Alpha Phi In Pittsburgh

[betasigrose]

I'm sorry

[lauralaylin]

I hate to be rude, but aren't you looking to get initiated into Delta Zeta?

[betasigrose]

Hi..I don't think you're being rude at all. I would be very curious too. I'm looking for a group that I can be very active and invoved in and I realized that Delta Zeta would not be a fit for me. A friend of mine suggested that I look into Alpha Phi. She thought it would be a good fit and I wanted to talk to some one and learn more. I didn't mean to offend anyone and I whole heartedly apologize. I won't post again. Thank you

[AlphaPhiBubbles]

lauralaylin, not to be unsisterly, but i think that what you posted was a little uncalled for... so what if she is interested in more than one sorority? Even if she was interested in Delta Zeta and found it wasnt for her before being initiated, she is allowed to shop around for other sororities. Of course i think im assuming thats what she is doing...

betasigrose - what is your intent in the conversation about alpha phi? are you collegiate, alumni? Looking for alumni initiation?

information never hurt anyone. I'm sure any of us would only tell her what we thought she needed to know anyway. I don't know why people get so touchy about this crap.

[lauralaylin]

I think I missed what is wrong with asking why she changed her mind in only a month's time? I can't help but look at that suspiciously. She gave a good answer, but I think it was one that needed to be asked.

You may see it as fine that women "shop around" looking for a sorority that will initiate them, but I don't agree with this. I think a woman should want to join a specific sorority because it's a good fit, both what the group stands for and the people in it. And by contacting every group that does AI, this isn't happening. Therefore, I asked a question wondering if this was the case here. I'm entitled to my opinon, and if you think my opinion makes me "touchy," then so be it. I have made a very educated opinion based on the AIs that I have dealt with in my alum chapter, including when I was president. I have had both a good and bad experience with AI candidates, and yes, this may have made me question women's motives more. Obviously your experiences with AI have been totally different and positive, and I am happy for you in that regard. This doesn't mean that I dislike the practice, I love all of the Alpha Phi AIs on this board, and my AC is hoping to initiate a wonderful woman this fall.

If you want to continue this discussion AlphaPhiBubbles, please PM me.

betasigrose, I'm sorry I was rude. Getting to know the president of the AC is the best way to start with AI. If you ever have any questions, I'd be happy to answer them. I love that Alpha Phi is very open to the process, and I hope it is a positive experience for you. Good luck with your journey!

[astroAPhi]

I think a lot of younger (collegiate and recent alumnae) sisters see AI in a different light than some of the sisters who have been around for many years. To us, Recruitment is as much "shopping" for a sorority as it is a sorority "shopping" for new members, so we don't see as big of a deal when a PNAM is interested in more than one sorority. Yes, there are resources online, but some of the best information is obtained by talking to members, which I think is why we're so often sought out. After all, I could not have decided on Alpha Phi just by looking at a website. Why should we expect differently of PNAMs?

[midwesterngirl]

Originally posted by lauralaylin
I think I missed what is wrong with asking why she changed her mind in only a month's time? I can't help but look at that suspiciously. She gave a good answer, but I think it was one that needed to be asked.

You may see it as fine that women "shop around" looking for a sorority that will initiate them, but I don't agree with this. I think a woman should want to join a specific sorority because it's a good fit, both what the group stands for and the people in it. And by contacting every group that does AI, this isn't happening. Therefore, I asked a question wondering if this was the case here. I'm entitled to my opinon, and if you think my opinion makes me "touchy," then so be it. I have made a very educated opinion based on the AIs that I have dealt with in my alum chapter, including when I was president. I have had both a good and bad experience with AI candidates, and yes, this may have made me question women's motives more. Obviously your experiences with AI have been totally different and positive, and I am happy for you in that regard. This doesn't mean that I dislike the practice, I love all of the Alpha Phi AIs on this board, and my AC is hoping to initiate a wonderful woman this fall.

If you want to continue this discussion AlphaPhiBubbles, please PM me.

betasigrose, I'm sorry I was rude. Getting to know the president of the AC is the best way to start with AI. If you ever have any questions, I'd be happy to answer them. I love that Alpha Phi is very open to the process, and I hope it is a positive experience for you. Good luck with your journey!

You weren't rude. I understand that you are very protective of Alpha Phi and I for one am grateful for it. I don't see anything wrong with a little bit of questioning. I would prefer that to blind fawning anyday.

[valkyrie]

Laura, I agree with what you're saying too. Maybe it's snotty, but I have to admit that when I see someone pursuing one sorority and then switching to another because the first group wouldn't be a "good fit" or something of the sort, I'm suspicious too.

Betasigrose, it's nothing personal -- I just get a little wary when someone posts about pursuing more than one group because sometimes I can't help but wonder if a woman will go from group to group to group after being rejected, and that bothers me. I'm not saying that's the case with you, but it can be an issue and it has happened in the past.

[a CA in CA]

I feel the need to chime in, not so much to weigh in with my own opinion, but rather to continue the discussion in another light and put some food for thought on the table.

By all means, don't hesitate to tell me if you think I'm all wet.

Why is it that shopping around, looking for the best fit, personally checking out one organization then perhaps another, things of that nature, why is it those things tend to raise suspicion among alumnae?

I'll be the first to admit that I once found that suspicious too. Now I'm not so sure.

How is that behavior on the part of an alumna so far different from what we expect of collegiates going through formal recruitment? They're expected to attend multiple parties, accept multiple inviations, and put down more than one choice on their membership agreement, all in the quest for the one best fit for them. Sometimes they get cut, and sometimes they decline, all presumably because the fit didn't really "fit" once one or the other got a closer look. All within the course of a week, sometimes less.

Is it the seemingly anonymous or semi-anonymous use of the internet and message boards that raises our suspicions, or something else?


Thoughts? Discussions?
No public floggings please!

[kddani]

Originally posted by a CA in CA
I feel the need to chime in, not so much to weigh in with my own opinion, but rather to continue the discussion in another light and put some food for thought on the table.

By all means, don't hesitate to tell me if you think I'm all wet.

Why is it that shopping around, looking for the best fit, personally checking out one organization then perhaps another, things of that nature, why is it those things tend to raise suspicion among alumnae?

I'll be the first to admit that I once found that suspicious too. Now I'm not so sure.

How is that behavior on the part of an alumna so far different from what we expect of collegiates going through formal recruitment? They're expected to attend multiple parties, accept multiple inviations, and put down more than one choice on their membership agreement, all in the quest for the one best fit for them. Sometimes they get cut, and sometimes they decline, all presumably because the fit didn't really "fit" once one or the other got a closer look. All within the course of a week, sometimes less.

Is it the seemingly anonymous or semi-anonymous use of the internet and message boards that raises our suspicions, or something else?


Thoughts? Discussions?
No public floggings please!

Please see a few of the threads in the Alumni Initiation subforum of the Alumni Involvement forum in the main boards for elaboration on the answer to your question.

Undergraduate recruitment and AI are very different beasts.

[Sistermadly]

Originally posted by a CA in CA
Is it the seemingly anonymous or semi-anonymous use of the internet and message boards that raises our suspicions, or something else?

Yup, to both questions. I'll clarify.

I was someone who "shopped around" as a potential Alumna Initiate before I found my fit with Alpha Phi (or, more correctly, before we mutually decided it would be a good fit). I made that decision based on my experience (albeit brief) with Panhellenic recruitment as an undergraduate student all those fifty-thousand years ago when I went through rush. I was told to keep an open mind, to look at everyone equally, and not to get too focused on one particular organization because they all had fantastic things to offer. When it came down to the wire, I think I'm one of the only alumnae initiates on GC who actually had an experience that somewhat mirrored that of a collegiate PNM - I actually had to make a choice between two organizations that I'd "preffed", for lack of a better term.

I think that discretion is a wonderful thing. I think that being selective, exclusive (without being elitist) and guarding Alpha Phi's legacy is what the Fraternity expects of us. I think these things are key components to the continued success of our Alumnae Initiation program. However, I don't think it serves us well to be... um... curt when people approach us for information. I'm not saying we have to fall all over ourselves to make sure that someone gets to wear our golden pin ('cause we don't. We're fierce that way.), but I really, really hope we don't adopt a negative attitude toward this process that has been so successful since our Fraternity's earliest days.

So to make a long story short, yeah, for me the suspicion comes from the message board/Internet anonymity aspect of these requests for information, not from the process itself.

There's also the perception given by the sheer number of Alpha Phi alumnae initiates represented on GC that somehow our Alumnae Initiation process provides an "easy in" to Greek life. That's not really an indictment of our process so much as it is a recognition of the, shall we say, viral nature of communication posted on a message board.

[Sistermadly]

Originally posted by kddani
Undergraduate recruitment and AI are very different beasts.

No disrespect meant kddani, but A CA in CA knows quite a lot about alumnae initiation and alumnae involvement in Alpha Phi.

[lauralaylin]

No Sistermadly, it never serves anyone well to be curt. I feel *awful* about how I was. I have repeatedly said I was sorry to betasigrose, she has accepted my apologies, and I would love to leave this part behind. Everyone makes mistakes, and I have not been this embarrassed in a long time.

I think that maybe people mean different things when they say shopping around. There is a big difference between looking at 2-3 groups and 10+. Or between someone coming here to get info on a few groups vs someone coming to get info on every group. I definitely would rather an AI to be someone who is interested in us and not AI in general, but I think we can all agree that want is most important is that the person is nice, sincere, will be a good sister, etc. Any sister who knows about our recruitment policies knows what type of sister and what traits are deamed important and necessary to our sorority. I just think we should use that as our guide and make sure we stick to it. I would be more specific, but I can't as I'm sure you all know. I definitely think AI and undergrad recruitment are very different, but we should be looking for the same things in all of our sisters no matter how they are trying to join.

[kddani]

Originally posted by Sistermadly
No disrespect meant kddani, but A CA in CA knows quite a lot about alumnae initiation and alumnae involvement in Alpha Phi.

lol, i'm sure, I guess i meant that in regards to why people have such strong opinions

[Sistermadly]

Originally posted by lauralaylin
No Sistermadly, it never serves anyone well to be curt. I feel *awful* about how I was. I have repeatedly said I was sorry to betasigrose, she has accepted my apologies, and I would love to leave this part behind. Everyone makes mistakes, and I have not been this embarrassed in a long time.

Water under the bridge. I trust (and love) my sisters.

I think that maybe people mean different things when they say shopping around. There is a big difference between looking at 2-3 groups and 10+. Or between someone coming here to get info on a few groups vs someone coming to get info on every group.

I kind of see your point, but every situation is different. Take mine, for example. I didn't know anything about alumnae initiation until I ran across one sorority's membership page that mentioned the process. I was 3,000 miles from home with no friends, no community, and a definite desire to remedy that. I checked out associations that had chapters at the local university, groups that had chapters at my undergraduate school, and even chapters that only had alumnae associations (but no local collegians). In no time at all, I was able to whittle my list of groups down from about nine to two. Some of those contacts never went beyond a letter to the International HQ, but I did exchange emails with several groups, and ultimately, made an effort to go to events scheduled by my final two choices.

So while the means to this end might not have been perfect, I don't see anything inherently wrong with it. But on the other hand, I think that people really ought to rely on official information channels (like international websites and local ACs), rather than a message board where people can assume any identity.

I definitely think AI and undergrad recruitment are very different, but we should be looking for the same things in all of our sisters no matter how they are trying to join.

Amen.