Fall Formal Recruitment vs. Deferred: Let the Debate Begin

[KappaStargirl]

Consider this a spin-off of KappaKittyCat's "Anonymity" thread.

Feel free to use any, all, or none of the following questions in your discussion (or add your own):


What school did you attend?

How many students?

How many GLO's? (local and national)?

Chapter total?

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?

If deferred, when was it held?

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?

If so, did it color your thoughts on when Recruitment was held?

Does your GLO openly support one or the other?

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall?

[stagebear]

What school did you attend?
Creighton University

How many students?
about 3600 undergrad

How many GLO's? (local and national)?
5 fraternities, 5 sororities

Chapter total?
for the women = 80 (don't know about the guys)

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?
deferred

If deferred, when was it held?
first week of classes in the spring = mid january. the guys have the week after us

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?
Rho Chi last year, Rho Mu (rec. mentor) this year

If so, did it color your thoughts on when Recruitment was held?
for Creighton, it's good cause we're very academic. it lets everyone get settled into the system and other orgs.

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?
deferred is ok. our issue is guarenteed bid.

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
cant say due to the above mentioned issue

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall?
probably not

[FuzzieAlum]

What school did you attend?
Case Western Reserve U

How many students?
3000-ish undergrads

How many GLO's? (local and national)?
5 sororities (one local), 17 fraternities. No MCGLOs or NPHC groups (there were citywide chapters).

Chapter total?
50, no limit for the men

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?
Deferred

If deferred, when was it held?
First week of second semester

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?
No, we used alums

If so, did it color your thoughts on when Recruitment was held?

Does your GLO openly support one or the other?
No

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?
They switched to immediate rush right after I graduated and numbers plummeted. Now they're switching back. So, no, I don't think it worked!

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
Definitely. Most gals at Case don't come in intending to rush, and they need time to realize sororities aren't what the media portrays them as. In fact, I think most all the chapters get at least 1/3 of their members through informal rush.

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall?
No. My parents said I could not rush first semester - they wanted me to get used to school and make sure I could manage my time.

[PiPhiERDoc]

What school did you attend?
University of Puget Sound

How many students?
2800

How many GLO's? (local and national)?
6 sororities when I was an undergrad; lost TriDelta my senior year, now 5 nationals (Pi Beta Phi, Alpha Phi, Kappa Kappa Gamma, Kappa Alpha Theta, Gamma Phi Beta); again, had 6 fraternities when I was there, lost Kappa Sig in 1996; lost SAE 2 years ago, now have 4 nationals (Phi Delt, Sigma Chi, Sigma Nu, Beta Theta Pi), possible expansion of another fraternity (may try to return K Sig, Fiji, or Theta Chi, all were on the campus before my time)

Chapter total?
Ceiling is at 85. No one is there this fall. Pi Phi is closest at 80.

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?
Deferred to right before beginning of Spring Semester

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?
Nope -- had too much Pi Phi gear to disaffiliate


Does your GLO openly support one or the other?
Fall rush is supported by Pi Phi nationally. I don't think our chapter really cares one way or the other given that they have never seen it any other way.

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?
I think a deferred fall rush would work better. I think that having an entire semester to foster steriotypes by the freshman and to have them hear (from a lot of the fraternities) which are the "cool" sororities and which are not has really hurt some groups and has made it impossible to rebound from a poor rush/not making quota/low numbers (ie what happened to both TriDelts and Kappa Sigs).
However, I do think that we are a less traditionally greek campus, and a lot of people who wouldn't have rushed if it were right off the bat are more inclined to rush after having a semester to see what our greek system is all about, and after having a chance to just adjust to life at college.

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
Not really...we changed over to deferred rush in 1989. 1990-1993 were by far the biggest pledge classes our greek system had ever seen (quota the year I rushed was 38, and 260 women went through rush, so basically 50% of the campus was greek at that time), then was pretty stable around thirty for a few years, and has fallen off into the low to mid twenties the last couple of years...it was 18 last fall -- ouch! We have a terrific new Greek Advisor though, and a great group of chapter advisors, and basically we sat down on bid matching and did everything we could to place every girl. It sounds like the new advisor has been VERY aggressive about early advertising for spring rush and numbers are already up halfway through the fall semester, so hopefully we'll get a better turnout for formal this year. The only thing that is improving is informal. We gave out 88 bids as a system last spring, and had 47 women go through informal rush (at least sophomore standing or transfer students, all houses participated) and I think all but 1 or 2 were offered bids, which is terrific! I also think that the large numbers for informal speaks highly of our greek system as a whole...after being on campus for an entire year, sophmores like what they see in our houses and realize that they want to be part of it.

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall?
Absolutely. The one thing that always bugged me was the fact that the women in the sororities become totally segregated from freshman in the fall because everyone is so freaked out by the thought that someone is going to say that they were dirty rushing if they are so much as seen talking to a freshman, let alone becoming friends with them! I think that makes the sorority women seem exclusive and snobby, when really they are DYING to meet the new freshman. This is also something that our greek advisor is addressing, which is very needed.

[LeslieAGD]

What school did you attend?
Eatern Michigan University

How many students?
Not entirely certain

How many GLO's? (local and national)?
9 sororities (8 NPC, 1 local), 10 fraternities (8 NPC, 2 local)

Chapter total?
Sorority total=55

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?
Fall

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?
Yes

If so, did it color your thoughts on when Recruitment was held?
I think it should be in the fall

Does your GLO openly support one or the other?
I'm not clear if you mean do chapters support each other or other sororities

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?
No, but I wish we had a sorority forum in the winter to generate interest for COB

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
Not the timing (dates), but I think many women don't realize the time commitment to Rush.

[aephi alum]

We're about to get a case study in whether immediate or deferred rush works better! (this is long, sorry )

What school did you attend?
MIT

How many students?
about 5000 undergrads

Percentage who go greek? ( *new question* )
about 40% of men, about 20% of women

How many GLO's? (local and national)?
When I rushed:
- 4 NPC sororities plus 1 local that held rush 1 week after formal rush
- 26 (I think) NIC fraternities plus 2 locals
- 1 all-female independent living group (ILG)
- 5 coed ILGs
- 2 NPHC fraternities, 1 NPHC sorority
(All groups except the NPHC groups were governed by IFC. The NPC sororities and the local were also governed by Panhel.)

Now:
- 5 NPC sororities
- 23 NIC fraternities plus 2 locals
- same ILGs and NPHC groups
(Non-NPHC fraternities and ILGs are governed by IFC. Non-NPHC sororities are governed by Panhel and are no longer IFC members.)

Chapter total?
80 for the sororities. Quota has typically been around 30.
Fraternities and ILGs used to require all members, including pledges, to live in the house, so they were limited by how many beds they had. Freshmen are now required to live on campus, so fraternities and ILGs now issue non-residential bids.

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?
When I rushed: early fall, before classes started
MIT is currently transitioning to deferred rush.

If deferred, when was it held?
For sororities, the new deferred rush will be held over the weekend before spring term and the weekend after the first week of spring term.
Fraternities deferred rush to the 4th week of fall term.

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?
yup

If so, did it color your thoughts on when Recruitment was held?
no

Does your GLO openly support one or the other?
Not to my knowledge.

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?
I think they should have stuck with immediate recruitment.

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
Hooo yeah.

I believe that the new deferred rush is going to kill numbers. It's a question of time commitments. With immediate rush, you go in knowing that you will have to commit some time to your studies, and possibly to a job or a sports team - but that leaves you plenty of time to commit to being a GLO member. With deferred rush, you've already committed time to a variety of things, aside from your studies, that may include a job, sports, your dorm, choir, theatre group, community service, etc. - so you may decide you can't fit a GLO into your packed schedule.

In addition, with immediate rush, there was a period of about 5 days where the only thing to do on campus was rush. With deferred rush, both PNMs and sisters/brothers have to worry about problem sets and exams at the same time they're worrying about rush. (visions of a PNM and a sister huddling in the corner during a party, working together on a problem set )

The administration has as much as said that they expect a couple of the smaller fraternities to fold as a result of deferred rush. I'm going to try to scare up the fraternities' rush results.

[sarahgrace]

Ok, I'm not going to give you all the numbers and answer all the questions directly because I also go to Puget Sound, and PiPhiERDoc has it all in her post a few posts up. Plus, as a freshman, I don't know a lot of that stuff...but I would like to put in my 2 cents.

I never would have considered rushing if we had fall recruitment. I had vaguely thought about joining a sorority during high school, but never really thought about it seriously, since my family isn't into the greek system, and few of my friends are...in fact, I don't think I know anyone (besides some distant acquintances) that went greek in college. At any rate, the last few weeks at home and first few weeks at college were so stressful that I don't think I could have taken the additional pressure of worrying about rush.

I support deferred rush as much as I can without having actually gone through it yet...I like the fact that all freshman at UPS live on campus, for the most part in dorms (I'm one of the few freshmen that live in a house, the Honors program house). It gives everyone a chance to meet a wide variety of people, and also to get settled into the routines of college life before adding in another commitment like being part of a sorority or fraternity.

Of course, deferred rush can be very frustrating. I want to find out as much as I can about greek life on campus, but I know I won't get the whole picture until I go through rush and visit all the houses and meet the women. It's hard to get to know people in the greek system because of the restrictions for "dirty rushing" which make sense, but are also very strict.

Anyway, I just wanted to give the perspective of a future pnm!

~Sarah~

[breathesgelatin]

What school do you attend?
Washington and Lee University

How many students?
1700

How many GLO's? (local and national)?
15 IFC Fraternities (Chi Psi, FIJI, Pi Kapp, SAE, Phi Psi, Kappa Sig, KA (Alpha), Sigma Chi, SigEp, Lambda Chi, Phi Kap, Phi Delt, Sigma Nu, Pika, Beta)
5 NPC Sororities (KKG, KD, Pi Phi (rock on!), Theta, Chi-O)
1 National Co-ed Service Fraternity (APO)
2 Men's Secret Societies (Cadaver Society, Sigma Society)
And possible colonization of NPHC group (AKA)

Chapter total?
No limit for the men. The groups range from the mid-twenties to maybe low-sixties.
For the women, I'm actually not sure. Quota is ususally in the thirties. I would guess that few chapters at total because of deactivations, which are very common, but most make quota. I think most groups are at around 70-80, but we are at around 50 right now.

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?
My recruitment was deferred. NPC recruitment at W&L has always been deferred (the first three sororities were colonized in 1989), but IFC recruitment has only been deferred since around 1997.

If deferred, when was it held?
Early January, the first week of winter semester classes.

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?
No. This is my first year as an active during recruitment.

Does your GLO openly support one or the other?
I'm not sure about nationals, but I know my chapter would definately be in favor of deferred rush. Due to the high level of Greek participation at W&L, no one would even get to know their freshmen class if it weren't for the dining hall and deferred rush. Deferred rush makes everything a lot less cliquish. Also, I was intimidated and prejudiced against Greeks and wouldn't have rushed if I hadn't gotten to know Greek women casually before rush.

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?
Some people have suggested sophomore rush, but I'm really opposed to that. I think deferred rush is the best solution. It allows students to adjust to classes and get a GPA before recruitment, and meet their entire class.

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
At my school, numbers are strong regardless. Many people come to W&L just because of the strong Greek system. I can see where it would be a big issue at other schools, but I think at my school, it actually helps pull in people who might not have known about it anyway (like me!).

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall?
As stated above, I would have been far too intimidated...

What school did you attend?
University of Michigan- Ann Arbor

How many students?
37,000 undergraduates

How many GLO's? (local and national)?
1997-2001 (my years): 25 sororities and 45 fraternities total
Now: About 27 sororities and 38 fraternities total

Chapter total?
100+ about for sororities. fraternities have no limit.

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?
Early fall

Does your GLO openly support one or the other?
I don't think that we supported one over the other, but definately liked/preferred Winter/Informal Recruitment b/c its more relaxed.

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?
I have always been a fan of fraternity recruitment and don't see why sororities can't have it that way. At UM they recruit for 5 days. The men get to pick what houses they want to go to and can get bids from more than one. They just go to the random parties the guys have in a relaxed atmosphere. I think it would work at my alma mater for sororities just as well. Many of us wanted it.

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
Not really. We get alot of girls whether its Formal, Informal or COB. Normally for Fall its 900+ girls going through to all 16 or how many ever houses there are at that time. For Informal usually only 2-4 houses do it (whoever did not meet quota/friend's rush) and you have about 300+ girls going through. Not sure on COB numbers.

*Opinion on Early or Deferred Recruitment Overall?*
I personally, don't see anything wrong with either really. I have seen both work at different schools among my friends. However, I think that when you tend to have a big school with a strong system, maybe deferment for a semester isn't such a bad thing. I waited, but for those who didnt at UM I have seen that when they went thru as freshman from the start, they ended up only knowing the system. Meaning that they had no life outside of it. All their friends were Greek, they only hung at Greek places, scheduled themselves in "Greek" classes (these are classes that like everyone in the Greek system seem to take at the same time), and went to Greek events. I think if you wait a little it gives new students a better chance to get aquainted with their school and campus. They have friends and other activities, besides Greek ones. They aren't secluded.

[maggieaxid]

School- Elon College (now Elon University)

How many Students- about 4,000 undergrad. A mix of 60% female, 40% male.

How many GLO's- 7 NPC sororities, 3 NPHC Sororities, 5 IFC fraternities, 2 local fraternities, 1 Christian-Only Sorority (not recognized)

Chapter total- chapter total, whats that?? I think its like 55, but all of out orgs. ranged in size.

When was recruitment- last week of january/first week of february...considered defered rush. We have that week off from school in between winter term and spring term.

Do we support one another- Of course we do! But, i don't think I totally get this question.

Do you think a different style of recruitment would work better- Since I have never been through a fall recruitment, I don't understand how you can possibly plan all the details of rush while on summer break and deal with all the moving in- new school year stuff. However, we have/ had a huge dirty rushing problem because of it being deferred. I think that insted of all the hoopla, sororities should be able to hold rush like the fraternities do.

Do you think timing affects numbers- yes, I think having it deferred increases the numbers of those who go through because PNMs have met sorority women, and have seen sorority women being very active and visable.

Did you serve as a Rho Chi- yes, and it was the best time!!

I probably wouldn't have went through rush if it was in the fall. I didn't know too much about it when I got there and first semester allowed me to learn all about it.

[FuzzieAlum]

Just to clarify:
"Does your GLO openly support one or the other?" does not mean, "Are you supportive of the other chapters?" It means, "Does your sorority/chapter actively campaign to make rush immediate or deferred?"

[shadokat]

What school did you attend? Bloomsburg University of PA

How many students? about 7,000 undergrad

How many GLO's? (local and national)? 5 NPC Sororities (D Phi E, ASA, AST, Tri Sig, Phi Sig)

Chapter total? 60

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred? deferred

If deferred, when was it held? You had to be a sophomore to rush when I went through. So it was first semester sophomore year, in the fall. Now, it's 2nd semester freshmen, so it's in the spring

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma? no

If so, did it color your thoughts on when Recruitment was held?

Does your GLO openly support one or the other? not that I know of...we support what NPC does.

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school? No, 2nd semester freshmen deferred works. It allows students to get acclimated to the college experience, settle into the college environment, and make some decisions about where they may like to get involved in their spare time. If Greek is where they want to go, they will wait.

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
No, our numbers are ALWAYS low. The Greek system has a hideous reputation, not all of it undeserved.

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall? No, I had no idea about Greek Life or a sorority before I went to college. They were something in the movies or on TV. Having that year to see what it was all about first was better for me. That isn't to say it is the same other places.

Personally, I think it all depends on the school and what role being Greek plays in the University. If you need to be greek to have a good social life or for standing, then by all means, do it right away. But having some time to think about it, before you jump in, is always a good idea. I would think that some women go to college having this image of love and flowers about a sorority, but when they are actually involved, they realize it's a lot of work as well, and may not be all the fun they thought. Allowing for extra time provides for reflection on the commitment you're willing to give.

[/B][/QUOTE]

[pinkyphimu]

What school did you attend? Muhlenberg College

How many students? 1700ish

How many GLO's? (local and national)? 4 NPC
Chapter total? 80

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred? deferred to fall sophomore year

If deferred, when was it held? it used to be the second semester of freshmen year. the year i rushed, our campus moved to sophomore deferment. unfortunately, numbers dropped. and have continued to drop.

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma? no

If so, did it color your thoughts on when Recruitment was held?

Does your GLO openly support one or the other? not that I know of

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school? yes. numbers dropped after the change. they have never recovered. girls don't go through rush with that open mind we are always talking about because they know all of the women in the chapters. they have heard rumors (true or false, they heard them) and it is the biggest joke ever!

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
no. i do think that sophomore deferment really lowers the interest tho. so many people i know were like, why do i need to be greek, i have already made lots of friends. and i think that for some people having rush before the school year begins is too much. i think the winter term is right in the middle and would get the most people on my campus.

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall? No, i didn't want to be in one until the summer btwn 1st and 2nd year. i met some girls that i really liked and i wanted to get involved. and i would not have joined at all unless i had met these ladies bc all of the other chapters openly hazed.
there are other people i believe would have went through if they were able to earlier. it just depends on the person i guess!

[33girl]

What school did you attend?
Clarion University of PA

How many students?
Approx. 6000

How many GLO's? (local and national)?
At the time, 7 sororities (6 NPC, 1 local), 10 fraternities (8 NIC, 2 local), and 5 little sister groups

Chapter total?
Sorority total=50
Fraternity total=anywhere from 10 to 60

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?
Deferred - women had to wait till they were second semester freshmen. Men could rush first semester, and little sisters (we still had those) could also rush first semester.

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?
No

Does your GLO openly support one or the other?
To be honest, we got so many women through COB that I don't think we really gave a crap.

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?
First semester freshmen women are now allowed to rush. From what I have seen/heard I don't think it has helped increase numbers.

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?
I think that with deferred, women got over the idea of wanting the "flashiest" sororities and realized those might not be the best choices for them. On the other hand, numbers are down for the guys too and nothing has changed for them, so I don't know if it's the timing or just the general mood of the campus.

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall?
No way. I barely knew my ear from my elbow at that point in my life, and as I'm the first person in my family to go Greek, I would have had no guidance or clue as to what it was about. If I had rushed first sem. I doubt I would have gotten a bid anywhere. I'm not against first semester freshmen rushing, since many of them are ready willing & able, but I AM against a situation where if someone like me comes in they have little to no chance of receiving a bid. Early fall/first semester rush should be an option for those who are comfy with it, but those who don't want to jump in right away shouldn't be penalized.

[lionlove]

What school did you attend?

Muhlenberg College (a few years after pinkeyphimu and things have changed)

How many students?

2000 undergrad, 0 grad

How many GLO's? (local and national)?

4 national sororities, 4 national fraternities plus APO and Theta Nu Xi

Chapter total?

not sure about the guys but 75 for the women

Was your recruitment early fall or deferred?

deferred

If deferred, when was it held?

fall of sophmore year

Ladies, did you ever serve as a Rho Chi/Rho Gamma?

yup

If so, did it color your thoughts on when Recruitment was held?

not really, we've had deffered rush here for long enough that the numbers have stayed constant for the past few years. This year overall though was disappointing as there were alot more drop outs early in the week that caused quota to be lower overall. That was a fluke that happened this year though and not because of deferred rush but for other reasons.

Does your GLO openly support one or the other?

not that I know of.

Do you think a different style of Recruitment would work better at your school?

Maybe...the rushees at my school have pretty much decided where they want to go by the time they rush and maybe an earlier rush would take away the stereotypes.

Do you think numbers are affected by the timing of Recruitment?

apparently our numbers dropped when we switched to deferred rush but I don't think switching back to early rush at this point will increase numbers.

For those that went through deferred, would you have gone through early fall?

I don't know, it didn't even enter my mind because I entered because I knew there was deferred rush.