2007 UGA Recruitment

[jwright25]

Originally Posted by AlphaGamUGAAlum

But honestly, when you look at the number of girls, at the recruitments who disclose the information, who do get their first preference choice as their group, it really does work well. Girls matched to choice two or three are really in the minority.

I think this is a point worth emphasizing. I haven't read all of the stories from AU and UGA, so I don't know if there is a rash of GC PNMs who are getting their second or third choices. If so, they are definitely in the minority. By far.

[bejazd]

But doesn't a large number of QA's also indicate that somewhere in the the statistical end of recruitment, there are several chapters (maybe most of them) that simply kept inviting too many women to their parties (even if it was only by say 4-5?) and when they ended up having a better recruitment than they expected, these women sort of piled up and became the "mismatched." ????

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by bejazd

But doesn't a large number of QA's also indicate that somewhere in the the statistical end of recruitment, there are several chapters (maybe most of them) that simply kept inviting too many women to their parties (even if it was only by say 4-5?) and when they ended up having a better recruitment than they expected, these women sort of piled up and became the "mismatched." ????

It might, but I don't think we're talking about very many PNMs compared with the total pool.

I wouldn't think you could get it too much lower than 4 or 5 girls "extra" when you are talking about over a hundred girls at each house even for prefs without creating an equally large group of pnms who were released from the process entirely. A cut here from one group leads to a cut there for different group because that pnm because available to a different group. At the bottom of that chain is a release.

[jwright25]

Originally Posted by bejazd

But doesn't a large number of QA's also indicate that somewhere in the the statistical end of recruitment, there are several chapters (maybe most of them) that simply kept inviting too many women to their parties (even if it was only by say 4-5?) and when they ended up having a better recruitment than they expected, these women sort of piled up and became the "mismatched." ????

This is where the concept of Quota Range comes into play. Under the old matching methods, quota was set usually by the number of women attending the round before preference OR the number of women receiving preference invitations. And it rarely changed. Now that we use Quota Range, we can run quota at several different numbers and see which one achieves the greatest parity. Oftentimes that makes quota on the lower end of the range. That leaves more women unmatched. So they wind up as QAs. But the tradeoff is that more chapters make quota with women who get their first choice.

And you make a point about chapters doing better than expected. That always happens - and that's good! We want chapters to improve their operations. If the campus uses priority ranking rather than accept/regret, those situations can usually be addressed with flex lists.

The bottom line is that while there may still be quota additions, weaker chapters are pledging quota or very close.

[bejazd]

Originally Posted by jwright25

This is where the concept of Quota Range comes into play. Under the old matching methods, quota was set usually by the number of women attending the round before preference OR the number of women receiving preference invitations. And it rarely changed. Now that we use Quota Range, we can run quota at several different numbers and see which one achieves the greatest parity. Oftentimes that makes quota on the lower end of the range. That leaves more women unmatched. So they wind up as QAs. But the tradeoff is that more chapters make quota with women who get their first choice.

And you make a point about chapters doing better than expected. That always happens - and that's good! We want chapters to improve their operations. If the campus uses priority ranking rather than accept/regret, those situations can usually be addressed with flex lists.

The bottom line is that while there may still be quota additions, weaker chapters are pledging quota or very close.

Gotcha. So mathematically, probably about the same total overall # of PNMs will get bids, they'll just be spread around more evenly, with the possibility of one or two chapters pledging a very large number of QAs pretty much eliminated .

As far as the chapters go, under the new system, what incentive do they have to play fair with each other as far as sticking to their max recommended invite #?

[jwright25]

Originally Posted by bejazd

Gotcha. So mathematically, probably about the same total overall # of PNMs will get bids, they'll just be spread around more evenly, with the possibility of one or two chapters pledging a very large number of QAs pretty much eliminated.

Exactly.

Originally Posted by bejazd

As far as the chapters go, under the new system, what incentive do they have to play fair with each other as far as sticking to their max recommended invite #?

Well, the Panhellenic spirit first and foremost. If everyone espouses the "you're only as strong as your weakest link" mentality, everyone will want all chapters to succeed. There really hasn't been an issue with one chapter trying to hurt another through release figures. Additionally, if they are using ICS, the maximum number of invites is programmed into the system, and it will not allow them to exceed it. They can underinvite, but they can't overinvite. Underinviting only hurts them - and the PNMs to some extent. But it can't hurt another chapter.

[carnation]

We've had several threads on here about legacies and also what a hard time they have these days during competitive rushes. It's heartbreaking. Yes, I know that many chapters have more legacies than they have spots open but it's still heartbreaking for moms and sisters of released PNMs.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by bejazd

Gotcha. So mathematically, probably about the same total overall # of PNMs will get bids, they'll just be spread around more evenly, with the possibility of one or two chapters pledging a very large number of QAs pretty much eliminated .

As far as the chapters go, under the new system, what incentive do they have to play fair with each other as far as sticking to their max recommended invite #?

I was wondering this too. If it's only eligibility to receive girls as quota additions, it seems strange that it's motivating enough, especially since the really big chapters already only seem to get one or two. But I guess if you end up with great results, it's not a hardship.

(I'm really thinking of the middle chapters who have been so traditionally solid who have much more at stake if they cut the wrong girls; they might find themselves having to snap because they had to release so many in previous rounds. I think I might rather keep more and forgo the possibility of QAs.)

ETA: But if it's programmed in, I guess you can't.

[melongirl]

Originally Posted by jwright25

I think this is a point worth emphasizing. I haven't read all of the stories from AU and UGA, so I don't know if there is a rash of GC PNMs who are getting their second or third choices. If so, they are definitely in the minority. By far.

Here's the UGA stats

Number Of Recruits Receiving :
Preference No.
No Pref 10
1 choice 822
2 choice 93
3 choice 15





And before you ask-- i don't know what "no pref" means. Maybe they dropped out going into pref round??

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by melongirl

Here's the UGA stats

Number Of Recruits Receiving :
Preference No.
No Pref 10
1 choice 822
2 choice 93
3 choice 15





And before you ask-- i don't know what "no pref" means. Maybe they dropped out going into pref round??

I think the no pref might be the number of girls who maximized but didn't get placed as QAs.

ETA: Or I guess it could reflect snaps to girls who didn't attend prefs, since it's the list of girls matching. They matched to no one they preffed.

[cluelessUGAmom]

Originally Posted by melongirl

Here's the UGA stats

Number Of Recruits Receiving :
Preference No.
No Pref 10
1 choice 822
2 choice 93
3 choice 15





And before you ask-- i don't know what "no pref" means. Maybe they dropped out going into pref round??

Just wondering....how accurate are these results?

[melongirl]

Originally Posted by cluelessUGAmom

Just wondering....how accurate are these results?

they came straight from a report from UGA greek life, from their ICS system

I've also sent you a PM

[estherjb]

I actually talked to the recruitment advisor at our national office and she was very aware of many of the things we've discussed on this thread. She helped me understand some things about rush that were new to me. Evidently on some campuses where the "good" sororities were getting bigger and the weaker sororities were getting smaller there has been an Early Release policy instituted. As I understand it, houses who do not think there is a likelihood that a rushee will receive a bid are encouraged to release them after first round so that they will go back to other houses where they are more likely to get a bid. The idea benefits the rushee (theoretically) because she doesn't keep strong houses who aren't going to invite her back later at the expense of less popular or less known sororities who would keep her all the way through. Prefs are also weighted to allow smaller chapters to have more girls at their parties than houses who have filled quota repeatedly. This wouldn't lessen the sting of a legacy being cut after first round but the first round cut isn't the slap in the face it would have been before early release was introduced.
But a quota of 56 at a school like Georgia? Bama had quota in the 70's. Maybe the early release policy is causing more girls to drop out and by the time quota is figured the numbers are smaller.

[Speechpath]

This is true at many schools now using release figures, chapters are forced to cut more and sooner. Thus quality women may get released after first round more so than in years past. Sometimes as well, girls are nervous in first rounds (actives and pnm's) and legacies may be more nervous in their legacy house which may result in less than favorable conversation or perceived shyness.

[UGAalum94]

I suppose it's possible that a few girls might have made a stronger impression after two rounds than after one, but I honestly think that at UGA, the girls still used to drop out of rush; it was just all at once right before prefs when everyone pretty much got released by all the groups who didn't them on the bid list-- right at the same time. They saw where they were preffing and quit. (And this ended up hurting smaller groups because quota was set based of pref. invites, if I remember correctly, so it basically meant there weren't even enough girls left in the process for all the groups to make quota.)

I think there's a tendency for PNMs and parents to imagine that if a girl went back to more parties with a group, she would get a chance to shine and the groups would give her a bid.

But I don't really think that's how it ever happened at UGA.

Even before release figures, I think probably the top third of groups by what we'd call return rate today had 80-90% of their bid lists in mind based on girls they already knew from their hometowns. The middle third took about 50% girls they knew of before and 50% good candidates who they first met at recruitment. And the bottom third by return rate, might have gotten 25% girls they knew before recruitment and then had 75% of their pledge class from good candidates during rush.

My point is that even with three rounds to make an impression, I don't think that a girls real chance of pledging was ever really that much better than it is today.