Raising Total

carnation · #1 01-14-2003, 06:19 PM

A friend's daughter told me about the sorority membership situation at her college. This college, which is quite near us, has 5 sororities with 4 at total or above. The other group is much smaller; I don't know why since they're one of the older groups.

Anyway, the 4 at total are wanting to raise total so they can have a spring rush. Apparently, there are plenty of girls who want to pledge them. However, our friend's daughter is in the 5th group--they only took 9 last fall when everyone else took (I think) 35. They haven't been able to get any pledges in open rush.

So what do you think Panhellenic should do? Should they try to help the smaller group or should they go ahead and raise total? This being the South, it's awfully hard to convince PNMs that they should go to the smaller group as they tend to have their minds made up before rush.

KappaKittyCat · #2 01-14-2003, 06:31 PM

Oh, Carnation, this one's so hard. I'm from the "underdog" sorority myself, so I definitely sympathise with the members of the smallest group. Other than that, we come from two different worlds. The closest I've ever been to the South is southern Illinois.

The small group really needs to get its you-know-what in gear, because I'd wager that Panhellenic will maybe give them another year before they raise total/open for expansion.

Good luck to them.

nyrdrms · #3 01-14-2003, 06:38 PM

We only have 3 sororities at my school, but up until about two years ago, no one could maintain a steady membership. Panhellenic decided that once ALL three sororities reached ceiling, and were able to maintain numbers around ceiling, the idea of expansion and raising total was not an issue. Now that all three sororities have managed to keep numbers up, and draw in a large amount of potentials for this coming formal recruitment, our school has contacted NPC to let them know that we're interested in expanding. Raising total still is not a factor, and although several sisters in all the sororities want it, I don't know that it will be any time in the near future.

aephi alum · #4 01-14-2003, 07:51 PM

My school also has 5 sororities, with one (AEPhi) considerably smaller than the other 4. Less than a year after AEPhi colonized, our Panhel president decided she wanted to open the campus for expansion. At the time, total was 80 and we had about 20 sisters. Expansion at that time would have destroyed my chapter. We fought it tooth and nail, and eventually it was voted down because AEPhi was so new.

Several years later, total is the same, there has been no expansion, and AEPhi is now much stronger (though still smaller than the other sororities). In this case, Panhel successfully protected the "underdog" chapter by not expanding.

So, part of me wants to say HELL NO, don't raise total.

But the more realistic part of me realizes that there are a lot of women out there who would love the chance to go greek, don't fit in with the smaller chapter for whatever reason, and are being denied the chance to join a bigger chapter because of a number. So the best course of action may be to raise total just a little bit. This will allow the bigger sororities to take small NM classes (unless they're WAY over whatever total is now). Hopefully the smaller group will realize that they have to recruit more aggressively if they want to stay afloat; since they are not at total, they can recruit at any time.

Aphigal · #5 01-14-2003, 08:10 PM

Her chapter advisor should contact the National Office and have member of the NPC Delegation for that sorority contact the NPC Area Advisor.

Sometimes there is nothing that can be done when its 4 against one! I hate situations like this!

Firehouse · #6 01-14-2003, 11:14 PM

keep young women from joining the sororities they want - and who want them - just because one group can't seem to attract more members? It's like closing down all the Cadillac dealerships because Geo's not selling well.

fire1977 · #7 01-15-2003, 12:47 AM

It's funny this thread came up. There's been talk on a campus that I advise of raising ceiling to 70. I'm very frustrated because the chapter and I (along with the other advisors and alum) just worked very hard to get these girls about halfway to ceiling. There are 6 houses that are at the current ceiling (60), one almost at ceiling and the other 4 about half of that. Personally I'd like them to wait. The chapter I have isn't even the smaller group and if they wanted to raise it that high, they could invite back the sorority that closed in 1998.

SIGH, I guess there isn't really much I can do. I really feel for the girl you know carnation. I also understand that not everyone wants to join every sorority, it's just difficult to accept.

Okay sorry I'm a little off topic, I'm just a little upset!

33girl · #8 01-15-2003, 01:54 AM

They should try to help the smaller group. Anything other than that would be contrary to Panhellenic spirit. The smaller group also needs to do some work on their own as far as COB and thinking outside the box in terms of pledging something other than the tradtional freshman rushee. They also need to emphasize their age/tradition, and due to years of alumnae, connections connections CONNECTIONS!

Firehouse, boys just don't understand this stuff, so don't try. You will be much better off.

aopinthesky · #9 01-15-2003, 10:49 AM

>>>It's like closing down all the Cadillac dealerships because Geo's not selling well.<<<

I haven't thought that analogy out very well, but the thing is, Firehouse, you aren't talking about car dealerships you are talking about sisterhoods - and PEOPLE. Even though that one sorority may be small, they have still put effort, probably a great amount, into keeping that sisterhood alive, and it means just as much to them as to those in the larger sororities. They are just as connected to each other, just as devoted to their cause as they would be if they had 100 members. It is not fair to institute some new chapter total if it is going to mean the end of that sorority, unless it is obvious that they can't make necessary changes for improvement.
33rdGirl made some very good observations. I would also like to point out to you, Firehouse, that NPC groups do not operate even remotely like fraternities when it comes to recruitment so you can't compare the two. I am not saying NPC is right and IFC is wrong, because there is room for improvement with NPC, but you just can't compare the two systems.
To answer the original question, Carnation, I do feel for that small group. I think raising total would be preferable to someone deciding that the campus should be open for expansion, for that would be the sure demise of the small group. That group, however, does need to take a good look at how they are doing things and ask for some assistance from their National office. Definitely if they are only getting a fraction of quota during recruitment and they are unable to COB any new members, they may need some fine tuning.
Sorry I was so wordy!

MoxieGrrl · #10 01-15-2003, 11:24 AM

I would not have total raised. To me, it's coming off as the bigger groups are well, selfish, and the PNMs being stuck on the rep of a house, and not the idea of a sisterhood or being Greek.

I'm not familiar with the campus in question, but I'm sure the much smaller group isn't in their position because they are partiers or "slutty" or anything like that. It's probably because there are internal problems or they are not "attractive", and that's why PNMs won't join. So what happens then? You have 4 groups at total, with PNMs waiting for COBs. Then there are all of these quality girls waiting in the wings for bids.

My opinion? Keep on waiting, chickadees or suck it up, take a stand and join the smaller house. All GLOs are different, but underneath, we are all the same. It isn't like XYZ stands for sisterhood and philanthropy and ABC has a secret agenda of mass hazing and neo-Nazism!! No one is truely going to end up with a raw deal if total isn't raised!!!

There is another thread out there about "should we start a new house or mass takeover a struggling one?" These girls need to take over/help the struggling one!!! Unless there is a HUGE upswing of women rushing, bigger houses allowing more women in is just taking away from potential bids/COBs to the smaller house. One or two good pledge classes could save this smaller houses, and the same one or two pledge classes can change a reputation & fix long-standing problems. I have seen it happen.

Pheww......sorry if that made no sense. These kind of situations make me so sad and angry.

justamom · #11 01-15-2003, 01:13 PM

I'm going to side with holding total as is. WHY??? It seems to have worked at LSU. There was a sorority that for several year was "off" in comparison to the others. Then BOOM, a HUGE group of PNMs went through and they got a GREAT pledge class with strong numbers. The second year, the same thing, another solid class.

It's funny what you can learn over the course of a few years and a bit of the responsibility lies with the sororities themselves.
Though this sorority is superb in other southern states, it isn't a "classic" sorority in the deep south. So, they have THAT to deal with. What is a REAL bummer is when other, stronger groups
say things like, "They never cut anybody." The implication is clear, but the fact is, its their POLICY not to cut first round. So, until all the sororities can work together and promote GREEK instead of resorting to small minded tactics, I'd say keep quota as is or run the risk of creating another, "weak" group. At least that's how I feel at the moment and acknowledge a good solid debate could change my mind.

DeltaBetaBaby · #12 01-15-2003, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fire1977
It's funny this thread came up. There's been talk on a campus that I advise of raising ceiling to 70. I'm very frustrated because the chapter and I (along with the other advisors and alum) just worked very hard to get these girls about halfway to ceiling. There are 6 houses that are at the current ceiling (60), one almost at ceiling and the other 4 about half of that. Personally I'd like them to wait. The chapter I have isn't even the smaller group and if they wanted to raise it that high, they could invite back the sorority that closed in 1998.

SIGH, I guess there isn't really much I can do. I really feel for the girl you know carnation. I also understand that not everyone wants to join every sorority, it's just difficult to accept.

Okay sorry I'm a little off topic, I'm just a little upset!

Okay, I am taking this off-topic and running with it...

When total is raised on a campus, it is usually by about 3: 3x11=33 new girls.

10 girls is WAY too large of a jump, and I have never heard of changing it by that many all at once.

valkyrie · #13 01-15-2003, 03:02 PM

I think this is a hard topic, but it's easy to sit here and say that the smaller group should be protected and PNMs should join it. However, it's just not that easy. When I went through rush back in the day, there was one group on my campus that was a lot smaller than all the others. I would not have wanted to join that group. In fact, even if 20 of my friends had wanted to join that house with me, I would not have wanted to because I ABSOLUTELY would not have fit in with them. You really can't expect a PNM to be happy with the 20 or 40 or however many people belong to an organization if she just doesn't fit in with them for whatever reason. It is true that *most* greek organizations have things in common with each other, but when it comes down to it, a PNM has to be comfortable and happy with these PEOPLE on a sometimes daily basis. Why join at all if it's to be with people you don't even like, or with whom you have nothing in common, or whatever?

I wouldn't even think raising total should be considered if there are several groups below ceiling. But when you have ONE group that is only getting 9 members while everyone else is getting 35, I think you really have to ask WHY, and the members of that organization have to ask themselves the same question, although I'm sure they already have.

I'm wondering, though, how long this group has been so small. Was there one incident where something happened to reduce the membership so much, or has it been happening slowly, or has the group always been small?

carnation · #14 01-15-2003, 04:26 PM

I know they've been the smallest by far for at least 5 years. Coincidentally, I met an alum of that chapter today and she said, "We stink at formal rush but we shine in open rush." But they don't! Last year, they didn't pick up anyone in open rush but she doesn't know that I know that.

justamom · #15 01-15-2003, 05:45 PM

valkyrie-I wouldn't even think raising total should be considered if there are several groups below ceiling. But when you have ONE group that is only getting 9 members while everyone else is getting 35, I think you really have to ask WHY, and the members of that organization have to ask themselves the same question, although I'm sure they already have.

Now there you have one of those points that make you think.
This is an excelent example. Maybe each sitution MUST be considered independently because campuses are so different.

I too can imagine different situations where, no matter WHAT, I wouldn't want to join. Carnation, some of the examples from you own campus would certainly qualify!

As valkyrie said, the WHY is pretty important.
Are they the kind of people your dog would bite?
Is their arrest record longer than the line to the bathroom at a beer bust?
Or, have they fallen victim to a campus image that is nearly impossible to shake.

Someone would really have to be impartial to make a fair decision.