What teachers really want to tell parents.

[carnation]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

Taping meetings is not a bad idea, because there are parents who will absolutely lie about what you said. Not many, but enough to make it worth your while to cya. And THAT is one reason so many great teachers are leaving - so much of our time is spent playing cya, instead of doing things that would directly impact the students.

My husband is behind me reading this and screaming, "YES! YES!"

[AlphaFrog]

My best friend from highschool posted this on FB. This was my reply:

As a parent, I wish more parents got this.

Remember the days when it was the STUDENT that was nervous and scared to bring home a bad note/test grade/etc and not the teacher who was scared to send it? I didn't for the most part behave well because of what the teachers would do to me...I was scared of what my parents would do to me.

I've told my daughter's teacher that I want to be told of any problems she has with Mariana. Of course, as she pointed out, it's the parents with my attitude that don't need to worry about their kids.

One final thought about the article...in the case of the parent asking the child "Is this true?", there is probably a better way to phrase it, but I'd ask my child something similar not because I didn't believe the teacher, but I would want my child to acknowledge the mistake/situation.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

One final thought about the article...in the case of the parent asking the child "Is this true?", there is probably a better way to phrase it, but I'd ask my child something similar not because I didn't believe the teacher, but I would want my child to acknowledge the mistake/situation.

Yeah, it's more like "tell me what happened today to make you get red card/timeout/note from Ms. Teacher" or something like that.

Not asking if it's true, just getting their story on what happened. Kids don't always see where something they were doing is wrong and it gives you a starting point to address it.

[katydidKD]

People generally would not disagree with a doctor or lawyer as they would with a teacher.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

The "take it as you would a lawyer or Dr's advice" thing is kind of weird just because even with those types of matters, people consult more than one Dr. or laywer all the time and it's normal.

If something a teacher says raises an eyebrow, then I would definitely talk to maybe another trusted education professional that you may know.

Ex: A friend of mine's daughter who had a teacher who labeled her as having autism and needing to be placed in the classroom with children with intensive special needs. It raised an eyebrow with her as the only delays the child had were speech related. She consulted some other specialists who tested her and determined that it was a hearing issue causing her not to speak. Not autism as the teacher strongly suggested.

So I agree that it's normal and healthy to seek out multiple opinions.

Ugh, teachers need to not diagnose. Making referrals, expressing concerns, reporting behavior/capabilities/etc are all fine, but diagnostic professionals need to diagnose. (Parents should do the same, notice behaviors, express concerns, even do research but not diagnose. And of course seek a second opinion if red flags are raised. It's just worse when the teacher as authority figure does it.)

Without being a parent or a teacher, I'm going to guess that there's some truth in both 'sides' of the story. Some parents need to listen more and defend their child less, some need to question the teacher more or seek a second opinion particularly if something doesn't seem right.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by katydidKD

People generally would not disagree with a doctor or lawyer as they would with a teacher.

This is such a broad statement it borders on the vague. Be specific and provide examples.

[IndianaSigKap]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

Yeah, it's more like "tell me what happened today to make you get red card/timeout/note from Ms. Teacher" or something like that.

Not asking if it's true, just getting their story on what happened. Kids don't always see where something they were doing is wrong and it gives you a starting point to address it.

This is so true. As a teacher, I have noticed that sometimes what one student sees as inappropriate behavior another student deems completely appropriate. In high school, I see this more and more.

Example: Student A says something to Student B that seems harmless to A. However B felt offended/ridiculed/bullied etc. Teacher intervenes and A truly has no idea that he or she has done anything wrong. But after sitting down with and talking it out, A realizes how the comments might have been hurtful.

[AGDee]

Honestly, I would take the "Is that true?" to mean "You should know better, I can't believe you did that you little monster!" sort of like "What were you thinking???" or "You DIDN'T!"
But I guess it's all about the tone of voice.

I have always been a partner, but I do have to say that my son had two teachers in elementary school who were awful. I also have to say that both were brand new grads, long term subs covering for maternity leaves. One was in first grade and my son was no angel, I freely admit. I believed everything I was told about how awful he was. Then, one day, one of the parent volunteers at the school pulled me aside and told me that Miss X was singling out my son. She said that three kids could be doing something together and my son was the only one who got screamed at and sent to the principal. It was a rough year. He also never learned to write his numbers or letters correctly because she didn't teach them that. It's hard to describe, but to watch him print or write numbers, you know it's upside down. So like, when he makes a 2, he starts at the bottom right and works up. Not life changing, but an example.

The other one was actually a student teacher who they used as a long term sub because the original long term sub had left. She had no classroom supervision and needed it. She had a bunch of active 4th graders and they would be really loud and out of control. To get their attention, she would sit at her desk and say in this meek voice "class, you need to be quiet". Contrasted with his 3rd grade teacher who would clap a pattern and the whole class would immediately stop what they were doing and clap it back.

The most frustrating was when he wasn't doing any of his work and the teacher didn't tell me until parent teacher conferences, 3 months into the school year. I would have welcomed an email home. I asked her to let me know any time he missed an assignment from that time on.

Anyway, I agree with the article in most cases. I've seen crazy parents and the type the article talks about. I did sometimes wonder if anybody (principal included) ever asked a kid what had happened when something went awry. My son bit a kid at lunch once (2nd grade). He was suspended until a parent meeting could occur with the principal. I asked him "Why did you bite Billy?" He said "Billy takes my popcorn away from me every Friday and the lunch ladies won't do anything when I tell them and I told him if he did it again I was going to bite him" Billy did get in trouble too, once the story was out, and Billy never tried to steal my son's popcorn again!

His second grade teacher was great and recognized that my son could NOT handle centers. He did great when everybody was sitting at their desks getting instruction or doing work but as soon as centers started, he was everywhere. He couldn't handle the lack of structure. He still doesn't like lack of structure. Thankfully, she let him do his "centers" work in the hallway so he didn't have to cope with the chaos.

All that said, I knew my son wasn't angel. Now though? All I hear from teachers is "He's such a nice, polite young man". Phew! And my ex always says "Are you sure you're talking about our son???" Makes me want to kick him! LOL

[SWTXBelle]

The whole "Well, we're only getting the teacher's side; we should get parents, too and then find out what is REALLY happening" thing reminds me of those who say "Well, it takes two to divorce". No. It takes two to make a marriage WORK; one ass can destroy a marriage.

You did get a parents' perspective. I am the mother of 4 in addition to being a teacher so -ta da! There you go. The difference is that as a parent you only know what your child tells you; you are not THERE at the school seeing what happens. A parent is not in a position equal to the teacher in terms of 1.) seeing the bigger picture of class and school dynamics and 2.) actually BEING THERE. It does make a difference. One also hopes that teachers have the benefit of their education. Yes, you may disagree with a doctor, but if you discount out of hand what his/her experience and training bring to his/her evaluation you do yourself a disservice. You don't go to webMD and decide you know better; you go to another doctor. If you cannot resolve the problem with the teacher, you to to the administration. If they can't resolve it, you change teachers or change schools. You may chose to home school. I've done all of the above.

While there are indeed awful teachers who are a disgrace to the profession and who should be FIRED they are the minority. As I noted before, the entitlement being addressed in the article is something we see manifest right here on Greek Chat - why would you think that the same heliparents who are here giving sororities and their members hell wouldn't do the same to the teachers of their children?

eta - And the attitude being expressed by some on this thread to teachers? Absolutely what the article is addressing. Teachers are not the enemy.

[katydidKD]

Generally. There are of course people who disagree with doctors and get second opinions, but straight up telling a doctor "you're wrong" is less likely than one would to a teacher. Same for lawyers, but that is a whole different beast. Thats as detailed as I'll get. If you disagree, I don't care.

ETA: Yes. Heliparents are a problem. I am so glad my mother/father were far from that

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

Teacher - adult
student - child

Teachers can be wrong, but the odds of you being called in for something a teacher isn't 100% sure about are pretty slim - parental meetings are a major pain, requiring paperwork, dealing with the administration, not to mention the stress. 99% of teachers aren't going to go through the hassle if it isn't a serious problem, and if they don't know what they saw. You as a parent should have already talked to your child about the incident/behavior before you go into the meeting. If you were meeting with me, your child would not be at the meeting. Parents need to partner with teachers, not regard them as the enemy.

The problem isn't parents who listen to their children and come in willing to hear the teacher; the problem is the parents who will not even entertain the idea that their little snowflake could do anything wrong. The problem is parents who come in openly hostile. You think our pretty princess entitled pnms come out of nowhere? Those apples aren't falling far from the trees.

Exactly! And we've all come across these parents.. the ones who won't say a word while their kids climb all over the seats at restaurants or kick the seats on an airplane (I believe there's an entire thread somewhere talking about this exact thing), the ones who wouldn't discipline their kids even if their lives depended on it, and the ones who view everyone who tells their kids to behave as being in the wrong.

This article doesn't say that all parents are crazy and ridiculous.. only that there are a large number of them who don't understand that teachers have to deal with their kids for most of the day.

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

I would also add - if you are not sure about the details, ASK. Also, it's nice if the parent will acknowledge the behavior is wrong. Parent - "Throwing things and not obeying the teacher is unacceptable. Is there any particular time when he throws things, or is he throwing them at someone?" - Teacher - "He does it towards the end of class and he throws them at Billy." Parent - "I will speak to him and make sure he understands he is not to throw anything. He did tell me he finishes his projects early - maybe if he can be given some clean-up duties to help you, or an extra project that will keep him busy. Can you move him so he will not be sitting near Billy?"

THIS!!!!!

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

Ex: A friend of mine's daughter who had a teacher who labeled her as having autism and needing to be placed in the classroom with children with intensive special needs. It raised an eyebrow with her as the only delays the child had were speech related. She consulted some other specialists who tested her and determined that it was a hearing issue causing her not to speak. Not autism as the teacher strongly suggested.

So I agree that it's normal and healthy to seek out multiple opinions.

Medical diagnoses are a completely different thing. This definitely deserves a second (and possibly third) opinion.

And in response to a part of the article:

And parents, you know, it's OK for your child to get in trouble sometimes. It builds character and teaches life lessons. As teachers, we are vexed by those parents who stand in the way of those lessons; we call them helicopter parents because they want to swoop in and save their child every time something goes wrong. If we give a child a 79 on a project, then that is what the child deserves. Don't set up a time to meet with me to negotiate extra credit for an 80. It's a 79, regardless of whether you think it should be a B+.
This one may be hard to accept, but you shouldn't assume that because your child makes straight A's that he/she is getting a good education. The truth is, a lot of times it's the bad teachers who give the easiest grades, because they know by giving good grades everyone will leave them alone. Parents will say, "My child has a great teacher! He made all A's this year!"
Wow. Come on now. In all honesty, it's usually the best teachers who are giving the lowest grades, because they are raising expectations. Yet, when your children receive low scores you want to complain and head to the principal's office.
Please, take a step back and get a good look at the landscape. Before you challenge those low grades you feel the teacher has "given" your child, you might need to realize your child "earned" those grades and that the teacher you are complaining about is actually the one that is providing the best education.

I'm not saying that all teachers who give high grades are bad teachers, or the ones who give low grades are great teachers, but...

The best teacher I had was my 5th grade teacher. While many of my fellow 5th-graders were excited because they had the "easy" teacher, the rest of us struggled (and I use that term loosely now) through the year. Looking back, however, even just a year or two after that, I realized that there's a reason to be a bit harder on students. Thinking that every student is a precious snowflake, and should be handed every little thing in life, in many situations, sets them up for disaster.

[Drolefille]

eta - And the attitude being expressed by some on this thread to teachers? Absolutely what the article is addressing. Teachers are not the enemy.

Where is that attitude in this thread? Because I just reskimmed the whole thread and found no one unilaterally talking smack about teachers and pretty much everyone agrees to some extent with the premise, just disagrees about the tone, or the degree of the article/conversation.

So... please cite your references SWTXBelle.

Also, you want cookies for being both teacher and a parent? There's no way that your views as a parent are influenced by your role as a teacher, right?

[Just interested]

I enjoyed the article. As a an educator for 38 years I've seen a little bit of everything.

Kids are kids and are pretty much the same as they were 1st day I stepped in the classroom until the day I retired.
Parents, however, and their attitudes toward their children have changed and this worries me. Parents need to allow their children to fail, not always be 1st, not always win a prize and use this as a teachable moment. How to deal with the disappointments that come about with just living. Time will tell what will happen to these kids as they become adults but I see major disappointment about life in general.
I have a good friend who is an assistant dean at a major university and she shared with me about the rise in parents actually contacting her about their "child's" grades at the college level and even challenging their admission to the graduate programs.

Just my 2cents

[BetteDavisEyes]

Originally Posted by Just interested

Parents need to allow their children to fail, not always be 1st, not always win a prize and use this as a teachable moment. How to deal with the disappointments that come about with just living. Time will tell what will happen to these kids as they become adults but I see major disappointment about life in general.

In my classroom, students earn incentives for good behavior, perfect attendance & returning homework completed for a certain number of weeks in a row. I have a class treasure box that the kids can choose a prize from when they've earned their rewards. Many times I've gotten angry emails, letters and calls from parents furious because their child did not get one of the prizes in my class. From Day 1, I have told parents what my expectations are. I went over them again during Back to School Night. I am rapidly learning that many parents want their snowflake to be the exception to my rules. I don't think so. They can complain and whine to the principal all they want but I'm not changing my rules and expecations for anyone.

These helicopter parents need to get a clue. They want their kid to earn rewards without actually doing the work needed to earn them in the first place.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by Just interested

and even challenging their admission to the graduate programs.

Just my 2cents

I've HEARD of heli-parenting extending beyond undergrad, but I thought this was just myth? This really happens?

Like, there is a such thing as a law school/med school heli-mom?

I really don't know what I'd do if a grad school classmate told me "Yeah Dr. Whatever wasn't going to let me into that section of Special Ed Research, but my mom called and she got him to let me in."