South vs. North?

[alum]

Don't forget that Boston, MA public schools had neighborhood (thus segregated) schools until the early 70's at which time forced busing came into play.

[Elephant Walk]

Or that you know, the majority of race riots in the last 20 years have come in the North and the West (Philly and LA, namely)

[IvySpice]

England was able to abolish slavery without a war - every other nation in the Western Hemisphere was also.

What? You consider what happened in Haiti to be a peaceful exchange of power?

[UGAalum94]

No doubt that other areas of the country stunk too: residential mortgage red-lining of minority neighborhoods, etc. Please don't think I'm trying to say that individual people in other regions were more progressive.

The difference to me is that segregation was official and practiced by the government and gov't agencies in the South long after other regions were trying to officially and legally address it, for example, with the busing you mentioned.

ETA: most areas have neighborhood schools today which end up being segregated, so I'm not sure that in itself points to an intention to discriminate the same way that actually barring enrollment of black students did.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by IvySpice

What? You consider what happened in Haiti to be a peaceful exchange of power?

So is it every other Western country except for Haiti? We could start a list: I'm not up on my emancipation law.

[alum]

As a former Bostonian, I really believe that the greater Boston area (suburbs included) is one of the most self-segregated areas of our country. There is Mattapan and Roxbury (not to be confused with WEST Roxbury), Beacon Hill and the Back Bay, East Boston and the North End, Newton and Brookline, Weymouth and Quincy, Wellesley and Weston, just to name a few. Each are known for attracting a certain socioeconomic class AND ethnicity/religion.

[UGAalum94]

Alum, you may be right, although a lot of Atlanta is really segregated in a similar way. I do still maintain that race looms over everything in the South in a way it doesn't seem to elsewhere, and it's one of the big negatives about the region.

I suspect that similarly divisive issues come up when officials decide how to treat the history of New Mexico and Texas. It would seem like it could be objective, but I think how much you emphasize the Spanish colonial presence gets to be pretty heated, as well as if you are going to regard both Spanish and Anglo as oppressing the indigenous peoples. And yet, when someone says they love Southwestern life, people from other regions don't assume what they are enjoying is based on a legacy of exploitation and inequality.

[honeychile]

Bottom line on the past aspect: Each of us has as much control over who our ancestors were, or what our ancestors did or thought as we had control over our height or DNA. It's how you process it and how you decide to improve on their lot that's important.

I have ancestors on both sides on the War Between the States. I refuse to deny any of them, because I had nothing to do with their thought processes! People had different ideals 150 years ago, and there's nothing I or anyone else can do to change that.

The important thing is to learn and move on - keeping what is noble and right, and disgarding the evils.

[susan314]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

And now for something completely different . . .

What consititutes the north, the mid-west and the west in your mind? I'd especially like to hear from those who consider themselves from those regions. And, what do you think distinguishes your region? (Not the geographical!)

I grew up in Michigan and presently live in Ohio. I would generally label myself as being "from the Midwest." Not sure if that's technically correct (according to how the Midwest is supposed to be defined), but I certainly feel Midwestern.

Not sure what areas would constitute the North, now that I think about it. The northern states such as Maine, Vermont, New Hampshire, etc. I would actually consider as "eastern." Many of the other states along the US/Canada border I'd consider as "midwest" (Michigan, etc.).

Edit to add: Guess I wasn't too far off in thinking of myself as "Midwestern." According to Wiki (which is never wrong...lol), the Midwest is generally considered to be: Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, North Dakota, Ohio, South Dakota, and Wisconsin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midwest

[shinerbock]

Is Atlanta really that segregated? I agree that may be true for where black/white folks live, but even relatively "white" places like Buckhead (east paces), dunwoody, peachtree city, etc, have a lot of minorities who come to hang out or shop there.

I think it sucks for the young black professional crowd in metro Atlanta really. I know they probably love Atlanta, but I've seen a lot of classy young black people feel resistance when moving into nice communities. I don't think they'd describe it as racism, more like cautious hesitation.

[AGDee]

Yes, they stick Michigan in the midwest category. I've wondered why for a long time. We aren't West of much, except the Appalachians. Do they not want to have a Mid East region because of the geo-political issues in the Middle East of the world?

The Detroit metro area was the most segregated in the country per this Detroit News article: http://detnews.com/specialreports/20...b03-390169.htm Other major citites that were on the list were all around the Great Lakes.

[susan314]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Yes, they stick Michigan in the midwest category. I've wondered why for a long time. We aren't West of much, except the Appalachians. Do they not want to have a Mid East region because of the geo-political issues in the Middle East of the world?

I think that the terminology stems from the Northwest Territories - so perhaps at the time the "midwest" label started, we were more towards the "middle" of the west? (Before all of those more Western states became part of the US.)

Though I did see something referenced about the midwest starting as west of the Allegheny River.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by susan314

Guess I wasn't too far off in thinking of myself as "Midwestern." According to Wiki (which is never wrong...lol), the Midwest is generally considered to be: Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, North Dakota, Ohio, South Dakota, and Wisconsin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midwest

Well, I feel better about how I was thinking about Ohio, but doesn't it seem weird that everything from Ohio to Nebraska would be Midwestern?

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Yes, they stick Michigan in the midwest category. I've wondered why for a long time. We aren't West of much, except the Appalachians. Do they not want to have a Mid East region because of the geo-political issues in the Middle East of the world?

The Detroit metro area was the most segregated in the country per this Detroit News article: http://detnews.com/specialreports/20...b03-390169.htm Other major citites that were on the list were all around the Great Lakes.

That is a really interesting story. Neither Atlanta or (Boston at least racially I guess) is as segregated as we thought.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

Is Atlanta really that segregated? I agree that may be true for where black/white folks live, but even relatively "white" places like Buckhead (east paces), dunwoody, peachtree city, etc, have a lot of minorities who come to hang out or shop there.

I think it sucks for the young black professional crowd in metro Atlanta really. I know they probably love Atlanta, but I've seen a lot of classy young black people feel resistance when moving into nice communities. I don't think they'd describe it as racism, more like cautious hesitation.

The news story above confirms your theory that Atlanta isn't as segregated as I thought.

As far as the second point, I agree it probably really hard for well educated affluent young black people to find places that they want to live and feel completely welcome.

I think the "cautious hesitation" may be fear of white flight, not so much fear, distrust, or hatred of black people. As you probably know, the city and the surrounding area have experienced shifting demographics; think about Clayton County 10-15 years ago and Clayton County today. South/Mid Gwinnett, 10 years ago versus today. They're demographically different. I think people have concern that any racial change is approaching the "white flight" tipping point. Sure, it's a little racist, but it's more worrying about other people's racist actions that you have no control over.