South vs. North?

[banditone]

My family fought to keep all you whitey's the hell outta our country, but your smallpox infested blankets brought us down

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by banditone

My family fought to keep all you whitey's the hell outta our country, but your smallpox infested blankets brought us down

....that and whiskey.

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by banditone

My family fought to keep all you whitey's the hell outta our country, but your smallpox infested blankets brought us down

Good point

But, keep the faith!

[IvySpice]

They did believe in the words of the Declaration of Independence and the concept of consent of the governed.

No, they didn't. If they believed in the words of the Declaration of Independence (all men are created equal...endowed by their creator with inalienable rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness), then they wouldn't have owned slaves. That applies, of course, to all the slaveholders from north and south who signed (and wrote) the Declaration of Independence. Hypocrites all. Clearly, they didn't actually believe in those things; they believed in what was good for them, and they dressed up their economic and political self-interest with pretty phrases. It took a couple of hundred years for us to get close to applying the beautiful language they wrote to all the Americans it ostensibly covered.

Most of us would be very suspicious of a man who claimed to revere his Nazi ancestors solely for their dedication, sacrifice, and commitment. They were accomplices in a horrific crime against humanity that was socially acceptable at that time and place. If playing that role is forgivable when it comes to slavery, it ought to be forgivable when it comes to the Holocaust, too. Are we willing to forgive our predecessors' roles in all crimes against humanity, or only some?

[Ocalagirl]

Originally Posted by AnchorAlumna

I think Cypress Gardens no longer exists.

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

Cypress Gardens looked like it was going under, but was purchased by new investors. I think they are planning to put in rides, but keep the Belles.

Cypress Gardens was closed for a short time because the owners went backrupted (from what I heard) and sold it. The people who bought it restored it, kept the gardens, skiiers, and the Belles, and also brought in some rides. I haven't been since it reopened, but I heard its pretty cool!

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by IvySpice

Most of us would be very suspicious of a man who claimed to revere his Nazi ancestors solely for their dedication, sacrifice, and commitment. They were accomplices in a horrific crime against humanity that was socially acceptable at that time and place. If playing that role is forgivable when it comes to slavery, it ought to be forgivable when it comes to the Holocaust, too. Are we willing to forgive our predecessors' roles in all crimes against humanity, or only some?

You might rethink that statement.

[IvySpice]

You might rethink that statement.

I might, if you offered some kind of support for your apparent disagreement.

Do you have some sources showing that in Germany in 1938 it was socially unacceptable to join the SS, or that lots of Germans were ostracized by their friends and neighbors for turning people in to the Gestapo, or that ordinary people didn't dare show their faces in public after attending a pro-Hitler rally? Because if there were no negative social consequences to doing those things, then they were, by definition, socially acceptable.

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by IvySpice

I might, if you offered some kind of support for your apparent disagreement.

Do you have some sources showing that in Germany in 1938 it was socially unacceptable to join the SS, or that lots of Germans were ostracized by their friends and neighbors for turning people in to the Gestapo, or that ordinary people didn't dare show their faces in public after attending a pro-Hitler rally? Because if there were no negative social consequences to doing those things, then they were, by definition, socially acceptable.

Yeah, I do. I also just wrote a 30 page paper concerning the German Resistance to Hitler and the Third Reich. If you want some sources, let me know.

[IvySpice]

Well, sure, back it up. But I doubt you have a source showing that this was the general rule all over Germany. In many places -- particularly smaller cities like Nuremberg and in country towns -- the SS officers were the glitterati everybody wanted to associate with. Anybody who was anybody went to the rallies. That was the heartland of the Nazi base. A liberal neighborhood in Berlin =/= Germany in general.