I don't care if I offend you, Greek & PNMs- Listen Up!

[CloseMinded]

Have you ever thought about how close minded you all sound on this forum? I have a message for both my fellow Greeks and for PNMs which might (probably) will offend many of you, but I think it needs to be said.


It’s almost a daily occurrence a young woman will come to this forum asking questions about standing out at recruitment and getting replies about how she should just give up on Greek Life because she screwed up and there are no second chances in life. These young women come to this forum because they are actively seeking help because they want to join an organization to meet people, make friends and have a positive experience in college. No one would seek out an organization with the mind set, “I want this experience to ruin the best year of my life for me. I want to ruin the lives of hundreds of girls in my (soon-to-be) chapter by creating a bad name for the organization”. They see the embellishments of Greek Life like lettered shirts, big/little baskets, parties, etc before they join, but what keeps them around are the real meanings behind being in a sorority; the friendships, experiences, accomplishments. Deep down, whether they realize it or not, that is what they really want when they say they want to affiliate. Why else would they put themselves through hours of recruitment parties in uncomfortable shoes making small talk with girls they have never met before with the potential of getting rejected even though they are doing all they can to fit in? They want to belong! They want a community and they want to be a part of something bigger then themselves.

I dropped out of formal recruitment my freshmen year because I was closed minded and only wanted the house that reminded me of Legally Blonde never giving the other organizations on campus a chance. Do I regret it? Yes and no. Does dropping out of recruitment/new member period hurt your chances of ever joining another chapter? Absolutely! But is that entirely the fault of the closed minded PNMs or is it also our fault? I was one of the lucky few who dropped out of recruitment and a few years later (not long before my graduation) found my home in Greek Life. For me, it was a growing up process that needed to occur before I achieved my letters. I needed to realize what Greek Life is all about before I joined. It gave me an eye opening experience from both perspectives. I would be willing to bet 90% of you joined within the first 2 years of entering college or at the first opportunity you had to join. When you have always been on one side of the story, you never understand or appreciate the other side. You will never understand the longing to be a part of the community that occurs for students who make that decision to leave recruitment/new member process. Most of you will even take your letters for granted compared to members like myself who have experienced that longing and was finally granted the opportunity to affiliate. The legacy you leave at your campus will be defined by each of your actions. Leave a legacy of being a positive influence on others. You don’t want someone else to remember you (or your organization) for being “that girl” to them who rejects and is as closed minded as you describe these PNMs.
Does this mean I condone someone going into recruitment with a closed mind? Absolutely not! What I am asking of my fellow Greeks is to rise above that standard and realize people do change. Look at yourself, are you the same person you were when you joined your organization? Probably not! Give these members a second chance because more times than not, they will be more loyal to your organization than some of the girls in your own class. Give them advice on this forum or in person if you know them. Show them what Greek Life really means. I was fortunate to have a young woman in Greek Life on my campus show me that the letters on your shirts don’t matter, the crafts in your basket won’t last forever and that the petty drama you see so often between girls or organizations will change in the blink of an eye. She helped me realize that Greek Life was about challenging yourself to reach your dreams, to help others along the way, to make a positive difference in the world and to leave your chapter in a better position than how you joined it. If each of us challenged each other to do as she did for me, not only would the Greek community be stronger and gain so many valuable PNMs but it would live up to the dreams the founders of ALL our organizations dreamed and it would break down the negative images society has of us.

What I am asking PNMs is what many have said before me; go into recruitment with an open mind. If you accept a bid and are considering dropping, think for a minute. Will this matter a year from now? Five years from now? Fifty years from now? I’m joining an organization for life. Is the color fabric for the letters going to make a difference when I’m in the nursing home telling someone the stories of my college experience? Remember when you join a chapter, you are only meeting a tiny fraction of the thousands of women who came before you, who currently are active around the world and who will come after you.

Give each other a chance because at the end of the day we all want the same thing and that’s to be happy.

[33girl]

What the fuck?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by CloseMinded

Have you ever thought about how close minded you all sound on this forum? I have a message for both my fellow Greeks and for PNMs which might (probably) will offend many of you, but I think it needs to be said.


It’s almost a daily occurrence a young woman will come to this forum asking questions about standing out at recruitment and getting replies about how she should just give up on Greek Life because she screwed up and there are no second chances in life. These young women come to this forum because they are actively seeking help because they want to join an organization to meet people, make friends and have a positive experience in college. No one would seek out an organization with the mind set, “I want this experience to ruin the best year of my life for me. I want to ruin the lives of hundreds of girls in my (soon-to-be) chapter by creating a bad name for the organization”. They see the embellishments of Greek Life like lettered shirts, big/little baskets, parties, etc before they join, but what keeps them around are the real meanings behind being in a sorority; the friendships, experiences, accomplishments. Deep down, whether they realize it or not, that is what they really want when they say they want to affiliate. Why else would they put themselves through hours of recruitment parties in uncomfortable shoes making small talk with girls they have never met before with the potential of getting rejected even though they are doing all they can to fit in? They want to belong! They want a community and they want to be a part of something bigger then themselves.

I dropped out of formal recruitment my freshmen year because I was closed minded and only wanted the house that reminded me of Legally Blonde never giving the other organizations on campus a chance. Do I regret it? Yes and no. Does dropping out of recruitment/new member period hurt your chances of ever joining another chapter? Absolutely! But is that entirely the fault of the closed minded PNMs or is it also our fault? I was one of the lucky few who dropped out of recruitment and a few years later (not long before my graduation) found my home in Greek Life. For me, it was a growing up process that needed to occur before I achieved my letters. I needed to realize what Greek Life is all about before I joined. It gave me an eye opening experience from both perspectives. I would be willing to bet 90% of you joined within the first 2 years of entering college or at the first opportunity you had to join. When you have always been on one side of the story, you never understand or appreciate the other side. You will never understand the longing to be a part of the community that occurs for students who make that decision to leave recruitment/new member process. Most of you will even take your letters for granted compared to members like myself who have experienced that longing and was finally granted the opportunity to affiliate. The legacy you leave at your campus will be defined by each of your actions. Leave a legacy of being a positive influence on others. You don’t want someone else to remember you (or your organization) for being “that girl” to them who rejects and is as closed minded as you describe these PNMs.
Does this mean I condone someone going into recruitment with a closed mind? Absolutely not! What I am asking of my fellow Greeks is to rise above that standard and realize people do change. Look at yourself, are you the same person you were when you joined your organization? Probably not! Give these members a second chance because more times than not, they will be more loyal to your organization than some of the girls in your own class. Give them advice on this forum or in person if you know them. Show them what Greek Life really means. I was fortunate to have a young woman in Greek Life on my campus show me that the letters on your shirts don’t matter, the crafts in your basket won’t last forever and that the petty drama you see so often between girls or organizations will change in the blink of an eye. She helped me realize that Greek Life was about challenging yourself to reach your dreams, to help others along the way, to make a positive difference in the world and to leave your chapter in a better position than how you joined it. If each of us challenged each other to do as she did for me, not only would the Greek community be stronger and gain so many valuable PNMs but it would live up to the dreams the founders of ALL our organizations dreamed and it would break down the negative images society has of us.

What I am asking PNMs is what many have said before me; go into recruitment with an open mind. If you accept a bid and are considering dropping, think for a minute. Will this matter a year from now? Five years from now? Fifty years from now? I’m joining an organization for life. Is the color fabric for the letters going to make a difference when I’m in the nursing home telling someone the stories of my college experience? Remember when you join a chapter, you are only meeting a tiny fraction of the thousands of women who came before you, who currently are active around the world and who will come after you.

Give each other a chance because at the end of the day we all want the same thing and that’s to be happy.

QFP. Whose anticlimactic troll or sockpuppet is this?

[princessamy]

None of this made any sense. Does she have a Spark Notes version?

[hae413]

Originally Posted by princessamy

None of this made any sense. Does she have a Spark Notes version?

I second this. I actually want to understand it, but...

[ASTalumna06]

This somehow morphed from "You Greeks are mean!" into "PNMs need to keep an open mind"...

I'm confused as to who should be "offended".. I highly doubt that anyone is bothered by this at all. Confused, maybe. Offended, no.

[DubaiSis]

blah blah blah I'm right and you're wrong blah blah blah

[APhi4Ever]

My head hurts...

[CloseMinded]

I’m not saying Greeks are mean. I’m saying for BOTH sides to keep an open mind. These girls want to join and so many are afraid of not getting bids they reach out to us and ask for advice. What they get in return is negative replies of “PNMs never learn. There are no second chances” type attitude. Look from their perspective. They know they “messed up” or are at least facing an uphill battle in getting a bid under these circumstances and now we are being as closed minded to them as they were to the organizations originally. But if you look all over this board you see Greeks telling PNMs to keep an open mind without telling each other to do the same! It’s a double standard that needs to be stopped. We have a chance to give them the impression of Greek Life which is positive and rewarding for all parties involved and welcome them into our community or we can push them away, discourage them and tell the world we think we’re better than everyone else and don’t hold ourselves to the same standards we hold others.

I'm not saying either side is right or wrong. What I am saying is proven in the replies I have received from this. Your holding a negative attitude towards people who are trying to better the community because you think you have all of the right answers. I'm not saying every girl will fit at every (or any even) organization on their campus. I'm saying give them as much of a chance at joining your organization as you would for someone who has never been through the process before!

The title was to get people’s attention more than anything. I wasn’t offending anyone, but if no one reads the post the same attitude is going to discourage more PNMs from joining the recruitment process and those girls who are discouraged could have been your “future bridesmaids” if you gave them the chance.

[Greek_or_Geek?]

How nice for you that you attended a forgiving school where re-rushing and junior/senior year pledges were welcomed.

The PNMs who ask these kinds of questions are going to Bamaolemissugatexasufarizonaauburnuscdidimissanyof thebigones? They inevitably set their sights on the "best" chapters and have nearly insurmountable handicaps. Those women need to know the truth and be as prepared as possible going in. I don't think I've ever seen anyone tell a PNM not to have an open mind. Your little diatribe is pointless.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by CloseMinded

I’m not saying Greeks are mean. I’m saying for BOTH sides to keep an open mind. These girls want to join and so many are afraid of not getting bids they reach out to us and ask for advice. What they get in return is negative replies of “PNMs never learn. There are no second chances” type attitude. Look from their perspective. They know they “messed up” or are at least facing an uphill battle in getting a bid under these circumstances and now we are being as closed minded to them as they were to the organizations originally. But if you look all over this board you see Greeks telling PNMs to keep an open mind without telling each other to do the same! It’s a double standard that needs to be stopped. We have a chance to give them the impression of Greek Life which is positive and rewarding for all parties involved and welcome them into our community or we can push them away, discourage them and tell the world we think we’re better than everyone else and don’t hold ourselves to the same standards we hold others.

I'm not saying either side is right or wrong. What I am saying is proven in the replies I have received from this. Your holding a negative attitude towards people who are trying to better the community because you think you have all of the right answers. I'm not saying every girl will fit at every (or any even) organization on their campus. I'm saying give them as much of a chance at joining your organization as you would for someone who has never been through the process before!

The title was to get people’s attention more than anything. I wasn’t offending anyone, but if no one reads the post the same attitude is going to discourage more PNMs from joining the recruitment process and those girls who are discouraged could have been your “future bridesmaids” if you gave them the chance.

We're not mean.. We're honest. The truth hurts sometimes. Second chances sometimes aren't a possibility.

If a PNM can't handle the truth (much like Tom Cruise), that's her issue that she has to deal with.

[knight_shadow]

[victoriana]

When I saw the title of this thread, I thought the trainwreck express was leaving the station. Now I'm just disappointed.

[Leslie Anne]

Originally Posted by CloseMinded

I’m not saying Greeks are mean. I’m saying for BOTH sides to keep an open mind. These girls want to join and so many are afraid of not getting bids they reach out to us and ask for advice. What they get in return is negative replies of “PNMs never learn. There are no second chances” type attitude. Look from their perspective. They know they “messed up” or are at least facing an uphill battle in getting a bid under these circumstances and now we are being as closed minded to them as they were to the organizations originally. But if you look all over this board you see Greeks telling PNMs to keep an open mind without telling each other to do the same! It’s a double standard that needs to be stopped. We have a chance to give them the impression of Greek Life which is positive and rewarding for all parties involved and welcome them into our community or we can push them away, discourage them and tell the world we think we’re better than everyone else and don’t hold ourselves to the same standards we hold others.

I'm not saying either side is right or wrong. What I am saying is proven in the replies I have received from this. Your holding a negative attitude towards people who are trying to better the community because you think you have all of the right answers. I'm not saying every girl will fit at every (or any even) organization on their campus. I'm saying give them as much of a chance at joining your organization as you would for someone who has never been through the process before!

The title was to get people’s attention more than anything. I wasn’t offending anyone, but if no one reads the post the same attitude is going to discourage more PNMs from joining the recruitment process and those girls who are discouraged could have been your “future bridesmaids” if you gave them the chance.

I just read this 3 times and I still have no idea what on earth your point is.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by shirley1929

Here's my deal...she did EXACTLY what most of the posters on GC would ask of her. She went through the whole process and gave it a shot. She went to the pref party she wasn't sure of, she went to bid day when she wasn't thrilled and she gave her pledge class a go at it. She didn't feel it, so she didn't take the vows that we each hold so dear of our organizations.

I don't know her, but I personally don't fault her. I would write the rec, and if it was a glowing one before...it would be the same now (unless her grades changed or something else). Would I mention it in my rec? Not sure. You didn't say how she'd treated her ex-pledge sisters (and you probably don't know) but was she running around the dorm trashing XYZ after she de-pledged, or did she do so gracefully? Those are the types of things I would be concerned about.

I'm sure there are those who don't agree with me, but if she's handled herself with grace and like an adult, I would have no problem writing the rec again.

shirley1929ity?