What does it say in your by-laws?

[FSUZeta]

Perhaps at the chapter your friend received a bid from, it is uncommon(or not allowed) that a married PNM would be offered a bid, and perhaps the chapter sought special permission from the chapter's National office to offer her a bid, which was ultimately not allowed by the National officer they contacted. She might not have been able to get back with the chapter until bid day. National officers have a lot on their plates everyday, which is magnified during recruitment.

I ditto what others have said-be very upfront on your registration form and with your rec. writers (if you need them for your college) that you are married. Wear your wedding ring to the parties, be frank in your discussions at the parties, and hopefully that will prevent similar disappointment for you. Better to not be invited back to a chapter during recruitment, than to have your membership revoked because the chapter did not know that you were married, and it is against their policy to pledge a married woman.

[pbear19]

I understood exactly what she meant about the boyfriend/husband difference. Honestly, not every married couple spends 24/7 with each other!! My husband and I have our own separate lives, and we are very happily married. The first several years of our marriage he had a job that took him away from home about 90% of every month, and I went out with my work friends quite a bit. Including the men that I worked with. We trusted each other and there was never jealousy about what we were doing when the other wasn't around.

It sounds like the OP has a similar relationship with her husband as I have with mine. If so, her marriage would not in any way be a hindrance from her joining a sorority, provided the members are interested in and able to offer her a bid.

[angels&angles]

I think the OP is seeing a sorority as something to fill her time while her husband isn't home. And in some ways, that's not a bad way to look at it. But on the other hand, after 8 months, when hubby gets back in town, will her sorority membership and duties become an inconvenience?

I do know what you mean about husbands vs new boyfriends. I always hated when my friends would drop me for some dude they started dating.

I do wonder how old the OP is, and if that and the general experience gap between her and other members (who are looking for fratbro dates for formals) may be a bigger hindrance.

OP, these are just musings. We may know (some varieties of) sorority life, but only you know your life, situation, and marriage. I say go through recruitment, but go with an open eye and mind to some of the things we point out as possible stumbling blocks for you (beyond simply getting a bid).

[AZTheta]

OP, no one has been condescending to you. People have expressed their opinions. Here's mine:

Please be aware that during the new member period, your membership can be fairly "easily" terminated; it is very important for you to be totally upfront from the get-go about your marital status. It could be most unpleasant if the chapter found this out after the fact.

Also, understand that sororities are voluntary membership organizations and that they each have established and follow their own constitution/bylaws/policies.

And what your friends tell you, or you research and read, really doesn't matter; it's your own actual recruitment/membership experience that counts.

I wish you good luck!

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Titchou

If you are talking about a woman, such as myself, who is a grad of a school which has both genders, then yes, I am an alumnus of the University of Alabama and belong to the Alumni Association . . . .

Are you sure about that? While you are indeed a member of the Alumni Association, and you and your former male classmates are now alumni, I think you alone are still an alumna of the University because you are female and there is only one of you. The fact that the school is co-ed doesn't affect the fact that as one female you're an alumna. It's only in the plural that mixed groups take the masculine form.

And we could point out that historically, alumni is pronounced a-lum-nee, while alumnae is pronounced a-lum-nie (as in pie). My Pi Phi mother-in-law still pronounces them that way.

#alli'vegot

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Are you sure about that? While you are indeed a member of the Alumni Association, and you and your former male classmates are now alumni, I think you alone are still an alumna of the University because you are female and there is only one of you. The fact that the school is co-ed doesn't affect the fact that as one female you're an alumna. It's only in the plural that mixed groups take the masculine form.

This is what I thought, but I didn't want to correct her without being sure

I would think that by yourself, you (Titchou) would always be an alumna. If in a group - as a member of an association, a graduate of a university, etc. - it would depend on the makeup of the group; all female = alumnae, mix of male and female = alumni.

[aephi alum]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Are you sure about that? While you are indeed a member of the Alumni Association, and you and your former male classmates are now alumni, I think you alone are still an alumna of the University because you are female and there is only one of you. The fact that the school is co-ed doesn't affect the fact that as one female you're an alumna. It's only in the plural that mixed groups take the masculine form.

And we could point out that historically, alumni is pronounced a-lum-nee, while alumnae is pronounced a-lum-nie (as in pie). My Pi Phi mother-in-law still pronounces them that way.

#alli'vegot

Quite correct.

alumnus = one male
alumna = one female
alumni = a group of males
alumnae = a group of females
alumni = a group of males and females (even if there are 1000 women and 1 man in the group, they are still collectively referred to as alumni)

<----- 7 years of middle school and high school Latin

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Are you sure about that? While you are indeed a member of the Alumni Association, and you and your former male classmates are now alumni, I think you alone are still an alumna of the University because you are female and there is only one of you. The fact that the school is co-ed doesn't affect the fact that as one female you're an alumna. It's only in the plural that mixed groups take the masculine form.

And we could point out that historically, alumni is pronounced a-lum-nee, while alumnae is pronounced a-lum-nie (as in pie). My Pi Phi mother-in-law still pronounces them that way.

#alli'vegot

Technically, I can call myself an alumna or an alumnus of Alabama but since they only have an Alumni Association I can only be a member of it. I can't make it Alumnae. And alumnae rhymes with "knee" not "pie." You've got that part backwards. 3 years of Latin and 30 years as a Catholic when they only used Latin....not to mention the Delta Gamma crib sheet....

I have however heard it - back in the day - pronounced alum-nay...but then you can get into the whole hard c/soft c thing too.....is it vee-chee or vee-key????? Only Cesaer knows for sure....

[angels&angles]

I always understood that TECHNICALLY alumni = alum-nee, alumnae = alum-nye, but I admit I had two years of Latin I was terrible at (technically three years, but the first year was a high school Latin 1 class I took for fun and barely counts).

As to veni vidi vici, I learned that in Italian it's veen-ee, vee-dee, vee-chee but in Latin it's wee-ne, wee-dee wee-kee.

[AZTheta]

How can people say "this is how to pronounce Latin words"? No one has ever heard it spoken that is living today (I'm not attacking you personally, angels&angles! OK?). The written language form is all we have, and we all know that written language is nothing like spoken language.

I could get into a long linguistics post, but I won't. No one cares except for the other SLPs and linguists on GC. They already know what I would say, anyway. *yawn*

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Titchou

Technically, I can call myself an alumna or an alumnus of Alabama but since they only have an Alumni Association I can only be a member of it. I can't make it Alumnae.

No, but it's an Alumni Association because its members include males. That doesn't make every member on alumnus. A male member is an alumnus, a female member is an alumna, and collectively they are alumni.

And alumnae rhymes with "knee" not "pie." You've got that part backwards. 3 years of Latin and 30 years as a Catholic when they only used Latin....not to mention the Delta Gamma crib sheet....

Classical Latin and Church Latin are often pronounced differently, the latter having been influenced by later European languages, primarily Italian. But in both, the single vowel "i" is pronounced "ee" (or somewhere between "ee" and "ih"). So, alumni = "alum-nee" in Latin. Pronouncing it alum-nie (to rhyme with "pie") is an anglicization, much like pronouncing Phi "phie" rather than "phee" as it would be in Greek. English speakers have modified the "i" to an English long-I sound rather than using the "ee" that the letter represents in Latin or Greek, because we don't think "ee" when we see an "i."

As for "ae," in Classical Latin that represents the diphthong that English speakers consider the long-I sound, as in "pie." It's a diphthong of "a" ("ah") and "i" ("ee"). In church Latin, "ae" is pronounced more like the English long-A sound -- "ay" as in "pay" -- which is also really a diphthong of "eh" and "ee."

Only Cesaer knows for sure....

LOL. True.

Originally Posted by AzTheta

How can people say "this is how to pronounce Latin words"? No one has ever heard it spoken that is living today (I'm not attacking you personally, angels&angles! OK?). The written language form is all we have, and we all know that written language is nothing like spoken language.

The written form is all we have of Classical Latin. Church Latin is still used daily.

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Classical Latin and Church Latin are often pronounced differently, the latter having been influenced by later European languages, primarily Italian. But in both, the single vowel "i" is pronounced "ee" (or somewhere between "ee" and "ih"). So, alumni = "alum-nee" in Latin. Pronouncing it alum-nie (to rhyme with "pie") is an anglicization, much like pronouncing Phi "phie" rather than "phee" as it would be in Greek. English speakers have modified the "i" to an English long-I sound rather than using the "ee" that the letter represents in Latin or Greek, because we don't think "ee" when we see an "i."

As for "ae," in Classical Latin that represents the diphthong that English speakers consider the long-I sound, as in "pie." It's a diphthong of "a" ("ah") and "i" ("ee"). In church Latin, "ae" is pronounced more like the English long-A sound -- "ay" as in "pay" -- which is also really a diphthong

Or we could go back to the Great Vowel Shift and really gum up the works!

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

The written form is all we have of Classical Latin. Church Latin is still used daily.

Got it! Thank you

ps the one year of Latin in 7th grade helped with the four years of Italian in college AND with every standardized test involving vocabulary that I ever had to take. Ciao!

[angels&angles]

Originally Posted by AzTheta

How can people say "this is how to pronounce Latin words"? No one has ever heard it spoken that is living today (I'm not attacking you personally, angels&angles! OK?). The written language form is all we have, and we all know that written language is nothing like spoken language.

I could get into a long linguistics post, but I won't. No one cares except for the other SLPs and linguists on GC. They already know what I would say, anyway. *yawn*

Oh yeah, absolutely. I'm just parroting what I was taught. I think it does have something to do with linguistics and what we "know" was spoken in similar languages at the time. And also getting the rhyme and meter of Ovid's work and similar to mesh. I find it fascinating.

I'm really not sure when it was decided that there was no "v" or "ch" sound in Classical Latin. Fairly recently (last 30-50 years maybe), I think.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Titchou

Or we could go back to the Great Vowel Shift and really gum up the works!

Ha! Very true.

Originally Posted by angels&angles

I'm really not sure when it was decided that there was no "v" or "ch" sound in Classical Latin. Fairly recently (last 30-50 years maybe), I think.

I know from relatives that the no "v" or "ch" sound was being taught at least 100 years ago. My understanding is that the "ch" sound in Latin is the product of Church Latin. Church Latin tends in many respects to follow the rules of Italian, and in Italian, "c" before "e" or "i" = "ch."

Back in my voice major days, we had to take a class in Latin pronunciation. The people who had taken Classical Latin in high school always had a harder time getting the hang of Church Latin (which was obviously the main focus, given the amount of sacred music in Latin) because of the differences. And on the flip side, people who had learned Church Latin first had a harder time getting the hang of Classical Latin.