing individual income taxes 31 percent.

The governor, a former Gateway computer executive who campaigned as "one tough nerd," acknowledged that many of his policies have angered a wide spectrum of Michigan residents, including many who voted for him. He said his goal wasn't to get a lot of people mad at him but to fundamentally change Michigan's culture.

Much longer article at: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...,6789708.story

[AOEforme]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Also, does the Healthcare bill require coverage of contraceptives? Fuck Walker.

The part that confuses me is that Wisconsin is required to pay for the health care of any child who lives in the state, in addition to their education and for meal programs and assistance if the parent(s) cannot afford to.

Why would you remove a third-party program to reduce the costs above if you're interest in saving money?