Feds to file lawsuit over Arizona immigration law - Page 8

starang21 · #**106** 07-08-2010, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psi U MC Vito

What about those who are born citizens but never learn English?

Also there are illegals who can speak English pretty decently. So your logic falls pretty flat.

you're talking about a miniscule sect of the population. an atomic bomb and a herd of elephants can also hit my house during a tornado, too.

sure. there illegals who can speak english. so quite possibly they may not be questioned. people get away with crimes all the time. that still doesn't mean we shouldn't pursue them. but then that goes back to their question, what about their id? unless they're traveling to a jurisdiction that gives out ids to illegals, then purposely traveling back to arizona. which is highly unlikely. about as likely as being a citizen who can't speak english.

starang21 · #**107** 07-08-2010, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Because it occurs now and is outright denied by the individuals who do it. It's been documented as having happened in the past and it is reasonable to assume it will continue to be the same in the future.

I see this law as encouraging it even when it says that you can't use race.

ok, then all laws are unconstitutional. however, i'm not disputing what you're saying.

Drolefille · #**108** 07-08-2010, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by starang21

ok, then all laws are unconstitutional. however, i'm not disputing what you're saying.

FWIW I don't think it's backhanded encouragement of racial profiling aspect that makes this unconstitutional, I just think it makes it a bad law.

I think it's unconstitutional for a bunch of other reasons that I'm sure I listed previously... somewhere.

Anyway thanks for the discussion.

Kevin · #**109** 07-08-2010, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psi U MC Vito

Why? A lot of Puerto Ricans for instance can't speak English to save their lives. Also remember that the United States does NOT have an official language.

It's not illegal to smell like marijuana either, or get into a car after spilling a glass of whiskey on yourself--it's just going to get your car searched 100% of the time.

AOII Angel · #**110** 07-08-2010, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin

It's not illegal to smell like marijuana either, or get into a car after spilling a glass of whiskey on yourself--it's just going to get your car searched 100% of the time.

I don't think smelling like alcohol or marijuana can be equated to looking hispanic or not speaking English.

Munchkin03 · #**111** 07-08-2010, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by starang21

you're talking about a miniscule sect of the population. an atomic bomb and a herd of elephants can also hit my house during a tornado, too.

sure. there illegals who can speak english. so quite possibly they may not be questioned. people get away with crimes all the time. that still doesn't mean we shouldn't pursue them. but then that goes back to their question, what about their id? unless they're traveling to a jurisdiction that gives out ids to illegals, then purposely traveling back to arizona. which is highly unlikely. about as likely as being a citizen who can't speak english.

Oh man, don't get me started on Americans who can't speak English. As I learned during my brief flirtation with Orthodox Judaism, there are entire TOWNS!!!! of Hasidic Jews who speak very little, if any, English. They know basic commercial English but most of the time speak Yiddish and only Yiddish. There's no need for them to speak English, since they don't go in the mainstream world.

Drolefille · #**112** 07-08-2010, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bridgekid3

Is that like Obama telling everyone the economy is improving?

Obama is a one term President. Even the blacks are starting to bail on him. The blacks do not want to compete with the illegals for welfare.

The whites won't vote for him again. Most of them have learned their lesson. Health care costs are already starting to increase.

Because healthcare costs weren't increasing before the bill? And the cost saving side of the Healthcare Bill doesn't go into effect until later.

Criticizing the president doesn't mean that people are "bailing" on him. He's still better than the alternative (IMO) and his shots at a second term are better than most. But REALLY not the topic going on here.

Nanners52674 · #**113** 07-08-2010, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bridgekid3

Is that like Obama telling everyone the economy is improving?

Obama is a one term President. Even the blacks are starting to bail on him. The blacks do not want to compete with the illegals for welfare.

The whites won't vote for him again. Most of them have learned their lesson. Health care costs are already starting to increase.

Well this white person (since apparently only race matters in politics) will vote for him again.

AGDee · #**114** 07-08-2010, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by starang21

it can certainly fall under reasonable suspicion.

again, can't and won't aren't the same thing. and can't communicate well is way different from can't communicate at all.

hence in order to become a naturalized citizen, one must have basic skills in the english language. the same with getting a green card.

Not if they are over 50/55. That requirement is waived then.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Because healthcare costs weren't increasing before the bill? And the cost saving side of the Healthcare Bill doesn't go into effect until later.

Criticizing the president doesn't mean that people are "bailing" on him. He's still better than the alternative (IMO) and his shots at a second term are better than most. But REALLY not the topic going on here.

Ditto. Very little of the healthcare bill is in effect yet and costs that are rising are due to the high number of uninsureds/underinsureds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nanners52674

Well this white person (since apparently only race matters in politics) will vote for him again.

Ditto.

Drolefille · #**115** 07-08-2010, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGDee

Not if they are over 50/55. That requirement is waived then.

Ditto. Very little of the healthcare bill is in effect yet and costs that are rising are due to the high number of uninsureds/underinsureds.

Ditto.

It's what's his face. That guy.

Nanners52674 · #**116** 07-08-2010, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bridgekid3

Actually health care costs were increasing. Obama promised a DECREASE didn't he? A bigger increase is not a decrease is it?

This isn't about healthcare, if you want to talk about that make another thread. Or you know you could post about greek life stuff since you're new here and all

DaemonSeid · #**117** 07-08-2010, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nanners52674

This isn't about healthcare, if you want to talk about that make another thread. Or you know you could post about greek life stuff since you're new here and all

Nanners...a warning...do not engage...this is a former GC member who keeps coming back like herpes. They will be banned soon.

Kevin · #**118** 07-08-2010, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

I don't think smelling like alcohol or marijuana can be equated to looking hispanic or not speaking English.

Not speaking English is commonly associated with being illegally here. Smelling like marijuana is commonly associated with being under the influence or in possession. Smelling like whiskey is associated with being drunk.

DaemonSeid · #**119** 07-08-2010, 05:15 PM

That commonality doesn't mean it's correct.

Kevin · #**120** 07-08-2010, 05:18 PM

It doesn't have to. Correlation doesn't have to definitely mean the crime is afoot, it just has to lead to a reasonable suspicion. If you've encountered someone who doesn't speak English and doesn't have identification or insurance, you definitely can have the reasonable belief that this person is illegal and can investigate whether they are.