dating a sweetheart and I'm NOT a greek

[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by TSteven

Point taken. While they may not have had it when you were there, they might now. And the election of a chapter Sweetheart may not always be well publicized regardless of the campus. Besides, even if the Zeta Chapter (W&L) of Sigma Chi does not have a chapter Sweetheart, they do have an International Sweetheart.

Well, I only graduated in 2005, so if they have them now, it would be a really recent development. Trust me, EVERYTHING is well-publicized at W&L. Please don't pretend to understand my campus. For example, fraternities' nomination of homecoming candidates was a HUGE deal that all sorority women knew ALL about. I could even tell you which fraternities elected women how (based on people who hung out there, which woman had been dating a senior the longest, which woman they thought was a "sure thing" to win Homecoming even if she didn't hang out there, etc.). A lot of the traditional fraternity & women things weren't done at W&L--for example lavaliering. Guys didn't do that for whatever reason. Again I think it has to do with coeducation coming so late.

If you are interested in learning more, and happen to know any fraternity men at Texas, please ask them if they have a chapter Sweetheart. Those who do might be able to give you a better understanding of what they actually do. And not something based on rumor on innuendo.

This is a good suggestion. I do know quite a few fraternity men at Texas, but since my connections with them are through being their instructor, it's actually not appropriate for me to ask them such questions. It violates TA liability policy.

If you feel a need to judge based on what GC posters have said, then so be it. I hope that if you are truly interested in this, you will research it further and not limit your knowledge to what people post here.

I am truly interested in this. I HAVE read a lot of threads about this. Remember that I have been here since 2002 and have been reading threads for many years. You don't know what I have and haven't read. It's actually true that at one time I thought having sweethearts seemed cool and thought W&L fraternities should start doing it. On reading more (including from pro-sweetheart people), I began to think it was a VERY bad idea and came to really appreciate Pi Phi's policy banning sweethearts. Just because I disagree with you doesn't mean I'm uninformed. I readily admit I don't have direct experience with sweethearts. That doesn't mean I can't have an opinion on it. I don't have direct experience with taking heroin either, but I can have an opinion on it.

[quoteI have know a few men who held the honor of being an Arrowmen. All are (and were) upstanding individuals.[/quote]

I sure hope this isn't recently.

I will try it again. If it still does not work, you might want to try searching "Sigma Chi Sweetheart Program" Once you get to the website, there are direct links to the program.

Sweetheart Program

The link works now. Thanks. But again, official policy does not equal practice.

[TSteven]

Originally Posted by breathesgelatin

Well, I only graduated in 2005, so if they have them now, it would be a really recent development. Trust me, EVERYTHING is well-publicized at W&L. Please don't pretend to understand my campus. For example, fraternities' nomination of homecoming candidates was a HUGE deal that all sorority women knew ALL about. I could even tell you which fraternities elected women how (based on people who hung out there, which woman had been dating a senior the longest, which woman they thought was a "sure thing" to win Homecoming even if she didn't hang out there, etc.). A lot of the traditional fraternity & women things weren't done at W&L--for example lavaliering. Guys didn't do that for whatever reason. Again I think it has to do with coeducation coming so late.

I apologize if I gave the impression that I pretended to understand your campus. I do not. On the same hand, and not that you have necessarily done so, please do not pretend to understand my fraternity.

This is a good suggestion. I do know quite a few fraternity men at Texas, but since my connections with them are through being their instructor, it's actually not appropriate for me to ask them such questions. It violates TA liability policy.

You need to do what you need to do. But when I was in graduate school (and granted, I was not a teachers assistant) I was able to talk with other graduate students as well as undergrad students. Some were not ever in my department. I would hope that at a school like Texas you might be able to find at least one person you could speak with and not violate your TA liability policy.

I am truly interested in this. I HAVE read a lot of threads about this. Remember that I have been here since 2002 and have been reading threads for many years. You don't know what I have and haven't read. It's actually true that at one time I thought having sweethearts seemed cool and thought W&L fraternities should start doing it. On reading more (including from pro-sweetheart people), I began to think it was a VERY bad idea and came to really appreciate Pi Phi's policy banning sweethearts. Just because I disagree with you doesn't mean I'm uninformed. I readily admit I don't have direct experience with sweethearts. That doesn't mean I can't have an opinion on it. I don't have direct experience with taking heroin either, but I can have an opinion on it.

Of course you may have an opinion. Yet because your sorority currently - or you personally - do not like the idea of *fraternity* sweethearts, or have a realistic concept of what they do, does not mean that other sororities or fraternities are not initialed to have one.

I sure hope this [Arrowmen] isn't recently.

Well, yes. The ones I met recently held the honor years back.

The link works now. Thanks. But again, official policy does not equal practice.

You may be right. However, as you pointed out, you are not familiar with the concept of chapter sweethearts. So why say something inflammatory. Hearsay does not make it reality either.

And please, with respect to Sigma Chi Fraternity, if you ever find anything questionable regarding one of our chapter Sweethearts, please send me a PM with the specific details.

[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by TSteven

You need to do what you need to do. But when I was in graduate school (and granted, I was not a teachers assistant) I was able to talk with other graduate students as well as undergrad students. Some were not ever in my department. I would hope that at a school like Texas you might be able to find at least one person you could speak with and not violate your TA liability policy.

Not really. We can't really inquire into people's personal lives at all if we're their instructor. It's extremely inappropriate. Being a graduate instructor at a huge university, there are a ton of policies that would never come up if you were not an instructor. If they bring it up, certainly, but I don't know why they ever would. A Phi Psi in my class brought up that he was a Phi Psi recently and we discussed that. But otherwise I'm very limited in discussing such matters. And basically no one in my program was Greek except a few women. I can't think of any fraternity guys. Well two. But they both graduated.

Of course you may have an opinion. Yet because your sorority currently - or you personally - do not like the idea of *fraternity* sweethearts, or have a realistic concept of what they do, does not mean that other sororities or fraternities are not initialed to have one.

They're entitled to, certainly. I agree there. They can have them. I'm not so sure they should have them.

You may be right. However, as you pointed out, you are not familiar with the concept of chapter sweethearts. So why say something inflammatory. Hearsay does not make it reality either.

I'm only going off what you and others have told me on GC. Are you a dishonest source?

I don't really think anything I've said is inflammatory. Oh well. My participation in this thread is obviously upsetting you so I'll bow out now. I just don't see why I'm entitled to the opinion that sweethearts are a very bizarre institution, just as you are entitled to your opinion that they are an awesome one. Even if I haven't seen them firsthand--which again, I readily admit--doesn't mean I haven't read about them or am not educated about them. And it doesn't mean I'm not entitled to an opinion about them, whether or not you like it.