Your thoughts on AI: discussion goes here.

[UGAalum94]

SydneyK,

Believe it or not, my interest in preserving the AI forum is simply because I don't think we should try to limit the speech or writing of other people unless it falls into certain clearly defined catagories.

For GreekChat those catagories seem to be the TOS, GLO ritual, and GLO policies that may not technically be ritual but are private none the less. I suppose the owner of GreekChat could add others at any time he felt it appropriate.

It appears to me that when a smallish group of posters lost the ability to snark at will in the AI forum, they began to ask for the forum to be shut down.

They retroactively seem to want to apply a standard to the AI forum that isn't in play in any other area of GreekChat. (ie, Only stuff that's on official webpage, only stuff that's not on official webpages, etc)

If the forum owner and the moderators get rid of the AI forum, it won't really represent a personal loss to me or anything. My group has some information about AI that can presently be found online places other than GreekChat, and my group's AI is only open to women invited by members of the group. I don't have any strong feelings about AI discussion on GreekChat partially because I don't think it really matters in terms of how GLOs function in real life.

I do think it's nice to have a forum for AI women to describe how the were able to become members. I don't mean of the "I shopped around and this one took me" variety. I mean the stories of the women that the GLOs sought out or the stories of the women who were pledges but had to drop and then were finally initiated through AI. These stories are inspirational and remind some of us who aren't super-involved as alums that our service to the organization is still important, important enough that some people join simply to serve as alumnae.

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by chitownxo

Tom, the vast majority of us are not "anti-AI". Many of us are "anti" discussing the process because we believe it contains ritual information (i.e. membership selection). There are others on this board who believe the AI process is NOT ritual. Therein lays the debate. My position is that as my organization does not publicize our AI process, neither will I, as I will respect the wishes of my organization.

I don't believe I've read any posts that disparage sisters who have joined organizations via AI. If there are posts of this sort on GC, I've missed them.

Sorry, but there have been toward some such as ZTA and DDD AI members who have voiced their oppinion.

Thank you for posting that are not anti AI, but from what I read, that is in error. There is a listing of AI's who are Anti, but they are now Sisters of said GLO.

What amazed me in reading some posts there are those who feel that AI's are not real Sisters?

When We have an AI, and that persone goes through Our Ritual, they are given Numbers which means they are Members of Our GLO. Period.

When people say they despise AI because they are shopping, well, my question is always, what is Undergraduate Rushing?

It is a person who is trying to find a GLO that they feel comfortable with and this includes both sides.

I have seen so many AIs who have become Members and are very productive
and then are not seen in the same eyes of those that go through the Undergrade Recruitment.

These women sweat blood, time and effort to become Members of a GLO!

Then, some seem to take it upon themselves to say they are not as good?

Yes, My Fraternity has had AIs and they have been very produtive as the Ladies have been.

Give them credit.

Okay, there are Some/Many GLOs who want to profess no, no, no, but still do, do, do?

That is fine.

But there seems to be a contengent who want to say Oh, No!

[chitownxo]

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

Sorry, but there have been toward some such as ZTA and DDD AI members who have voiced their oppinion.I think you can chalk at least one of those to a personality conflict.

Thank you for posting that are not anti AI, but from what I read, that is in error. There is a listing of AI's who are Anti, but they are now Sisters of said GLO. From what I've read, I believe they are not "anti-AI" but are against speaking of the process due to some of the things that have taken place on this board and IRL. It's their perogative. You don't have to like it, but you should respect their opinion.

What amazed me in reading some posts there are those who feel that AI's are not real Sisters:I have not seen those posts. I can only speak for myself and my feelings; members of Chi Omega who are in good standing with our national office are my sisters, regardless of how they joined.

When We have an AI, and that persone goes through Our Ritual, they are given Numbers which means they are Members of Our GLO. Period.As I, and others, have stated before, membership selection is ritual for sororities. I do not know what specific fraternities consider ritual, just as you don't know what we consider ritual.

When people say they despise AI because they are shopping, well, my question is always, what is Undergraduate Rushing? Undergraduate recruitment is not the same thing. There is a separate process for undergraduate intake based on mutually recognized agreements between the 26 NPC sororities. There is no, to my knowledge, agreement between the sisterhoods regarding AI. Each group does their own separate PRIVATE process.

It is a person who is trying to find a GLO that they feel comfortable with and this includes both sides.

I have seen so many AIs who have become Members and are very productive
and then are not seen in the same eyes of those that go through the Undergrade Recruitment. These women sweat blood, time and effort to become Members of a GLO! I would agree that AI's are and should be afforded respect from their specific GLOs.

Then, some seem to take it upon themselves to say they are not as good?

Yes, My Fraternity has had AIs and they have been very produtive as the Ladies have been.That's fine Tom, but that's not the issue here. You are not discussing how to AI into LXA; why should we discuss how to AI into a sorority?

Give them credit.

I try to respect all of my sisters, and everyone on the board[COLOR="indigo"]

[adpiucf]

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

Sorry, but there have been toward some such as ZTA and DDD AI members who have voiced their oppinion.

If you're referring to Blueangel as the ZTA AI who has been greviously wronged, it has nothing to do with her being an AI and everything to do with the way she conducts herself on these boards. If you are referring to Bichonl as the DDD AI who has been questioned for sorority shopping, members were pointing out their displeasure with AI sorority shopping.

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

Thank you for posting that are not anti AI, but from what I read, that is in error. There is a listing of AI's who are Anti, but they are now Sisters of said GLO.

Tom, I don't think you have read comprehensively. I say this because the thread in question asks members if they are pro/con regarding the continued existence of an AI Forum on Greek Chat.

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

What amazed me in reading some posts there are those who feel that AI's are not real Sisters?

Again, this may lie in a reading comprehension issue. IRL and online, quite the contrary. I'm not sure where you're getting this information, but it is completely inaccurate and you're just spreading misinformation.

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

When We have an AI, and that persone goes through Our Ritual, they are given Numbers which means they are Members of Our GLO. Period.

That is wonderful!

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

When people say they despise AI because they are shopping, well, my question is always, what is Undergraduate Rushing?

Newsflash: AI is not recruitment. Our sororities exist for the purpose of undergraduate membership. Undergraduate recruitment is the appropriate forum to join a sorority and meet multiple sororities to determine a mutual selection. I am sure you are already familiar with that process. AI is meant for those who have a connection to the sorority and are invited to join based on their association with the organization.

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

It is a person who is trying to find a GLO that they feel comfortable with and this includes both sides.

An AI is invited to join based on her existing connection, not her blind bid to get a contact and attend alumnae events and "rush" an alumnae chapter. This is not the way 99.9% of us do things. I can't speak for your fraternity; perhaps you hold open alumni recruitment? This is the not the way NPC sororities conduct AI.

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

I have seen so many AIs who have become Members and are very productive
and then are not seen in the same eyes of those that go through the Undergrade Recruitment.

I'm sorry you may have observed this, but given the miscomprehension regarding prior posts and threads, perhaps you were also mistaken about this observance?

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

These women sweat blood, time and effort to become Members of a GLO!

Indeed, they do! And we are grateful and indebted to all of our members who participate in sorority events, regardless of when and how they gained membership. Once a sister, always a sister. How she came to be a sister is irrelevant.

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

Then, some seem to take it upon themselves to say they are not as good?

Yes, My Fraternity has had AIs and they have been very produtive as the Ladies have been.

Give them credit.

Okay, there are Some/Many GLOs who want to profess no, no, no, but still do, do, do?

That is fine.

But there seems to be a contengent who want to say Oh, No!

I have no idea what any of this statement means, but I don't believe you comprehend what you read, or you are purposely stirring the pot for your own amusement.

Tom, AI is not recruitment and it is an honor bestowed upon a small few based on their connection or service to the organization. It isn't publicized precisely because it is not recruitment. Once an AI member joins, she is a welcomed sister into our organizations. I hope you will read this paragraph several times so you comprehend fully what NPC AI is and cease with your hateful threads that spout nothing but lies and misinformation. Thanks.

[blueangel]

If you're referring to Blueangel as the ZTA AI who has been greviously wronged, it has nothing to do with her being an AI and everything to do with the way she conducts herself on these boards.

You mean standing up to the bully brigade on Greek Chat?



I should be ashamed!

[adpiucf]

I never said any of those things, blueangel. Right or wrong, the fact remains that many Greek Chat members don't like you. Stating such is not a TOS violation or a personal attack, just a point of information. How you choose to conduct yourself on Greek Chat isn't my concern. I was responding to Tom's allegation.

[AGDee]

If anybody has questions about an organization's policies regarding AI (or anything else for that matter.. like if new members can wear letters, have to return letters if they aren't initiated, etc), then they should be referred to their headquarters/officers/volunteers who know the definitive answers. Even if one of those people post on this board, they are less likely to post policy in an open forum like this. Few posters on GC are qualified to give out this information and ensure accuracy.

[Drolefille]

I agree that private information and particularly ritual information should be kept private. However I feel the focus on here is wrong. Someone ASKING about the requirements for AI should be told to contact the GLO, yes. But we shouldn't get mad at the askers. We should get mad at people who tell the private information.

It seems that more AI threads get ruined by active GC members then by crazy PNAIs. (Not that there aren't both) I don't know why sensible modding and some discretion on the part of the sorority members couldn't solve most of the AI problems. And as for the crazies, their lack discretion will directly affect their AI process. Thus letting that particular problem solve itself.

[texas*princess]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

SydneyK,

Believe it or not, my interest in preserving the AI forum is simply because I don't think we should try to limit the speech or writing of other people unless it falls into certain clearly defined catagories.

For GreekChat those catagories seem to be the TOS, GLO ritual, and GLO policies that may not technically be ritual but are private none the less. I suppose the owner of GreekChat could add others at any time he felt it appropriate.


Please note the words you typed that I highlighted in red. Membership selection is private. Private information should not be broadcasted.

If a sorority wishes to broadcast their AI policy via their website, or flyers mailed to every unaffiliated woman in the U.S., then so be it. That is what the HQ wishes to do.

Many NPCs took AI information down from their public publications.


It appears to me that when a smallish group of posters lost the ability to snark at will in the AI forum, they began to ask for the forum to be shut down.

They retroactively seem to want to apply a standard to the AI forum that isn't in play in any other area of GreekChat. (ie, Only stuff that's on official webpage, only stuff that's not on official webpages, etc)


If information that was previously public, is no longer public information, why again should it be on GC? If the sorority used to make flyers and posted them along every street corner announcing their AI policy, they did so to share that information. If they take fliers down, they no longer wish to share that information.

If the forum owner and the moderators get rid of the AI forum, it won't really represent a personal loss to me or anything. My group has some information about AI that can presently be found online places other than GreekChat, and my group's AI is only open to women invited by members of the group. I don't have any strong feelings about AI discussion on GreekChat partially because I don't think it really matters in terms of how GLOs function in real life.

I do think it's nice to have a forum for AI women to describe how the were able to become members. I don't mean of the "I shopped around and this one took me" variety. I mean the stories of the women that the GLOs sought out or the stories of the women who were pledges but had to drop and then were finally initiated through AI. These stories are inspirational and remind some of us who aren't super-involved as alums that our service to the organization is still important, important enough that some people join simply to serve as alumnae.

I agree that it is nice to have a place to share how they became sisters of ABC. Why not do that in the GLO forum?

Since I've been on GC, very few AI stories started out with the "I pledged QRS when I was in college but I couldn't initaite because I had a family emergency and had to drop out of college for the year" or "I always helped out the Alpha Beta chapter of DEF because their philanthropy was dear to my heart and was so excited when they surprised me with an invitation to join".

The majority of them start out with "So I was reading these boards and am so excited that AI is possible because I didn't know about it before!!! I've contacted 10 NPC sororities and will name them after the characters on Laguna Beach and let you know who finally takes me!!!!"

...

[BaylorBean]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

Believe it or not, my interest in preserving the AI forum is simply because I don't think we should try to limit the speech or writing of other people unless it falls into certain clearly defined catagories.

For GreekChat those catagories seem to be the TOS, GLO ritual, and GLO policies that may not technically be ritual but are private none the less. I suppose the owner of GreekChat could add others at any time he felt it appropriate.

I think you finally touched on why this is being discussed in the first place. That is the EXACT catagory that many of us feel AI falls into and hence should not be freely discussed.

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by adpiucf

If you're referring to Blueangel as the ZTA AI who has been greviously wronged, it has nothing to do with her being an AI and everything to do with the way she conducts herself on these boards. If you are referring to Bichonl as the DDD AI who has been questioned for sorority shopping, members were pointing out their displeasure with AI sorority shopping.

Tom, I don't think you have read comprehensively. I say this because the thread in question asks members if they are pro/con regarding the continued existence of an AI Forum on Greek Chat.

Again, this may lie in a reading comprehension issue. IRL and online, quite the contrary. I'm not sure where you're getting this information, but it is completely inaccurate and you're just spreading misinformation.

That is wonderful!

Newsflash: AI is not recruitment. Our sororities exist for the purpose of undergraduate membership. Undergraduate recruitment is the appropriate forum to join a sorority and meet multiple sororities to determine a mutual selection. I am sure you are already familiar with that process. AI is meant for those who have a connection to the sorority and are invited to join based on their association with the organization.

An AI is invited to join based on her existing connection, not her blind bid to get a contact and attend alumnae events and "rush" an alumnae chapter. This is not the way 99.9% of us do things. I can't speak for your fraternity; perhaps you hold open alumni recruitment? This is the not the way NPC sororities conduct AI.

I'm sorry you may have observed this, but given the miscomprehension regarding prior posts and threads, perhaps you were also mistaken about this observance?

Indeed, they do! And we are grateful and indebted to all of our members who participate in sorority events, regardless of when and how they gained membership. Once a sister, always a sister. How she came to be a sister is irrelevant.

I have no idea what any of this statement means, but I don't believe you comprehend what you read, or you are purposely stirring the pot for your own amusement.

Tom, AI is not recruitment and it is an honor bestowed upon a small few based on their connection or service to the organization. It isn't publicized precisely because it is not recruitment. Once an AI member joins, she is a welcomed sister into our organizations. I hope you will read this paragraph several times so you comprehend fully what NPC AI is and cease with your hateful threads that spout nothing but lies and misinformation. Thanks.

Thank You for posting this and your responses.

You may have posted responses to mine, I never said it was an actual Recruitment, I was just trying to get an explanation of the difference, Some said it was a Ritual thing? Well, it isnt is it?

It is a form of bringing women into Females GOLs in one form or another.

Whether it is through Undergard or AI is the question.

It does happen and many can see it from the Fine Women/Ladies who have AIed and are Proud Members of those GLOs.

Now, do you want to argue that point?

They are not good enough because they are AI?


adpiucf, in reference to a last post to and by you, who has anymore right to post than a Member of GC and a Member of a GLO!

So, in many eyes, blueangel is a BITCH, why is it more so than some others?

I did not delete her birthday wish thread or post snarky posts!

I PMed her instead!

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

I agree that private information and particularly ritual information should be kept private. However I feel the focus on here is wrong. Someone ASKING about the requirements for AI should be told to contact the GLO, yes. But we shouldn't get mad at the askers. We should get mad at people who tell the private information.

It seems that more AI threads get ruined by active GC members then by crazy PNAIs. (Not that there aren't both) I don't know why sensible modding and some discretion on the part of the sorority members couldn't solve most of the AI problems. And as for the crazies, their lack discretion will directly affect their AI process. Thus letting that particular problem solve itself.

I think the problem is, the answer is different depending on the GLO. For some GLOs, contacting the GLO is the absolute WRONG thing to do. The mods can't be expected to know the AI policies for all the groups either and shouldn't speak for other groups.

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by AGDee

I think the problem is, the answer is different depending on the GLO. For some GLOs, contacting the GLO is the absolute WRONG thing to do. The mods can't be expected to know the AI policies for all the groups either and shouldn't speak for other groups.

Yes it is! I tried to get the information straight and post it!

But, thank goodness it has been changed to other MODS!

Oh, MODs who are doing their best!

Are They getting assistance, NO!

[UGAalum94]

AGDee, you are almost certainly correct, but that doesn't seem to be how GreekChat works. If that were the policy of the site (or of our group) , I'd be prepared to honor it, but it doesn't seem to be the rule here.

[I'm not sure I would draw the line about what need to be referred to IHQ the same place you would, but I see your point that the best way to get accurate answers is to ask people authorized to speak officially.]

I think AI policies vary and the level of secrecy varies. I don't think a blanket ban is needed. Alpha Gam has some very rudimentary policy info. online that can be accessed by non-members. If someone asked for that info. I don't think that it would be wrong to answer them. (which as I've said several times before, doesn't mean that I personally would answer)

Nobody can make you answer a question from a letter shopper. Don't try to put all the blame on them for asking, and suggest that Greek women need to be protected for being asked. Follow the policies of your own group, and all will be well.

[chitownxo]

[QUOTE=Tom Earp;1335502]Thank You for posting this and your responses.

You may have posted responses to mine, I never said it was an actual Recruitment, I was just trying to get an explanation of the difference, Some said it was a Ritual thing? Well, it isnt is it?In many peoples' eyes, all forms of intake are ritual, which is not to be discussed by outsiders. Fraternities may not consider membership selection ritual, but many sororities do.

It is a form of bringing women into Females GOLs in one form or another.Two distinct forms. I'll say it again; recruitment of undergrads is not the same thing as AI. They are two different processes. As there is no mutual agreement between the 26 NPC sororities on how to conduct AI (as there is in undergraduate recruitment), each group has their own distinct process.

Whether it is through Undergard or AI is the question.

It does happen and many can see it from the Fine Women/Ladies who have AIed and are Proud Members of those GLOs.

Now, do you want to argue that point?

They are not good enough because they are AI? No one is saying they aren't good enough. People can have personality conflicts with some people on this board and not like them without saying their sisterhood experience is tainted because they've gone through the AI process.


QUOTE]