Time to End Lavaliering?

[Kevin]

TJ Sullivan, who I'm sure many of you know, had a very interesting blog post the other day. It was brought to my attention by one of my brothers.

I’ve been asked several times in the last year how I feel about fraternity men “lavaliering” (is that even a word?) their same sex significant others. As a well-known gay fraternity man, I guess people want to know my opinion. If we have ceremonies where brothers declare their love for women, give them gifts with their letters, then wouldn’t fairness dictate that these same traditions be encouraged for gay brothers?

The rest of the article is here:

http://tjsullivan.com/lavaliering/

Where do y'all come down on the traditions of lavaliering? And how about badge wearing? In my fraternity, the fiancée (I'm thinking not fiancé), wife (not husband), mother and daughter can wear the badge. Is this something which needs to be rethought?

[ZetaPhi708]

Whoa. This one will take some thought but here's another theory to ponder: what if the same-sex significant other is a gentleman of another fraternity?

[ZetaPhi708]

Originally Posted by Kevin

TJ Sullivan, who I'm sure many of you know, had a very interesting blog post the other day. It was brought to my attention by one of my brothers.



The rest of the article is here:

http://tjsullivan.com/lavaliering/

Where do y'all come down on the traditions of lavaliering? And how about badge wearing? In my fraternity, the fiancée (I'm thinking not fiancé), wife (not husband), mother and daughter can wear the badge. Is this something which needs to be rethought?

Mr. Kevin, what fraternity is Mr. Sullivan in?

Edited to add: oops, I think I found it. Is he a Pi Kappa Phi?

[IndianaSigKap]

Originally Posted by ZetaPhi708

Edited to add: oops, I think I found it. Is he a Pi Kappa Phi?

Yes, he is a founding brother of the Pi Kappa Phi chapter at Indiana and fellow journalism major! We worked together at a summer job in college. Great guy.

[33girl]

Sorry, but this sounds like someone being a cynical prick about a nice tradition - and I don't think the gay issue has anything to do with it. I've heard straight people say the same sorts of things (when there was no lavalier on the horizon). I also really detest when people act like if the NPHC doesn't do something they must be right. It's "sorry I'm white" self-loathing and completely ridiculous.

If you don't like it, don't do it. And the only letters you need to.worry about are your own. This article just makes him sound like a big whinypants.

ETA: I also love when people advocate premature marriage proposals just because they don't like lavaliering. If you would say the 2 are on the same level, you really just don't get it.

[DrPhil]

People have said similar things on GC over the years.

I don't know why he would care about an NPHC perspective but I don't see his response as "white self-loathing". I see it as needing support for his argument that lavaliering is outdated and dumb. It is probably less difficult to find such support in the GLO communities that are historically and predominantly racial and ethnic minorities.

Not like my opinion matters but the following is my perspective. I typically don't like traditions that I consider to be rooted in patriarchy and sexism disguised as "awww my partner gave me a loving gift through his GLO". But I can get over myself and not be too opposed to lavaliering--again, not like my opinion matters. I do believe that it should apply to same-sex couples IF some same-sex couples are interested. Not every same-sex couple is interested just as not every heterosexual couple is interested. If the same-sex partner is in another fraternity, he needs to defer to his fraternity's protocol and policies. If his fraternity frowns upon wearing another fraternity's symbols, do NOT do it. Being lavaliered by the man you love doesn't trump your own fraternity's policies and practices.

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

People have said similar things on GC over the years.

I don't know why he would care about an NPHC perspective but I don't see his response as "white self-loathing". I see it as needing support for his argument that lavaliering is outdated and dumb.

Not like my opinion matters but I don't like any tradition rooted in patriarchy and sexism disguised as "awww my partner gave me a loving gift through his GLO". But I can get over myself and not be too opposed to lavaliering--again, not like my opinion matters. I do believe that it should apply to same-sex couples IF some same-sex couples are interested. Not every same-sex couple is interested just as not every heterosexual couple is interested. If the same-sex partner is in another fraternity, he needs to defer to his fraternity's protocol and policies. If his fraternity frowns upon wearing another fraternity's symbols, do NOT do it. Being lavaliered by the man you love doesn't trump your own fraternity's policies and practices.

This!

[sigmadiva]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I also really detest when people act like if the NPHC doesn't do something they must be right.

But we are right 33girl!!!! Didn't you get the memo?????

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by sigmadiva

But we are right 33girl!!!! Didn't you get the memo?????

Stop white-shaming them!!! Stop!!!!!

[DrPhil]

LOL. You caught me mid-edit

[KDCat]

Twenty + years ago, my sisters exchanged lavaliers with their boyfriends. He wore her letters on a chain and she wore his. A gay couple could do the same. If the sig other is in another fraternity, they could wear engraved letters, with the boyfriend's letters below his own letters. There are a number of places that sell engraved dogtags with fraternity letters.

Women who are pinned usually wear their boyrfriends' below their own pin. Same principle.

That said: After breaking up with my boyfriend from freshman and sophomore year, I didn't truck with lavaliers or wearing letters much. He was crazy jealous and the "wearing letters" thing was too much like wearing a "no trespassing" sign or a dog tag. It was a sign of ownership. Bleh.

[MaryPoppins]

What Dr. Phil said.

[PersistentDST]

This reminds me of something that is in my Mom's jewelry box to this day. When she was an undergraduate in the early 70's, (for the first time, she recently graduated ) our cousin was president of Omega Psi Phi at their university. With his urging my mother became an Omega Pearl (an auxilary group that helped the chapter with projects and community service). Pearls also helped pledges throughout their process. She began to date one of the new initiates (with my cousins permission of course) and he gave her a necklace with an Omega Psi Phi charm. She's had the necklace since then, even though she ended up just being friends with the guy she was dating. She married a member of "Football Phi Football" as my father calls it .

Anyway, she's never worn the necklace or anything crazy. It was just a gift she appreciates. I think that there's nothing wrong with the tradition. Perhaps maybe it should be more private (for everyone...opposite sex/same sex)? As far as two men who are in fraternal organizations, I agree with Dr. Phil that protocol may be a thing to look at. Or should only happen when one is engaged or on a wedding day? Lol! I'm just rambling now. I thought I would just put my .13 cents on this topic.

[AOII Angel]

TJ is not always right about everything. I'm sure his partner doesn't want a lavalier now...but what about when they were active in college? Things may have been different. Not all straight or gay couples may find this practice to be important, but for those who do, to each their own.

[OldOleMiss]

I'm a traditionalist at heart and I have to say it makes me very sad to think about the end of lavaliering. I don't see it as a gay / straight issue but rather a sign of affection between two young people and a sign of tradition. This may be long but I would like to share 2 of my most cherished memories involving "pinning". The first is about my Father-in-law who suffered from Alzheimer's. At one point he had "gone back in his mind" to where he thought he was 19 years old and in University. He very sweetly and solemnly asked me one night at dinner if I would "wear his pin". My husband was amazed that his father not only still had his pin and knew where it was, but also that he "remembered" what pinning was. I accepted his phi-delt pin with all of the love that a 19 year old girl would have had. I keep it in my jewelry box and I LOVE looking at it and remembering that dear sweet man. (I have also joked with my husband asking where HIS pin is...)

My second cherished memory involves my own father who passed away 6 years ago. I recently was "brave enough" to sort through his "catch-all" box that my mother had given me. Inside I found a Chi-Omega badge (Not my GLO). I knew it had to belong to an old family friend whom my father had dated in college and who had written my Chi-O rec when I was going through rush. I called her explaining that I had found a badge and wondered if it was hers as I would like to return it. She started crying. She still had my fathers Sigma-Nu pin!!! She asked that I keep her badge as she did not want to part with my fathers and that she would make sure it was returned to me after she was "gone". This touched me so greatly that she wanted to not only hold on to a piece of her youth and a piece of my father but also wanted me to hold on to it as well. They obviously never married, didn't even date past college, but clearly both cared enough to hold on to each other's badges for more than 50 years. I LOVE owning her pin almost as much as I would love to have my father's for the simple reason that it makes me closer to him in a way that ordinarily I never would have been and it helps me know the man he was before he was "dad".

Without the tradition of pinning or lavaliering I would not have either of these memories. If you do away with the tradition how many future memories are you taking away from the next generation. I know VERY few people that ended up marrying the person they were lavaliered or even pinned to in college, but I do know most of them still cherish that time in their lives and that symbol. Greek life is such a huge part of your life at that age and to a GLO member sharing their letters is the "ultimate" in sharing their love. IMHO part of what makes Greek Life so special and important is the carrying on of traditions. You celebrate the same creed, the same rituals and same values that all of your sisters and brothers before you did. You pass down to the next pledge class these traditions and the same love for the sister/brotherhood. Pins and lavalieres are part of this tradition. If you take away this simple act of two young people (gay or straight) sharing their letters-a tradition that has been shared since the beginning of GLO's- then you in essence taking away part of the history that binds individuals to their GLO.