Transgender women in sorority life?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by anna7363

And I'll flounce, mainly cause I more or less agree with dr. Phill and 33girl. So I wouldn't be adding much new. Except I do feel the demand for surgery is a bit extreme. And the legal situation might change soon cause the American Medical Association just declared that transgender people should be able I change their legal gender on their birth certificate without surgery. So the whole title 9 thing will probably an irrelevant argument before to long

You are contributing to the discussion. I agree with you. If a GLO wants to require/force/verify surgery then that GLO is in rough territory. I would much rather a GLO deny someone who says she or he is transgender than requiring/forcing/verifying surgery. Even checking the birth certification is objectifying and dehumanizing. Most GLOs don't check genitalia, biological sex and gender, surgical history, and birth certificates for applicants and members NOW and we should NEVER do that.

ETA: 33girl, thanks for the reminder. I can't believe I used that term and have edited my first post. For the GCers who are unfamiliar: http://www.isna.org/faq/hermaphrodite

[Sororitysock]

Originally Posted by anna7363

Any fabrication that is in the story was to and still is to protect people from shit going down. If things came out that happened a lot of people could get in a lot of trouble. It's not worth the drama and I don't want to see friends get hurt (I know I said I was done but I think it's something important to mention). The whole premise of the story is more or less true with slight edits for peoples safety.

You are not a sorority member nor ever have been. You completely made all of that up. You have no idea what happens in internal sorority matters nor do you know that people would "get in a lot of trouble" nor what "shit would go down." People here have been very polite to you in spite of the fact that you made everything up.

[anna7363]

Yeah I can't help myself, I'm contributing lol. Btw, I think its probably already sort of a don't ask don't tell type things going on. Cause like I said earlier I would be incredibly surprised if there were not already trans women and men in greek life who kept there mouths shut.

[anna7363]

Sororitysock, we are not even talking about that anymore, can you please drop it. I don't want to talk about it anymore. We are having a real conversation about a different issue

[DrPhil]

Alright, sorority sock puppet, we got your point. Go away.

[anna7363]

I apologize for making up stuff, but honestly you know why I made it up. Because I didn't want to be in a conversation as that weird person who got cookie cutter answers and half truths from everyone because of who I am. Please leave it be

[anna7363]

I'll explain who I am for you all. I am a transgender girl who rushed for greek life at my school. I essentially got lied to by both advisors, students, and others that I had a real fair chance of getting in. It was all in an effort to legally cover their butts. What they did more or less violated university policy. I would have been cool with them telling me that I couldn't tbh. But my problem is that the office of greek affairs and others strung me on for almost a year.
I came on here because I wanted unadulterated opinions on what people think. And not having to deal with the situation of getting half truths. All my friends in greek life from other universities were really surprised when I didn't get in. That is the incredibly short story but intellectually understanding things is my way of coping with stuff. And the shit I got put through has done its number to me. Coming on here and asking a story that got opinions I wanted to hear is part of that intellectual understanding.

[AZTheta]

wait…what?

There's no sorority sister? There's no biological sister? This is all make-believe?

I'm going to pay attention to the larger issue that's being discussed by sorority and fraternity members, and ignore the side story.

[anna7363]

A lot of people on campus have told me basically what happened in its entirety. My guess is you have to be from one of the three sororities that accept seniors. At least 3 different girls in one of those sororities in particular told me what happened. They are my friends and disgruntled members had more loyalty to me then to you guys. Whether thats because you had treated them like garbage so they vented to me drunk at a party. Bitching about what terrible people you all are. Or they are good friends who trust me intimately and aren't going to bail on me just cause they got into a sorority.

[anna7363]

@AZTheta, This is why I didn't want to tell you guys. So I actually had a voice of some sorts here and could contribute. But clearly there are people who couldn't deal with it and had to out me

[AZTheta]

But anna, truthfully, by being mendacious at the outset, you lost credibility.

Like I said, I'm going to focus on the larger issue. I'm thinking our founders didn't have any of these issues before them.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by SoCalGirl

I'm curious to the reverse scenario. A transgender male attempting to join a fraternity.

Also, to the point of what if they change after they're initiated members, I would think it'd be easier for a sorority member to transition to male and maintain her membership than a fraternity member to transition to female. Mainly because a woman has a lot more leeway, socially speaking, to not always present herself in a feminine manner than a man to present masculine.

But he would no longer be a woman so there is no need for leeway. This isn't about the extreme subjectivity of socially created feminine and masculine behaviors. This is about whether someone identifies as a woman, man, both, or neither. Such is the complications that arose when humans insist on categories and, if we insist on categories, refuse to add categories.

[anna7363]

@AZTheta Thats fine, I was never on here to complain about me anyways. I just wanted to hear your guys honest thoughts about this.

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

But he would no longer be a woman so there is no need for leeway. This isn't about the extreme subjectivity of socially created feminine and masculine behaviors. This is about whether someone identifies as a woman, man, both, or neither. Such is the complications that arose when humans insist on categories and, if we insist on categories, refuse to add categories.

Bolding mine. This is what I'm reflecting on - and in much broader terms.

[33girl]

Anyone who tells you that you have "a real fair chance of getting in" is doing you a disservice. Especially if they're a relatively new member who isn't sure of all policies and/or the amount of pull they have in the sorority. Especially if they're a student affairs employee who knows nothing about the individual sororities' policies. This applies to ANY rushee. It's people not checking the facts and promoting a roses and daisies world.

I think AOIIAngel hit the nail on the head with her post.