Obama scoring points with rural voters...

[shinerbock]

"You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."

I suspect many will take this as condescending. Perhaps it will get interesting

[EE-BO]

Well, the Harvard graduate liberal elitist has finally come out. So much for change and hope.

This is more than condescending. This is a pretty direct statement accusing people of turning to racism and violence. The religion reference is amusing as well. I expect there are not many churches preaching as much hate, racism and ignorance as Barack's.

Do you think this will matter too much though? Even if Hillary wins, her winning the nomination just seems impossible at this point.

Did you see this on Fox News? That is where I caught it. I did not notice it on CNN, my local channels or MSNBC. I am not sure if it is being given the same level of coverage as snafus from the other leading candidates have been...

[macallan25]

But bro....it's all about chaaaange man. It's all about hoooope........

[jen0830]

You are right, the news media will do anything to get him elected. I work in the entertainment industry in LA, which is the Land of the Pod People.

They are always chanting, “OBAMA GOOD” “OTHERS BAD”.

The news will cover and air the opening of a local car dealership before putting anything on the air that is truthful, yet may be negative, about “HIS HOLY HIGHNESS”. His speeches continue to reveal his (lack of) character:

Condescending. Yes,
Obnoxious. Absolutely
Hypocrite. Ah, that’s an affirmative

Let's face it; he's a well-dressed phony, who’s bamboozled the fools who think he wants to help anybody but himself.

I can’t wait to hear from the “Yada Yada Obama” Cultists.
It’s so predictable.

“It was taken out of context”, “10 second sound bytes”, “Racism!” “What about the others and what they said?” “You only listen to Fox News” “It’s just not FAIR!”

P.S. He actually had the audacity to say, "We cling to God?" He wants us to cling to him as the supreme power for ch...ch....changes?
AUAUUUU, there's some karma! I will take "GOD" "SPIRIT" "UNIVERSAL LOVING", "HIGHER POWER" "UNIVERSAL CONSCIOUSNESS" (remember I live in LA), any day, over him as my god.

[DaemonSeid]

Wait....so what part did he say wasn't true?

The cut in aid given to small towns and farmers part or the antipathy part?


25 years huh:


Hmmmmm....

Let's see if I remember coorectly , Reagan made cuts waaaay back in 1985, one that his Argicultural secretary John Block supported saying that farmers made it this long without govt support, and they can continue.


Anyone remember a small concert called Farm Aid?

George H while not adding taxes raised the existing taxes

Bill Clinton while not as swift to take more money from farmers did hop on the NAFTA train and many jobs got outsourced.

George W. has been cutting agricultural spending since 2000 and in 2005 cut well over 3 billion dollars from farmers' pocket.


maybe it's just me, but I think that if I was in those folks' shoes, I would be a bit salty also come election time....

The above is the short version....

Obama an Ivy league (Harvard) elitist??

And I guess the fact that George Bush Sr and Jr along with Bill Clinton having ties with Yale and Oxford means they went to 'less elitist' schools...


maybe that's what this is all about... Harvard vs Yale for the Big House FTW.

hehe.....and so it goes.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Wait....so what part did he say wasn't true?

The cut in aid given to small towns and farmers part or the antipathy part?


25 years huh:


Hmmmmm....

Let's see if I remember coorectly , Reagan made cuts waaaay back in 1985, one that his Argicultural secretary John Block supported saying that farmers made it this long without govt support, and they can continue.


Anyone remember a small concert called Farm Aid?

George H while not raising taxes added taxes

Bill Clinton while not as swift to take more money from farmers did hop on the NAFTA train and many jobs got outsourced.

George W. has been cutting agricultural spending since 2000 and in 2005 cut well over 3 billion dollars from farmers' pocket.


maybe it's just me, but I think that if I was in those folks' shoes, I would be a bit salty also come election time....

The above is the short version....

Obama an Ivy league (Harvard) elitist??

And I guess the fact that George Bush Sr and Jr along with Bill Clinton having ties with Yale and Oxford means they went to 'less elitist' schools...


maybe that's what this is all about... Harvard vs Yale for the Big House FTW.

hehe.....and so it goes.

The part that "isn't true" is that he attributes people's feelings on issues to economic circumstances and being bitter, which might be what good hearted liberals want to think about poor people who don't share their values, but may not actually be the case. They may "cling" to their guns because they think the 2nd amendment is a big deal and they may not trust the government to know best. It might not have anything to do with factories closing down or cuts in Farm spending.

ETA: did you actually read the comment for yourself? I may be wrong, but I don't think anyone is fired up about the idea that economically these voters aren't in good shape, and yet your response seems to be about proving that the gov't hasn't been good to them. The problem is that the people that Obama is talking about are never going to see themselves as bitter about what the government failed to deliver economically. They probably don't see themselves are wanting a handout.

[skylark]

Heaven forbid we have a President who thinks we are all intelligent adults enough to comprehend a semi-controversial idea. Heaven forbid we have a President who actually cares about figuring out what the origins and causes of our problems (like hatred) are. Heaven forbid we have a President who thinks America can handle hearing the truth and isn't afraid to be the one to share it.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by skylark

Heaven forbid we have a President who thinks we are all intelligent adults enough to comprehend a semi-controversial idea. Heaven forbid we have a President who actually cares about figuring out what the origins and causes of our problems (like hatred) are. Heaven forbid we have a President who thinks America can handle hearing the truth and isn't afraid to be the one to share it.

An independantly thinking president who will challenge the American people to look at themselves in a moment of introspection????
A compassionate president?


uh oh!

[shinerbock]

You're right. Heaven forbid.

Heaven forbid we have a President intent on autonomy-stripping. God forbid we have a POTUS who looks to people holding on to their religion and says "well if we can fix these problems for these people, they can abandon that once and for all." One who looks at those who value the right to self-defense and says "If we can improve their living status, then we can go get those guns." One who looks at rural Americans and goes, "Why don't they vote in their self-interest, how could anyone possibly favor what is best for the country over what is best for them individually?"

Obama supporters are the same type who bitch and whine about the Bush administration destroying individual civil rights, and then turn around and proclaim with broad paternalism that we, the liberal ivory-tower elitists who are less likely to serve in the military, less likely to do blue collar work that constitutes the backbone of the country, are the ones who know what is best for you. They look at southerners as morons because they think family values are more important than increased entitlement programs that they could benefit from. If only they'll listen to us, we can get rid of relics of the past like religion, pride, patriotism, and family.

Heaven forbid, indeed.

[EE-BO]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

God forbid we have a POTUS who looks to people holding on to their religion and says "well if we can fix these problems for these people, they can abandon that once and for all."

This is exactly what is most wrong with Obama's comment. It is the extreme far left position that thinks government should be the ultimate authority in people's lives because big government is the best solution.

On the face of it, I found his remark insulting and condescending- but the greater matter here is that this, along with his recent interview on CNBC where he finally discussed his economic plan, is one more indication that Obama is very far left of where the nation is as a whole, and that his ideas are not all that new.

BigRedBeta- I certainly agree that industrial communities in the Northeast and elsewhere are in a very bad way, and I would imagine there are a lot of bitter people out there. It is not just about job loss either. With consolidation and many companies going out of business, pensions have been lost for many too.

But it is a big stretch to suggest that such bitterness drives people to religion, guns etc.

I think this is very bad news for the general election. Centrism is the order of the day. Bill Clinton was a true centrist and that is one reason he accomplished a lot of important things- including some things that the far left of his own party were not too thrilled about (welfare reform.)

Bush won on the promise he would also be a centrist- and we know how that came out. Early on in his Presidency, Bush actually spoke about the possibility of permitting same-sex unions- but that disappeared quick. He eventually caved in to the party line and a lot of the progressive social agenda he spoke about early on evaporated entirely.

And now, despite the rantings and ravings of the far right of the Republican Party- we have another true centrist as the nominee, John McCain.

I think Hillary is very smart and very flexible. I could see her working both sides to get things done.

I just don't see that with Obama- and I think that is why he has no chance of winning the White House. This comment we are talking about is just one more piece of evidence about the true practical philosophy of someone who has been talking up to now on very high level intangible matters.

[shinerbock]

I'm not offended by Obama's comments, for myself or on behalf of anyone else.

I do think it reinforces how I feel about him, however. I think he is a liberal elitist who thinks that the government knows better than the individual when it comes to spending money, protecting our families and raising our children.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by skylark

Heaven forbid we have a President who thinks we are all intelligent adults enough to comprehend a semi-controversial idea. Heaven forbid we have a President who actually cares about figuring out what the origins and causes of our problems (like hatred) are. Heaven forbid we have a President who thinks America can handle hearing the truth and isn't afraid to be the one to share it.

But what if it isn't the truth or a very accurate description of what people believe and why they believe it? Then he's just revealed how out of touch and offensive he is to a segment of the electorate.

If Obama had want to have an open discussion with rural voters about the issues, he could have done that; instead we get reports of comments he made about these voters to a relatively disconnected group of affluent campaign contributers across the country who, in contrast with your take that he was opening the discussion, were likely to be in agreement with the "wisdom" he advanced.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by skylark

Heaven forbid we have a President who thinks we are all intelligent adults enough to comprehend a semi-controversial idea. Heaven forbid we have a President who actually cares about figuring out what the origins and causes of our problems (like hatred) are. Heaven forbid we have a President who thinks America can handle hearing the truth and isn't afraid to be the one to share it.

Whoa, wait - the "truth" is that rural people are racist (or zealots, or violent, or..) because of the actions of the government? (I realize this is a gross oversimplification, but so was the original statement, to be quite honest)

Like . . . I can't decide which half of that sentence intelligent adults would prefer to reject first when handling this "semi-controversial" idea.

Instead of figuring out the cause of a legitimate problem (such as hatred), this appears to be a smear campaign that both pigeonholes the problem to a very small subsection of the population and conveniently washes his hands of the problem by blaming nebulous actions of others. Whoever wrote this for him is likely already fired, but the shitcanning should be redoubled - this exact statement just doesn't say what it's supposed to. It doesn't seem like an honest appraisal, but rather a pandering gloss-over.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Whoa, wait - the "truth" is that rural people are racist (or zealots, or violent, or..) because of the actions of the government? (I realize this is a gross oversimplification, but so was the original statement, to be quite honest)

Like . . . I can't decide which half of that sentence intelligent adults would prefer to reject first when handling this "semi-controversial" idea.

Instead of figuring out the cause of a legitimate problem (such as hatred), this appears to be a smear campaign that both pigeonholes the problem to a very small subsection of the population and conveniently washes his hands of the problem by blaming nebulous actions of others. Whoever wrote this for him is likely already fired, but the shitcanning should be redoubled - this exact statement just doesn't say what it's supposed to. It doesn't seem like an honest appraisal, but rather a pandering gloss-over.

But the worst part is that it doesn't seem like it was written for him, but rather something that he said that he might actually believe, indicating that he's truly more of a panderer that maybe I'd hoped.

[skylark]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Whoa, wait - the "truth" is that rural people are racist (or zealots, or violent, or..) because of the actions of the government? (I realize this is a gross oversimplification, but so was the original statement, to be quite honest)

I said "causes." As in one of many (see my last post on this, as well). I think you're the one oversimplifying if you think that's what either I or Obama meant.

And I stand by it as one cause. I've talked to many people that when something like affirmative action, sexual harassment, environmentalism, etc. comes up, these people talk in a way that those that they make ties between that as a/the reason they haven't made more of their life. I think there's an overwhelming feeling of "hey, what about me?" among white, right-wing people that have had a hard time economically because they lived their lives honestly and feel cheated. I think it is human nature to want to find some blame. It is easier to blame the people who don't look like you or come from where you come from than to blame the causes closer to home and that are harder to identify.