Hazing clarification

[PiPhiGirl2005]

In your opinion and/or the opinion of your (inter)national Greek organization, are the following activities considered hazing:

- Blindfolding your pledges and leading them, in a group, around campus at night.
- Forcing them to sing ridiculous songs while blindfolded ("Itsy-Bitsy Spider", "I'm a Little Teapot", etc.) around campus, at night, for everyone to hear and see.
- Having them push a car, also while blindfolded.
- Yelling at them or tieing their hands together, while still blindfolded.
- Assigning them a nickname by which they will be known by the actives.

Just asking. We're having a bit of a debate at my school right now. The local men's music honorary (which call themselves Christian gentlemen and deliberately segregate themselves from and look down upon the rest of the Greek system) posted pictures of these activities on their website. They took them down later, but not before several members of the campus also posted the pictures in their own blogs for everyone to see.

I think that the administration is dealing with it (I hope, anyway), but members of this quasi-fraternity insist that what they did wasn't hazing, but trust-building - a harmless initiation activity.

In Pi Phi, we have learned that no matter how harmless something seems, no matter how unintentional, it can still be hazing.... And according to our definition, what these guys are doing is hazing. According to all definitions I've ever heard, including the NPC and NIC definitions, this is hazing.

Anyway, I just wanted some opinions from people here. And if the administration chooses to ignore it, who can I go to? They are a local group, and honorary, and are not part of IFC.

[Senusret I]

I don't think we can really give an opinion until you post the pictures or links to them.

[PiPhiGirl2005]

Yikes.... Well, I thought about it, but I didn't want to upset anyone or give away the name of the honorary.

[SirHornyToad]

Yep, sounds like hazing to me

[hoosier]

Check the Sigma Chi website - they've made a committment to zero tolerance and have posted a definition.

One point says anything which embarasses a pledge in public is hazing:

Blindfolding your pledges and leading them, in a group, around campus at night.
- Forcing them to sing ridiculous songs while blindfolded ("Itsy-Bitsy Spider", "I'm a Little Teapot", etc.) around campus, at night, for everyone to hear and see.
- Having them push a car, also while blindfolded.
- Yelling at them or tieing their hands together, while still blindfolded.
- Assigning them a nickname by which they will be known by the actives.

Assigning a nickname might be OK, but if the nickname is something like "stinky farts" and it's used in public, it's hazing.

[AGDee]

All hazing. If the administration doesn't do anything and they are a local, I would ask the local police about whether it meets the criteria for hazing in your state/municipality. I wonder who covers their liability. Blind folding, beyond hazing, is a HUGE risk management issue because the risk of injury is very high while blind folded.

Dee

[PiPhiGirl2005]

Thanks for all the replies. These guys don't seem to get that it's hazing. No matter how we try to explain it to them, they say that they don't see the problem with "harmless fun", "trust-building activities", and singing silly songs.

That's a really good point about it being a risk management issue.... Being a local music honorary, I doubt they ever really consider risk management, but if they're going to do things like this, they'd better start.

[DeltAlum]

Tell them it's fun, but probably against the law.

[gpb1874]

In your opinion and/or the opinion of your (inter)national Greek organization, are the following activities considered hazing:

- YES Blindfolding your pledges and leading them, in a group, around campus at night.
- YES Forcing them to sing ridiculous songs while blindfolded ("Itsy-Bitsy Spider", "I'm a Little Teapot", etc.) around campus, at night, for everyone to hear and see.
- YES Having them push a car, also while blindfolded.
- YES Yelling at them or tieing their hands together, while still blindfolded.
- MAYBE Assigning them a nickname by which they will be known by the actives.

Some good points made already......here are my extra comments:
Blindfolding never really a good idea.
What;s the point of singing stupid kid's songs? how is that a team builder? there's nothing similar listed in any of the team building books or websites i've read over.
Again, what's with the blindfolding? And tieing their hands together?

Nicknames it's hard to say....I know 2 of the fraternities on my campus (i'm a greek advisor not student) give their guys nicknames. i've not heard much about considering this hazing, but it could be if it were a demeaning nickname.

the campus should get involved. look into the student code of conduct and the student organization manual to see what it says. mine says no one can haze - whether it be an individual student or an oranization, greek or not. these guys are putting STUDENTS in harms way, which usually violates general student conduct rules.

The group needs to look at their activities and relate them back to any ritual they may have, their values and goals. i don't see how singing "little tea pot" can relate back to their values. there are many other teambuilding activities that are not dangerous and humilitating to the participants.

This is a little long, but it comes from FIPG (think it stands for Fraternity Insurance Protection Group). It's their definition of hazing. It has a whole list of activities that they would consider hazing. If you want the link, send me a PM and let me know.


No chapter, colony, student or alumnus shall conduct nor condone hazing activities. Hazing activities are defined as:
Any action taken or situation created, intentionally, whether on or off fraternity premises, to produce mental or physical
discomfort, embarrassment, harassment, or ridicule. Such activities may include but are not limited to the following:
use of alcohol; paddling in any form; creation of excessive fatigue; physical and psychological shocks; quests, treasure
hunts, scavenger hunts, road trips or any other such activities carried on outside or inside of the confines of the chapter
house; wearing of public apparel which is conspicuous and not normally in good taste; engaging in public stunts and
buffoonery; morally degrading or humiliating games and activities; and any other such activities that are not consistent
with academic achievement, fraternal law, ritual or policy, or the regulations and policies of the educational institution,
or applicable state law.

[Tom Earp]

Okay, Politically Speaking, anything a Greek Organization tries to do is considered Hazing.

While it might seem in fun and a tragedy happens, it is blown totally out of propertion. None of us want to see that happen of course.

But, flagrant disregard by some is another ball of wax.

We as Greek Letter Organizations are in the Spot Light, many times for the wrong reasons and not for what We do for the betterment.

Remember, Study Hours now are Hazing! Forced Studying, aint it terrible? Why are Students in College? Graduate last I Heard?